r/NFL Top 50 WR rankings.

[jayboogieman]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

No, it's mainly just poor evaluation.

The league's elite TE's are are heavily represented by non-1st round players. 

In a draft where TE is so deep, I would say TE at 8 is unwise because there doesn't seem to be a truly elite guy.

I feel the same about DE/Edge.

We're just going to disagree on this. Then again, I'm someone that's fine with drafting a center top ten, or any other position except RB, if you think the guy is worth a first round pick, so what do I know?

[mrcompletely11]

									1 hour ago, jayboogieman said: Vernon Davis jumps off the list and Kellen Winslow was pretty good. But let's take a look at the other top ten guys. Since I haven't seen most of these guys play because I haven't paid attention to non Panther games in years, I'll look at stats and games played. Pitts? Great rookie year, one injured year, and two iffy years. I'd say he hasn't been worth a top ten pick. Hockenson? Lots of injuries but has gotten better every year until this past season. I'd say worth the pick. Ebron? Injured and never really produced for Detroit. Not worth the pick. Davis? As I said, jumps off the list and more than worth the pick. Winslow? Worth the pick. If you look at the rest, it's a mix like every other position with several guys that will probably end up in the HOF such as Miller, Lewis, and Clark. That's if they're not already in it. Hockenson has never cracked 1000 yards, he never cracked 70 catches in his first 4 years   Davis never cracked 1000 yards and only went over 60 catches twice in his career      what in the holy fug are you talking about?   Drafting tight ends in the first round is a fools errand it just doesnt make sense

[jayboogieman]

3 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

									Hockenson has never cracked 1000 yards, he never cracked 70 catches in his first 4 years   Davis never cracked 1000 yards and only went over 60 catches twice in his career      what in the holy fug are you talking about?   Drafting tight ends in the first round is a fools errand it just doesnt make sense

Drafting a DE, a tackle, a corner, etc is a fools errand as well. It just doesn't make sense. I mean some of those guys never even get a single yard in a year.

[Icege]

Folks being willing to take WR22 before they even consider TE1/C1/RB1 in the first round is exactly why I don't believe Huddlers being at the helm would've made this team suck any less.

[MasterAwesome]

19 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Since 2000 24 tight ends have been drafted in the first round.  4 in the top ten.   By all means please tell me which te was worth taking from that list.   Yeah I thought so.

 

If we take a te at pick 8 there the fans should burn ericsson stadium to the ground

 

• Brock Bowers, Las Vegas Raiders
• No. 13 overall, 2024
• Kyle Pitts, Atlanta Falcons
  No. 4 overall, 2021
• T.J. Hockenson, Detroit Lions
  No. 8, 2019
• Noah Fant, Denver Broncos
  No. 20, 2019
• Hayden Hurst, Baltimore Ravens
  No. 25, 2018
• O.J. Howard, Tampa Bay Buccaneers
  No. 19, 2017
• Evan Engram, New York Giants
  No. 23, 2017
• David Njoku, Cleveland Browns
  No. 29, 2017
• Eric Ebron, Detroit Lions
  No. 10, 2014
• Tyler Eifert, Cincinnati Bengals
  No. 21, 2013
• Jermaine Gresham, Cincinnati Bengals
  No. 21, 2010
• Brandon Pettigrew, Detroit Lions
  No. 20, 2009
• Dustin Keller, New York Jets
  No. 30, 2008
• Greg Olsen, Chicago Bears
  No. 31, 2007
• Vernon Davis, San Francisco 49ers
  No. 6, 2006
• Marcedes Lewis, Jacksonville Jaguars
  No. 28, 2006
• Heath Miller, Pittsburgh Steelers
  No. 30, 2005
• Kellen Winslow II, Cleveland Browns
  No. 6, 2004
• Ben Watson, New England Patriots
  No. 32, 2004
• Dallas Clark, Indianapolis Colts
  No. 24, 2003
• Jeremy Shockey, New York Giants
  No. 14, 2002
• Daniel Graham, New England Patriots
  No. 21, 2002
• Jerramy Stevens, Seattle Seahawks
  No. 28, 2002
• Todd Heap, Baltimore Ravens
  No. 31, 2001
• Bubba Franks, Green Bay Packers
  No. 14, 2000
• Anthony Becht, New York Jets
  No. 27, 2000

How is this not a variation of the argument people gave for not drafting CJ Stroud because "look at this long list of failed Ohio State QBs"?  I think it makes a lot more sense to judge a prospect on their own merits, rather than dinging them for the accomplishments (or lack thereof) of randos like Daniel Graham from 2002.  All those players you listed have their own strengths/weaknesses and failed/underachieved for one reason or another unique to them as individuals.  If you want to argue positional value, then that's different.  I don't know anything about Tyler Warren, but if I could theoretically draft a Greg Olsen or a Brock Bowers with the 8th overall pick?  I'd take that.

[mrcompletely11]

11 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

If you want to argue positional value, then that's different.  I don't know anything about Tyler Warren, but if I could theoretically draft a Greg Olsen or a Brock Bowers with the 8th overall pick?  I'd take that.

That is exactly my argument.  Sure Bowers (and he had 150 targets) is the unicorn but it took Olsen 4 years and a different team before he became anywhere close to relevant.  It seemingly takes TE's years before they are consistently producing and even then they are at best a 3rd(?) option on a team.  Kyle pitts was a generational prospect and he still cannot seem to figure it out.  All in all TE's rarely come in and are difference makers and we damn sure dont need to be drafting one in the first given all our holes. 

