Nextgen stats insight saints panthers

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, Sup said:

I don't see any reason to keep Young at all. Trade him for a late pick and move on.

Yes he could be a competent backup for a few games but that also takes up a roster spot for another QB with more upside. But even more importantly it just lets us move on from this epic mistake.

If you make moves to stabilize the QB room and turn down his 5th year, there is no real reason to keep him in Carolina for the 2026 season. It's pointless for both parties. Give him a fresh start and turn the page. 

I don't anticipate that happening. I suspect they will pick up his 5th year and barrel straight into denial mode with the Tepper based assumption that we just aren't good enough to help him win yet.

[Waldo]

Just now, kungfoodude said:

I would heavily disagree. They have a longer term financial commitment to Purdy and they are very similar level players. Unloading Purdy would be a true roster purge would have to happen. 

That's destroying the health of the franchise for.....Mac Jones.

So Purdy has fugged them which was my take the entire time. The damage was done when  they gave him that contract.

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, Waldo said:

So Purdy has fugged them which was my take the entire time. The damage was done when  they gave him that contract.

Purdy didn't do anything but become one of the most successful 7th round draft picks in NFL history. No one put a gun to their head to sign that deal.

[Waldo]

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Purdy didn't do anything but become one of the most successful 7th round draft picks in NFL history. No one put a gun to their head to sign that deal.

Lol of course the team is at fault but the players also singed the deal (for a Purdy it's an easy duh) . Purdy was a great example of a guy who is priceless on a rookie contract and should be avoided at market rates in the NFL. Trading for Jones and having to pay him would be just as bad. Neither are worth trading for but Mac in free agency at the right price could be a decent bridge. 

That's not a retooling for the 49ers, it's a regression around a cap fumble they have to eat a while longer. They might pull it off with their skills but it wouldn't be the NFL norm

[kungfoodude]

Just now, Waldo said:

Lol of course the team is at fault but the players also singed the deal (for a Purdy it's an easy duh) . Purdy was a great example of a guy who is priceless on a rookie contract and should be avoided at market rates in the NFL. Trading for Jones and having to pay him would be just as bad. Neither are worth trading for but Mac in free agency at the right price could be a decent bridge. 

That's not a retooling for the 49ers, it's a regression around a cap fumble they have to eat a while longer. They might pull it off with their skills but it wouldn't be the NFL norm

Honestly, I don't have a problem with the deal they signed. It's actually far more team friendly than most of the other top 15 QB contracts. It was a fair deal all around. Don't love the player but it's not a major ordeal to move on after a couple of seasons. 

[SCO96]

I think Tepper (and owners in general) have  more influence on team personnel than most of us realize. Remember how Brenton "Sunshine" Berson was a roster lock when JR owned the team?

 Frank Reich didn't want to draft Bryce, Tepper did. I remember him saying in an off-season meeting that the team wouldn't have to break the bank on WR's because of BY's processing ability and his ability to distribute the a ball to like a point guard to the skill position guys. Frank quickly realized it was almost hopeless situation. And, why are we running a 3-4 defense? We ran a 4-3 for almost two decades. One year after Tepper takes over, we went to a 3-4 and continue to do so despite never drafting the appropriate personnel to run it after Rivera was fired. Owners have a lot of say on what happens on that field. Look how Al Davis tried to ruin Marcus Allen's career essentially benching him during his prime years.

Canales got this job because Tepper wanted someone who could "fix" Bryce; and Canales was overly eager to get his first coaching job and felt up to the task. No top coaching prospect was going to want to come to Carolina with our track record since Tepper bought the team and having their destiny tied to Bryce as his QB. A top GM candidate from outside the organization would feel the same way. In theory, it was too early to cut bait with him after only one season

Dan and Dave knew one another and both wanted to be "the guy" in charge as coach and GM. Carolina provided the ideal opportunity. On the surface this hire, if successful, could validate Tepper's decision to give a fool's ransom for Bryce and he could fill the GM spot with a body but still have someone in power that he was familiar with. In all honesty, it we had a good QB and a capable back-up on the roster I doubt we'd be having this conversation because we'd probably be one of the top teams in the NFC.

Edited 1 hour ago by SCO96

[CarolinaRideorDie]

4 hours ago, CRA said:

I still don’t get the Dan Morgan mental gymnastics and how folks have invented this world where Morgan quietly raged against all Fitterer’s decisions with no evidence. 

 

In all honesty, no one knows if Dan really pushed for Bryce to be drafted. It's not fair to Dan to say that just because he was a part of the Fitterer regime then he was in full support of drafting Bryce. If the HC, Reich at the time really wanted Stroud but got bullied into drafting Bryce then Dan had even less say so in the matter. Dan was also saddled with giving Bryce an opportunity to compete in years 2/3 because of the cost to trade up and get him by ownership. 

