Be careful what you wish for

[cranky]

Given all the Young hate here, I thought it would be interesting to have a look at some prior QB’s who’ve been similarly treated.

Sam Arnold was brought here, had a couple of bad games and was summarily trashed by everyone. Then Baker Mayfield was brought in, had a couple of bad games, and like Darnold, was trashed. I remember everyone here posting how they weren’t “NFL starting material.” Well….

Darnold took the Vikings to the playoffs with a 14-3 record last year and has the Raiders looking good this year.

Mayfield went on to the Bucs after and has led them to 3 straight NFC Championships. Again, neither of them are “starting” material according to a lot of you.

It’s not only them either. Daniel Jones was run out of NY because he wasn’t good enough and yet he has lead the Colts to a 2-0 record and has the best stats of any QB so far this season. Mac Jones wasn’t good enough for the Patriots but is doing very well with the 49ers as well.

Sometimes it not the player but rather it’s the lack of sound coaching that holds a player back. I’m not sure either Frank Reich or Dave Canales have been the best for Young’s development at this point.

Of course I know a lot of you don’t care about all that so say you get your wish and they get rid of Young - then what. Maybe they can draft a “generational talent” like Trevor Lawrence or Caleb Williams. Maybe they could sign a free agent like Aaron Rodgers. Not really sure how much better we would be with any of them at this point. I know Young is an easy target but I just don't believe he is the real problem at this point.

But hey, maybe he’ll go to the Saints and we can watch as he wins NFC South with them. You know history has a way of repeating itself.

[Lurk21]

I get your points and the logic of the post is valid but  I'D  LOVE TO FACE YOUNG 2 TIMES A YEAR lol 

[TD alt]

10 minutes ago, cranky said:

Given all the Young hate here, I thought it would be interesting to have a look at some prior QB’s who’ve been similarly treated.

Sam Arnold was brought here, had a couple of bad games and was summarily trashed by everyone. Then Baker Mayfield was brought in, had a couple of bad games, and like Darnold, was trashed. I remember everyone here posting how they weren’t “NFL starting material.” Well….

Darnold took the Vikings to the playoffs with a 14-3 record last year and has the Raiders looking good this year.

Mayfield went on to the Bucs after and has led them to 3 straight NFC Championships. Again, neither of them are “starting” material according to a lot of you.

It’s not only them either. Daniel Jones was run out of NY because he wasn’t good enough and yet he has lead the Colts to a 2-0 record and has the best stats of any QB so far this season. Mac Jones wasn’t good enough for the Patriots but is doing very well with the 49ers as well.

Sometimes it not the player but rather it’s the lack of sound coaching that holds a player back. I’m not sure either Frank Reich or Dave Canales have been the best for Young’s development at this point.

Of course I know a lot of you don’t care about all that so say you get your wish and they get rid of Young - then what. Maybe they can draft a “generational talent” like Trevor Lawrence or Caleb Williams. Maybe they could sign a free agent like Aaron Rodgers. Not really sure how much better we would be with any of them at this point. I know Young is an easy target but I just don't believe he is the real problem at this point.

But hey, maybe he’ll go to the Saints and we can watch as he wins NFC South with them. You know history has a way of repeating itself.

I mean, I hear you, but 9 is special. I believe that he's just too small to succeed in the NFL. The kid can't see and misses reads, much less passes.  I mean he is more on his tippy toes than a ballerina.

To your point, I remember some talking bad about Jordan Love when it was suggested that we trade for him. 

Edited 3 hours ago by TD alt

[kungfoodude]

This is cherry picking and, quite honestly, with some suspect examples with recency bias. The overwhelming majority of bust QB's that teams move on from end up never amounting to anything more than a lower level starter to middling backup. 

I would wager likely greater than 95% in the past 25 drafts or so.

[frankw]

Sam Darnold - All the physical tools

Baker Mayfield - All the physical tools

Daniel Jones - All the physical tools

Bryce Young????????

[CRA]

16 minutes ago, cranky said:

Given all the Young hate here, I thought it would be interesting to have a look at some prior QB’s who’ve been similarly treated.

Sam Arnold was brought here, had a couple of bad games and was summarily trashed by everyone. Then Baker Mayfield was brought in, had a couple of bad games, and like Darnold, was trashed. I remember everyone here posting how they weren’t “NFL starting material.” Well….

Darnold took the Vikings to the playoffs with a 14-3 record last year and has the Raiders looking good this year.

Mayfield went on to the Bucs after and has led them to 3 straight NFC Championships. Again, neither of them are “starting” material according to a lot of you.

It’s not only them either. Daniel Jones was run out of NY because he wasn’t good enough and yet he has lead the Colts to a 2-0 record and has the best stats of any QB so far this season. Mac Jones wasn’t good enough for the Patriots but is doing very well with the 49ers as well.

