Big WR

[kungfoodude]

12 minutes ago, micnificent28 said:

Agreed. But when is the last time we had a big rezone target? i mean even olsen is on the smaller finesse side of tight ends.

6-5, 255?

I don't know what world that is considered small.

[GoobyPls]

I hate end zone fade routes, unless you have some Calvin Johnson type monster their success rate is low.

[CarolinaRideorDie]

Playing "big" is an attitude, yeah physical measurements help but how many times have Steve Smith come down with the ball in 1v1 situations. If you want it, go get it! Kelvin Benjamin was huge but played small. 

[micnificent28]

27 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

6-5, 255?

I don't know what world that is considered small.

Olsen didnt play very big. you rarely saw him just jump up and win a jump ball. If he got touched he was going down on first contact. he was really finesse like in his play. Robbie Anderson was the same way he played a small game even tho he was 6'3 DJ Moore played bigger than Anderson.

[kungfoodude]

13 minutes ago, micnificent28 said:

Olsen didnt play very big. you rarely saw him just jump up and win a jump ball. If he got touched he was going down on first contact. he was really finesse like in his play. Robbie Anderson was the same way he played a small game even tho he was 6'3 DJ Moore played bigger than Anderson.

You are just generally moving the goalposts on what you think we don't have. Olsen was very obviously the kind of red zone receiving threat we relied on(same with Shockey, Walls, etc) at that position. Sometimes because we didn't have reliable red zone WR's.

I am not gonna get caught up on the idea of throwing jump balls or fades. If you have quality threats, you can scheme them open. You don't need these old possession/jump ball end zone threats from the bygone era. Especially when you have even bigger and more athletic LB's and DB's that are more suited to defending that stuff.

 

[micnificent28]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

You are just generally moving the goalposts on what you think we don't have. Olsen was very obviously the kind of red zone receiving threat we relied on(same with Shockey, Walls, etc) at that position. Sometimes because we didn't have reliable red zone WR's.

I am not gonna get caught up on the idea of throwing jump balls or fades. If you have quality threats, you can scheme them open. You don't need these old possession/jump ball end zone threats from the bygone era. Especially when you have even bigger and more athletic LB's and DB's that are more suited to defending that stuff.

 

not trying to move the goal post just pain the picture on what type of player olsen was. And yes when you think big WR or TE you think throwing fades and jump balls. thats another part of the game we judt dont have. if you mean just a redzone target you scheme open like you do then Moore can do that. just picks and route running. what i mean is above 6'4 big body muscle a guy out the way allen Robinson gronk aj brown that sort of thing.

[kungfoodude]

26 minutes ago, micnificent28 said:

not trying to move the goal post just pain the picture on what type of player olsen was. And yes when you think big WR or TE you think throwing fades and jump balls. thats another part of the game we judt dont have. if you mean just a redzone target you scheme open like you do then Moore can do that. just picks and route running. what i mean is above 6'4 big body muscle a guy out the way allen Robinson gronk aj brown that sort of thing.

Yeah but just hat on a hat "beat him" is less effective than actually scheming people open and running effective plays. Like I said, that is old school stuff.

It's fine if you have a Calvin Johnson, Randy Moss, Jimmy Graham, etc. It works a lot less effectively if you don't have an elite guy like that. 

That's trying to attempt to take the hard way out of a situation.

[micnificent28]

23 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah but just hat on a hat "beat him" is less effective than actually scheming people open and running effective plays. Like I said, that is old school stuff.

It's fine if you have a Calvin Johnson, Randy Moss, Jimmy Graham, etc. It works a lot less effectively if you don't have an elite guy like that. 

That's trying to attempt to take the hard way out of a situation.

im not saying this should be your only way of beatinf an opponent. im saying having the threat of it or even having this as an option should be on every team i think. the more you can give the opposition to think about the better. i feel the same way about having a dual threat qb. the more you can do...

[stratocatter]

8 hours ago, philw5289 said:

With the rules favoring the offense so much the receiver position is getting smaller. More and more receivers 6’0” and under fast and speedy are getting drafted and used more 

Seems it is always a cyclic evolution. This small trend counters the long tall corners brought in to counter the big WR guys. Someone will counter that and so on…. 
Somehow you have to get on the right side of those trends. A balancing act.

[1of10Charnatives]

On 10/30/2022 at 9:23 PM, Cdparr7 said:

When is the last time we had a “Big WR”. I watched those fade passes to Terrace Marshall and scratched my head. He is the tallest WR on the roster at 6’2”. 
 

We have Preston Williams on the practice squad at 6’5”. Tommy and Ian are 6’3” but we really don’t have a “Big WR”.

Here is the fundamental issue I take with asking questions like this:

If playoff winning teams don't have a pronounced tendency to have big WR's on the roster vs the rest of the league, I find the notion that they contribute to winning when it counts tenous at best. As a fan who wants to win, I think we should be looking at SB winners and conference championship participants and asking what these teams seem to have more or better of than the rest of the league.

Fantasy football imo has led to an overemphasis by fans on WR's and RB's because they generate fantasy points and thus garner attention. This creates a false perception of how important they are to winning football. It is a passing league, and you need solid play from your receivers to win, but like running back, I believe the evidence that having big or elite WR play leads to playoff success is scant on the ground. QB play, OL play, pass rushing and secondary play are the position groups that both matter to winning, and where true talent is rare.

Does having big WR's have it's obvious advantages? Of course.

Do these advantages correlate to a high degree with playoff wins? Doubtful.

[UpstatePantherfan]

I have to admit, if we win enough games and fall to the top 10 or 12, I would love to nab Quinten Johnston in the 1st as a consolation prize for missing out on Stroud/Young. Easily the top WR in this draft and he’s a 6’4, 4.40 40 time WR. Would be the perfect compliment to DJ Moore and make us unstoppable on offense

[Stingray3030]

20 hours ago, Ghostface Chilla said:

We should trade Atlanta for rookie WR Drake London. He was a phenom at USC and has hands for sure. Atlanta doesn't target him too often, but he will be a #1 soon. We should snatch him up before that happens on another team, especially a rival of ours!

There is zero chance Atlanta is interested in this - he is literally their #1 target and it isn't close... 

[Stingray3030]

People - cmon - how many times are y'all gonna keep saying "we need to upgrade our TE" - "get taller receivers" - that is just trying to fix symptoms of the real problem.  You don't win Superbowls with TE's and WR's....you win them with Defense, OLine, and QB play....period.  We haven't had a MLB defensive captain since Luke.  We haven't had a good OLine since 2011.  We haven't had a consistent, top tier QB dang near ever.  We had Steve Smith, Greg Olsen, DJ Moore, CMC and never consistently saw the playoffs...Give me a top 10 QB, top 10 OLine, or a top 10 MLB or stop making excuses....we have spent the last 12 years focused on the wrong things.  Go look at the teams who are consistently in the playoffs and they all have at least 2 of those 3 things.

[SetfreexX]

TMJ has plenty of height / athleticism for a RZ fade -- 6'2'' to 6'3'' is more than enough. 

What are we doing in this thread....

We used to throw them to Smith at 5'9'', the fade is about timing, and high-pointing the ball, not ''strictly'' height, height just helps.