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Dan Graziano: People in the league believe Panthers drafting CJ Stroud

TheSpecialJuan

By TheSpecialJuan,
in Carolina Panthers

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CPcavedweller Veteran

CPcavedweller

Posted
Posted
9 hours ago, rayzor said:

i think you are probably right on the source of the info, but i'm not totally seeing what you are on Bryce. i think he'll be really stinking good.

I just think you're gambling by taking a 5'10, 185 lb QB. I know he got up to 204 for the Combine but he didn't weigh in at his Pro Day and ordered Scallops and Salad, not exactly the order of someone trying to maintain muscle mass. Hell, I'm 5'10 170 and I've been next to NFL offensive linemen...just a huge difference even between the SEC and NFL.

I just think that when you go number one, you need to be as sure as possible and you're praying for an anomaly if you take Young. Doesn't have any elite traits throwing the ball or in his athleticism and at his size I really, really think that you need one or the other.

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Shocker Grand Master

Shocker

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Posted (edited)

I think Young is the better player but it is close.  CJ does stick in the pocket a little more than Young.  Size is definitely a consideration especially when Young’s game is predicated on moving around and improvising with which he is an absolutely a magician but can he consistently get away with that in the NFL?  Questionable.  Having a CJ Stroud day today.  IMO, Bryce played against top defensive talent more and dominated but Stroud is so fuggin accurate and is clearly still improving.  
 

If you look at flat stats Stroud was incredible.  Damn this is a tough decision for me.  

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Jackie Lee Grand Master

Jackie Lee

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11 minutes ago, CPcavedweller said:

I just think you're gambling by taking a 5'10, 185 lb QB. I know he got up to 204 for the Combine but he didn't weigh in at his Pro Day and ordered Scallops and Salad, not exactly the order of someone trying to maintain muscle mass. Hell, I'm 5'10 170 and I've been next to NFL offensive linemen...just a huge difference even between the SEC and NFL.

I just think that when you go number one, you need to be as sure as possible and you're praying for an anomaly if you take Young. Doesn't have any elite traits throwing the ball or in his athleticism and at his size I really, really think that you need one or the other.

With Bryce you really have to commit to the Brees/Saints era philosophy of stacking the O-line/Receivers, and even then I don't think Bryce has a prime Brees arm. He's also at least 2" shorter and 10 pounds lighter. I"m not going to watch all his game film but did Bryce even take a snap under center at Bama? I don't know if he can even run play action under center in the NFL because he usually likes a shotgun snap and then another 3 yard drop just to get his throwing lanes open/room to get the ball over D-line hands

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

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7 minutes ago, Shocker said:

I think Young is the better player but it is close.  CJ does stick in the pocket a little more than Young.  Size is definitely a consideration especially when Young’s game is predicated on moving around and improvising with which he is an absolutely a magician but can he consistently get away with that in the NFL?  Questionable.  Having a CJ Stroud day today.  IMO, Bryce played against top defensive talent more and dominated but Stroud is so fuggin accurate and is clearly still improving.  
 

If you look at flat stats Stroud was incredible.  Damn this is a tough decision for me.  

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    • Icege
      Adam Theilen said he came back to play with Bryce, and he expects the Panthers to surprise some people

      By Icege · Posted

      We're in alignment regarding Thielen not being a game changer/breaker for the Panthers. Getting the ball into hands of playmakers like TMac and XL is going to open up things more than it is getting it to Thielen underneath (or letting him go after 50/50 balls 20yds downfield in his mid-30s). However, in a room where the other guys are two second year guys and two rookies, having a reliable vet that they can learn from is just as important as it is for the QB to have as a reliable third option. I can see that being worth $8.5M (just 3%) of the $279.2M cap... especially when looking at what's left out there: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/_/position/wr However, the idea that the team is forcing production to Thielen and leading to losses isn't supported by the data. Targets, not receiving yards, are how you can tell if a player is being "force fed." In the two games mentioned, let's look at the other players available... vs. TB 10 targets - Adam Thielen 9 targets - David Moore 8 targets - Tommy Tremble, Xavier Legette 3 targets - Jonathon Brooks 1 target - Dan Chisena, Feleipe Franks, Stephen Sullivan vs. PHI 11 targets - Adam Thielen 8 targets - Xavier Legette 5 targets - Chuba Hubbard, David Moore 2 targets - Tommy Tremble 1 target - Ja'Tavion Sanders, Deven Thompkins There isn't exactly a bounty of other names to throw the ball to. In those games, AT was one of the top 2 WRs. Diontae had been gone by that point.   So... yea. Agreed that Thielen isn't exactly carrying the team in his mid-30s, but it's undeniable that he was the most reliable target last season that still has quite a bit of value this season. Whether or not that value is reflected in a manner folks think on the contract is going to come down to personal taste. However, the idea that the team was forcing production to AT and that was the reason behind some losses couldn't be further from the truth.
    • PNW_PantherMan
      Adam Theilen said he came back to play with Bryce, and he expects the Panthers to surprise some people

      By PNW_PantherMan · Posted

      I would also add that I think it's more than money.  AT has looked absolutely miserable out there at times, and there was a lot of speculation he would demand to be traded.  Personally, I thought he was a lock to be moved last year.  Maybe his hamstring is the only thing that prevents that from happening. The fact that he's not only willing to come back and play, but excited about it, really bodes well for Bryce.  AT is a veteran and he knows the game.  If he didn't have confidence in Bryce, I guarantee you he wouldn't be in a Panther uniform this year.  I'll take that as a positive.
    • frankw
      Adam Theilen said he came back to play with Bryce, and he expects the Panthers to surprise some people

      By frankw · Posted

      Two wins bud. 2 wins. Accept it.
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