Sometimes it not the player but rather it’s the lack of sound coaching that holds a player back. I’m not sure either Frank Reich or Dave Canales have been the best for Young’s development at this point.

Of course I know a lot of you don’t care about all that so say you get your wish and they get rid of Young - then what. Maybe they can draft a “generational talent” like Trevor Lawrence or Caleb Williams. Maybe they could sign a free agent like Aaron Rodgers. Not really sure how much better we would be with any of them at this point. I know Young is an easy target but I just don't believe he is the real problem at this point.

But hey, maybe he’ll go to the Saints and we can watch as he wins NFC South with them. You know history has a way of repeating itself.

every player mentioned in your post is a better QB than Bryce.  That's why it's not Bryce hate.  

if you were to make of a list of Darnold, Baker, Mac, D. Jones, old Rodgers, Trevor, Caleb and Bryce.  Bryce is last.  And that's not tooting anyone's horn you named. 

[TD alt]

8 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

This is cherry picking and, quite honestly, with some suspect examples with recency bias. The overwhelming majority of bust QB's that teams move on from end up never amounting to anything more than a lower level starter to middling backup. 

I would wager likely greater than 95% in the past 25 drafts or so.

Let me provide you with some food for thought. Before this "now era" of the NFL, QBs were allowed time to develop. Everyone from the GM to the fans had more patience. QBs were simply better, or at least more fundamentally sound, in the old days because they were afforded the time to sit, observe and learn. It's no wonder that guys we threw away, or simply didn't want, have had varying degrees of success elsewhere. 

Some Huddlers were talking crazy about Jordan Love and Lamar Jackson---just crazy...

Edited 3 hours ago by TD alt

[kungfoodude]

6 minutes ago, frankw said:

Sam Darnold - All the physical tools

Baker Mayfield - All the physical tools

Daniel Jones - All the physical tools

Bryce Young????????

Not to mention that Darnold is still a lower tier starter to upper tier backup QB. Far from a "success" story.

Baker was a playoff caliber player with the team that drafted him. He doesn't fit this mold at all. Hell, look at his stats from Cleveland and it will make your head spin in comparison to the rest of the guys being mentioned there.

Jones looks great so far but it's two games of that.

 

[mrcompletely11]

2 minutes ago, TD alt said:

Let me provide you with some food for thought. Before this "now era" of the NFL, QBs were allowed time to develop. Everyone from the GM to the fans had more patience. QBs were simply better, or at least more fundamentally sound, in the old days because they were afforded the time to sit, observe and learn. It's no wonder that guys we threw away, or simply didn't want, have had varying degrees of success elsewhere. 

Some Huddlers were talking crazy about Jordan Love and Lamar Jackson---just crazy...

For like the 100th time on here, there are only 3 options after this season for Bryce.

1. Trade him

2. Extend him

3. Pick up the 5th

 

what would you recommend the team doing?  Honest question. 

[TD alt]

Look at how Malik Willis looked last year when Jordan Love got hurt. Hell, Mac Jones looked good this past week. 

[mrcompletely11]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Not to mention that Darnold is still a lower tier starter to upper tier backup QB. Far from a "success" story.

Baker was a playoff caliber player with the team that drafted him. He doesn't fit this mold at all. Hell, look at his stats from Cleveland and it will make your head spin in comparison to the rest of the guys being mentioned there.

Jones looks great so far but it's two games of that.

 

I was wrong about Baker, I thought he was an arrogant poo but apparently his team loves him and he has gotten it together.  I was wrong

 

But there is no way in fuging hades I would want either of the headcases of Jones or darnold on this team.   No fuging way

[Jon Snow]

Just now, TD alt said:

Let me provide you with some food for thought. Before this "now era" of the NFL, QBs were allowed time to develop. Everyone from the GM to the fans had more patience. QBs were simply better in the old because they were afforded the time to sit, observe and learn. It's no wonder that guys we threw away, or simply didn't want, have had varying degrees of success elsewhere. 

Some Huddlers were talking crazy about Jordan Love and Lamar Jackson---just crazy...

To add to how it use to be with qb's, most successful teams drafted a qb several years before he was needed. That gave them an opportunity to develop him before he was thrown in the fire. In today's society the qb must start day 1 or he's a bust. Its all about getting immediate gratification for both the fans and the owners that want an immediate return. 

[mrcompletely11]

Just now, Jon Snow said:

To add to how it use to be with qb's, most successful teams drafted a qb several years before he was needed. That gave them an opportunity to develop him before he was thrown in the fire. In today's society the qb must start day 1 or he's a bust. Its all about getting immediate gratification for both the fans and the owners that want an immediate return. 

There also was no rookie contract you had to navigate and factor in

[X-Clown]

Sam Darnold plays for the Raiders and the Bucs have been in 3 NFC Championships in a row. I learn something new every day.