 

Kelce, probably the best te in history didnt crack 1000 yards until his 4rth season.   Nah man we sure as hell dont need to be blowing a top 10 pick on a tight end especially given how ass our defense was

Edited February 25 by mrcompletely11

[Stingray3030]

Here is a fun addition to the conversation - this is first round hit rates since 2000 by position

[TD alt]

22 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Since 2000 24 tight ends have been drafted in the first round.  4 in the top ten.   By all means please tell me which te was worth taking from that list.   Yeah I thought so.

 

If we take a te at pick 8 there the fans should burn ericsson stadium to the ground

 

• Brock Bowers, Las Vegas Raiders
• No. 13 overall, 2024
• Kyle Pitts, Atlanta Falcons
  No. 4 overall, 2021
• T.J. Hockenson, Detroit Lions
  No. 8, 2019
• Noah Fant, Denver Broncos
  No. 20, 2019
• Hayden Hurst, Baltimore Ravens
  No. 25, 2018
• O.J. Howard, Tampa Bay Buccaneers
  No. 19, 2017
• Evan Engram, New York Giants
  No. 23, 2017
• David Njoku, Cleveland Browns
  No. 29, 2017
• Eric Ebron, Detroit Lions
  No. 10, 2014
• Tyler Eifert, Cincinnati Bengals
  No. 21, 2013
• Jermaine Gresham, Cincinnati Bengals
  No. 21, 2010
• Brandon Pettigrew, Detroit Lions
  No. 20, 2009
• Dustin Keller, New York Jets
  No. 30, 2008
• Greg Olsen, Chicago Bears
  No. 31, 2007
• Vernon Davis, San Francisco 49ers
  No. 6, 2006
• Marcedes Lewis, Jacksonville Jaguars
  No. 28, 2006
• Heath Miller, Pittsburgh Steelers
  No. 30, 2005
• Kellen Winslow II, Cleveland Browns
  No. 6, 2004
• Ben Watson, New England Patriots
  No. 32, 2004
• Dallas Clark, Indianapolis Colts
  No. 24, 2003
• Jeremy Shockey, New York Giants
  No. 14, 2002
• Daniel Graham, New England Patriots
  No. 21, 2002
• Jerramy Stevens, Seattle Seahawks
  No. 28, 2002
• Todd Heap, Baltimore Ravens
  No. 31, 2001
• Bubba Franks, Green Bay Packers
  No. 14, 2000
• Anthony Becht, New York Jets
  No. 27, 2000

Brock Bowers, and I'm standing on that.

Jeremy Shockey and Dallas Clark were probably worth it as well. 

Edited February 25 by TD alt

[shaqattaq]

On 2/23/2025 at 5:32 PM, kungfoodude said:

I will say that if we want to assist the offense, adding a high level pass catching TE threat like Fannin Jr. or Elijah Arroyo is a good idea.

I'm coming around to the idea of Tyler Warren at #8!

Then DL and OLB at 57 and 74. My first draft, 30 minutes of research, mock draft has DJ Sanders, DL from SC and Mike Green, OLB from Marshall respectively. Again, very little research done and I'm not really a college FB guy.

[TD alt]

1 hour ago, mrcompletely11 said:

That is exactly my argument.  Sure Bowers (and he had 150 targets) is the unicorn but it took Olsen 4 years and a different team before he became anywhere close to relevant.  It seemingly takes TE's years before they are consistently producing and even then they are at best a 3rd(?) option on a team.  Kyle pitts was a generational prospect and he still cannot seem to figure it out.  All in all TE's rarely come in and are difference makers and we damn sure dont need to be drafting one in the first given all our holes. 

 

Kelce, probably the best te in history didnt crack 1000 yards until his 4rth season.   Nah man we sure as hell dont need to be blowing a top 10 pick on a tight end especially given how ass our defense was

I wouldn't this year, but TEs can be important to the offense, and a QB's best friend depending if they are the right fit.

It's not all about simple stats, though the best ones in history put up fairly prolific numbers.

Edited February 25 by TD alt

[mrcompletely11]

5 minutes ago, TD alt said:

Brock Bowers, and I'm standing on that.

Jeremy Shockey and Dallas Clark were worth it as well. 

Shockey had a combined 248 catches, 3000 yards and 17 tds his first 4 years.

Clark had a combined 121 catches, 1619 yards and 14 tds his first 4 years.

Shockey never had a 1000 yard season while Clark had a grand total of 1.  Shockey never had a double digit td season while clark had 2. 

If you truly think that is worthy of a first round pick then there really isnt anything more to discuss with you

So out of 24 guys picked only 3 have been worthy in your mind and 2 of those 3 are dubious at best.  Not good odds

[TD alt]

9 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Shockey had a combined 248 catches, 3000 yards and 17 tds his first 4 years.

Clark had a combined 121 catches, 1619 yards and 14 tds his first 4 years.

Shockey never had a 1000 yard season while Clark had a grand total of 1.  Shockey never had a double digit td season while clark had 2. 

If you truly think that is worthy of a first round pick then there really isnt anything more to discuss with you

So out of 24 guys picked only 3 have been worthy in your mind and 2 of those 3 are dubious at best.  Not good odds

I saw what Clark and Shockey did, and there is a huge argument that they were key players in their championship runs (meaning that their respective teams don't win without them). Being a legit receiving threat, but more importantly, a legitimate outlet for your QB, particularly on money downs, is very important. If you want to argue against that, then you're right, we don't have anything more to discuss on this issue.

I'm not stumping for Warren either. I've consistently said BPA, and I doubt he's going to be it.

 

Edited February 25 by TD alt

[TD alt]

By the way, Greg Olsen would've been worth it to the Bears had they known how to use him, but they're the ones that fuged up.

[shaqattaq]

42 minutes ago, Stingray3030 said:

Here is a fun addition to the conversation - this is first round hit rates since 2000 by position

Best Center possible at #8!!! You can't argue with math.