Baker not the only name on the list....

[top dawg]

29 minutes ago, Verge said:

The other names are Jimmy G and Minshew. I am sure we have called about Kyler too, I just have no idea what that situation is.

If we ultimately obtain Minshew, I will be shaking my head. I came to the conclusion that Minshew should be our target a year ago based upon Panthers Wire (who obviously put the thought out there). There were a few others in agreement of course. If we could see it, then why not the Panthers FO? We would be in so much of a better place today if we had gone the route of acquiring Minshew as a UFA, as opposed to getting fleeced by the Jets. Not saying that Minshew is the answer to anyone's prayers, that's not what this is all about, but he would've been at the very least the perfect bridge QB that you lose relatively little on by taking a swing. 

Now, if we give up any appreciable draft capital to acquire him, or acquire him at all, I just won't know how to take it. I'm sure I'll have a certain amount of relief--like it was all a bad nightmare that could have been avoided that's now over--but there are repercussions regardless. Irony...regardless.

[top dawg]

14 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I don't at all buy into this line of thinking. Games aren't played on the draft pick value chart. At the end of the day, the only thing that really matters is the quality of roster you field and your W-L record.

Even if what you say is true from an overarching perspective , the ability to separate and appreciate the player from the draft pick is kind of what analytical thinking is all about in regards to draft value discussions.

I'd add, that the draft is in some sense about the number of horses you have in the race, and obtaining the best positions which to jockey from. The better positions that you can jockey from, the more you might be able to win (in this case, hit the target).

Edited April 17, 2022 by top dawg

[LinvilleGorge]

31 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Even if what you say is true from an overarching perspective , the ability to separate and appreciate the player from the draft pick is kind of what analytical thinking is all about in regards to draft value discussions.

I'd add, that the draft is in some sense about the number of horses you have in the race, and obtaining the best positions which to jockey from. The better positions that you can jockey from, the more you might be able to win (in this case, hit the target).

It's about acquiring players to build a roster. That's all that matters. That's what the GM is judged on. After the draft and when the players hit the field no one cares anymore if he "won" or "lost" the trade. We're about to find out for real, not crunch numbers on paper using an arbitrary value chart.

[Raleigh PF]

1 hour ago, Verge said:

The other names are Jimmy G and Minshew. I am sure we have called about Kyler too, I just have no idea what that situation is.

Can't see the logic in the Cardinals doing any trade involving Murray. To do so would be to completely punt the upcoming season. It'd take a helluva haul for that to happen.

[LinvilleGorge]

48 minutes ago, Verge said:

You cannot dictate what moves you make based on your wide receivers instagram posts 

I'd be okay with letting it dictate us parting ways with Robby. When you play as poorly as he did last year you really need to have the awareness that you have zero weight to throw around within the organization.

[Icege]

Minshew or Fitzmagic would be amazing for the memes

Edited April 17, 2022 by Icege

[Lurk21]

42 minutes ago, Raleigh PF said:

Can't see the logic in the Cardinals doing any trade involving Murray. To do so would be to completely punt the upcoming season. It'd take a helluva haul for that to happen.

The only logical idea I'd see is if Kingsbury  signs off on Baker.... 

[top dawg]

22 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

It's about acquiring players to build a roster. That's all that matters. That's what the GM is judged on. After the draft and when the players hit the field no one cares anymore if he "won" or "lost" the trade. We're about to find out for real, not crunch numbers on paper using an arbitrary value chart.

Oh, now the chart is "arbitrary"...Chart aside, there are opportunity costs associated with each pick. That's the truth. Historically, GMs don't do all that great; a couple of quality starters from the draft, and you're worth your weight in gold. If you can do better than that, it's gravy. 

Unfortunately I can't say for sure if we'll be able to get away from paper analysis unless Rhule gets the hell out of the way. He's dampening our ability to see Fitterer and the quality of his picks for what they really are. I do have reason to believe that he will due to the acquisition of actual experienced NFL coaches. If Rhule has learned that lesson however, I suspect for guys like BC, Tremble, and even Thomas and Hubbard to step up. TMJ, still very talented, is almost a lock to flash provied that he's overcome his injury woes and is not "bench-beaten" by Rhule as well. 

As for this draft, I only expect one quality player anyway with so little draft capital.  In any event, I'm not giving up.

 

[shaq]

I feel like I’m one of the only ones here who would love to get Kyler. He’s only 24 with a continually rising passing rating. He’s got ELITE arm talent and is a top 5 running qb easy. 

[LinvilleGorge]

1 hour ago, top dawg said:

If we ultimately obtain Minshew, I will be shaking my head. I came to the conclusion that Minshew should be our target a year ago based upon Panthers Wire (who obviously put the thought out there). There were a few others in agreement of course. If we could see it, then why not the Panthers FO? We would be in so much of a better place today if we had gone the route of acquiring Minshew as a UFA, as opposed to getting fleeced by the Jets. Not saying that Minshew is the answer to anyone's prayers, that's not what this is all about, but he would've been at the very least the perfect bridge QB that you lose relatively little on by taking a swing. 

Now, if we give up any appreciable draft capital to acquire him, or acquire him at all, I just won't know how to take it. I'm sure I'll have a certain amount of relief--like it was all a bad nightmare that could have been avoided that's now over--but there are repercussions regardless. Irony...regardless.

Because these fools are looking for the legit long-term answer on the scrap heap instead of realizing all you're likely to find is a stop gap option at best while you shop for the long-term answer in the draft. Stop gaps just keep you from feeling forced to make a desperate move but this crew is hell-bent on desperation.

[top dawg]

4 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

...but this crew is hell-bent on desperation.

I most assuredly believe that we'll see if you're correct at some point within these next two weeks. 

[The NFL Shield At Midfield]

19 minutes ago, shaq said:

I feel like I’m one of the only ones here who would love to get Kyler. He’s only 24 with a continually rising passing rating. He’s got ELITE arm talent and is a top 5 running qb easy. 

He's got Vick like athleticism with a better grasp of the passing game.  I wouldn't cry if he was a Panther when the dust settled.

[LinvilleGorge]

26 minutes ago, top dawg said:

Oh, now the chart is "arbitrary"...Chart aside, there are opportunity costs associated with each pick. That's the truth. Historically, GMs don't do all that great; a couple of quality starters from the draft, and you're worth your weight in gold. If you can do better than that, it's gravy. 

Unfortunately I can't say for sure if we'll be able to get away from paper analysis unless Rhule gets the hell out of the way. He's dampening our ability to see Fitterer and the quality of his picks for what they really are. I do have reason to believe that he will due to the acquisition of actual experienced NFL coaches. If Rhule has learned that lesson however, I suspect for guys like BC, Tremble, and even Thomas and Hubbard to step up. TMJ, still very talented, is almost a lock to flash provied that he's overcome his injury woes and is not "bench-beaten" by Rhule as well. 

As for this draft, I only expect one quality player anyway with so little draft capital.  In any event, I'm not giving up.

 

Yeah, the draft pick value chart is literally arbitrary.

[Mr. Scot]

3 hours ago, Verge said:

You cannot dictate what moves you make based on your wide receivers instagram posts 

Or anyone else's.

That said, this is a team that had to make changes at the quarterback position in part because the owner shot his mouth off.