Outside of managing the QB position, Dan has made good moves and built a decent roster. Solidified the O-line and D-line, drafted contributors, and made good trades (Mike Jackson), and free agent signings (Dowdle). I do believe that this offseason will be really important for Dan and we'll see whose side he is clearly on. Bryce has had plenty of time and opportunity to prove himself and he has failed, if Dan is a Bryce homer he'll give him another year and pick up the 5th year option. If Dan isn't a Bryce homer, he'll move on from Bryce. Either way, we'll find out this offseason. 

[Mr. Scot]

5 hours ago, CRA said:

I still don’t get the Dan Morgan mental gymnastics and how folks have invented this world where Morgan quietly raged against all Fitterer’s decisions with no evidence. 

I think odds are Bryce present day is here because of Morgan more so than Tepper.  Tepper is horrible at hiring but Tepper isn’t the type to get stuck on ideas or people or afraid to admit mistakes (his is the opposite). 

Unknown what Morgan's full opinion of Young is, but given the investment we have in him and his performance through the end of last season, trying to get whatever they can out of him is reasonable. 

As far as differences, Fitterer was reported to have more trust in analytics data than Morgan does. Morgan prefers old school eyes on game film scouting.

[SCO96]

56 minutes ago, CarolinaRideorDie said:

I do believe that this offseason will be really important for Dan and we'll see whose side he is clearly on. Bryce has had plenty of time and opportunity to prove himself and he has failed, if Dan is a Bryce homer he'll give him another year and pick up the 5th year option. If Dan isn't a Bryce homer, he'll move on from Bryce. Either way, we'll find out this offseason. 

If Bryce gets his 5th year option picked up, that doesn't necessarily mean Dan is a Bryce "homer".

Tepper "could insist" that the team keep him for 2026 and 2027. Hopefully it won't come to that, but if it did what else could Morgan (and Canales) do but pick up the option and hope for the best?

[LinvilleGorge]

2 hours ago, Waldo said:

Lol of course the team is at fault but the players also singed the deal (for a Purdy it's an easy duh) . Purdy was a great example of a guy who is priceless on a rookie contract and should be avoided at market rates in the NFL. Trading for Jones and having to pay him would be just as bad. Neither are worth trading for but Mac in free agency at the right price could be a decent bridge. 

That's not a retooling for the 49ers, it's a regression around a cap fumble they have to eat a while longer. They might pull it off with their skills but it wouldn't be the NFL norm

Yep, I said it for years. He's a huge asset on a rookie contract who becomes a huge liability on a franchise QB contract.

[LinvilleGorge]

2 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

Honestly, I don't have a problem with the deal they signed. It's actually far more team friendly than most of the other top 15 QB contracts. It was a fair deal all around. Don't love the player but it's not a major ordeal to move on after a couple of seasons. 

The issue is that the NFL insists on extending "franchise QB" money to mid-tier or worse starters. If your guy isn't legit MVP caliber then you're probably better off letting someone else pay him and moving on. But GMs and coaches want to keep their jobs so they pay these guys fearing the alternative. Let him walk and implode and you're fired. Sign him to franchise QB money and you can probably limp along for another 2-3 years before the cap hits start strangling the life out of the roster and maybe you can even exceed expectations if you can draft really well.

[toldozer]

6 hours ago, raleigh-panther said:

Next Gen Stats Insight for Saints-Panthers (via NFL Pro): 

 

Much of Tyler Shough’s production was directed outside the numbers, as he finished 11 of 16 for 202 yards and both of his touchdowns on such attempts.

His yardage total outside the numbers was the second-most by a Saints quarterback in the last eight seasons and most by any rookie in 2025.

NFL Research:

The Panthers had their sixth game of the season with seven or fewer points in the first half.

Carolina is 2-15 when Bryce Young starts at QB and has less than 70 yards in the first half in his career.

17 times Bryce has been under 70 yards in the first half, more than 33% of his starts. The dude fuging sucks. He's been over 200 yards 12 times in his damn career. There are other problems for sure but we cannot accurately solve those until turnover Fred gets the fug off the field 

[raleigh-panther]

3 minutes ago, toldozer said:

17 times Bryce has been under 70 yards in the first half, more than 33% of his starts. The dude fuging sucks. He's been over 200 yards 12 times in his damn career. There are other problems for sure but we cannot accurately solve those until turnover Fred gets the fug off the field 

I Will never live down 

‘turn over Fred ‘ vs  ‘turn over free’  in the title I couldn’t edit

ironically, the ‘Fred’  was more appropriate 

lol lol