Does Bryce deserve credit for game-winning drives?

[ForJimmy]

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I think he just kind of is who he is. Middle of the road TE. Nothing wrong with that, just don't want to see an Ian Thomas contract.

I don't think we are allowed to mention Ian Thomas and contract in the same sentence anymore...

[cranky]

6 hours ago, TN05 said:

I decided to do a statistical analysis to find out. I used Pro Football Reference's list of his game-winning drives (GWD) for this.

tl:dr; Bryce deserves no credit for two games, partial credit for either two or three games, and broadly deserves credit for the rest. Only 2 of the GWD are of no credit to him at all.

2023

• Week 7 vs. Houston (15-13)

  • Full-game statline - 22/31 (70.9%), 235 passing yards, 1 touchdown

  • Final drive - Drive began on the Carolina 9 yard line with 6:17 left in the 4th quarter, down 13-12. Bryce accounted for 55 total yards on the drive (50 passing, 5 rushing); Chuba ran for 13, and the Texans gave up 28 yards on penalties.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Yes. Bryce accounted for all offensive yardage before reaching the Texans 30.

• Week 14 vs. Atlanta (9-7)

  • Full-game statline - 18/24 (75%), 167 passing yards

  • Final drive - Drive began on the Carolina 5 yard line with 7:35 left in the 4th quarter, down 7-6. Bryce threw for 68 yards on the drive and kneeled three times when in field goal range.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Yes. Bryce accounted for all but 20 yards on the drive.

2024

• Week 9 vs. New Orleans (23-22)

  • Full-game statline - 16/26 (61.5%), 171 passing yards, 1 touchdown and 1 interception

  • Final drive - Drive began on the Carolina 34 with 3:25 left in the 4th. Bryce threw for 26 yards, and drew a 22-yard pass interference penalty. Chuba Hubbard scored the game-winning 16-yard touchdown.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Yes. Passing and pass interference accounted for all but 16 yards on the drive.

• Week 10 vs. New York Giants (20-17)

  • Full-game statline - 15/25 (60%), 121 passing yards, 1 touchdown; 30 rushing yards

  • Final drive - Drive began in overtime at the New York 23-yard line immediately after the Giants fumbled the first snap. Chuba ran three times. Bryce did not throw a pass.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - No. Bryce literally did nothing on this one due to generous field position in overtime.

• Week 15 vs. Arizona (36-30)

  • Full-game statline - 17/26 (65.4%), 158 passing yards, 1 touchdown; 68 rushing yards, 1 touchdown

  • Final drive - Drive began on the Arizona 49 with 4:11 left in overtime. Chuba ran twice for 49 yards and a touchdown.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - No. Bryce literally did nothing on this one.

• Week 17 at Atlanta (44-38)

  • Full-game statline - 25/34 (73.5%), 251 passing yards, 3 touchdowns; 24 rushing yards, 2 touchdowns

  • Final drive - Drive began on the Carolina 30 at the start of overtime. Bryce threw for 56 yards; Miles Sanders scored the game-winning one-yard touchdown.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Yes. Bryce accounted for the vast majority of yards on this drive.

2025

• Week 5 vs. Miami (27-24)

  • Full-game statline - 19/30 (63.3%), 198 passing yards, 2 touchdowns and 1 interception

  • Final drive - Drive began at the Carolina 17. Bryce completed three passes for 45 yards and a touchdown; there were also three runs for 33 yards by other players

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Yes. Bryce accounted for the majority of yards and the game-winning touchdown.

• Week 6 vs. Dallas (30-27)

  • Full-game statline -17/25 (68%), 199 passing yards, 3 touchdowns and 1 interception

  • Final drive - Final drive began at the Carolina 14 with 6:07 left in the fourth. 37 yards were recorded on the ground, while Bryce threw for 25 yards and drew a 12-yard pass interference penalty.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Partially. No one player stood out on this drive.

• Week 9 at Green Bay (16-13)

  • Full-game statline - 11/20 (55%), 102 passing yards, 1 interception

  • Final drive - Final drive began at the Carolina 29 with 2:28 left in the fourth. Rico recorded 21 rushing yards while Bryce threw for 19 yards.

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Equal credit with Rico. Both recorded nearly identical yardage totals.

• Week 11 at Atlanta (30-27)

  • Full-game statline - 31/45 (68.9%), 448 passing yards, 3 touchdowns

  • Final drive - Final drive began at the Carolina 31 with 8:45 left in overtime. Bryce threw one pass to Tommy Tremble for 54 yards. 

  • Does Bryce deserve credit? - Tommy Tremble deserves the most credit here, but Bryce threw the pass.

In conclusion: there's really only two games here he did nothing in. The rest he gets at least some or a majority of the credit.

I appreciate the time you took to get this together but would like to point out that in the Cowboys game, they faced a 4th and 4 at the Cowboys 40 near the two-minute mark. Canales calls for a pass play and Bryce completes a 7 yard pass putting them at the 33 - in FG range. If they don't get that fourth down, the Cowboys get the ball back with 2 minutes remaining and only needing around 25 yrds for a FG. That play was huge - it not only put them in FG range but also allowed them to run out the clock. So yeah, I think BY should get credit for that drive.

Against the Packers, he and Rico did have equal yards but Bryce converted two third down conversions. Rico picked up a first down on a 19 yrd run but he dod not convert any third downs. Yes, he had help but, again, I think he deserves credit for the drive. 

I know all of this is nitpicking but given how little support he has around here, I feel obliged to point out any successes he may have had lol

 

[Mistuh Jones]

Jayzus. This is hair splitting on a microscopic level 

[cranky]

16 minutes ago, Mistuh Jones said:

Jayzus. This is hair splitting on a microscopic level 

Yeaaahhh, I'll learn to just stay quite one of these days.

[strato]

22 minutes ago, cranky said:

I appreciate the time you took to get this together but would like to point out that in the Cowboys game, they faced a 4th and 4 at the Cowboys 40 near the two-minute mark. Canales calls for a pass play and Bryce completes a 7 yard pass putting them at the 33 - in FG range. If they don't get that fourth down, the Cowboys get the ball back with 2 minutes remaining and only needing around 25 yrds for a FG. That play was huge - it not only put them in FG range but also allowed them to run out the clock. So yeah, I think BY should get credit for that drive.

Against the Packers, he and Rico did have equal yards but Bryce converted two third down conversions. Rico picked up a first down on a 19 yrd run but he dod not convert any third downs. Yes, he had help but, again, I think he deserves credit for the drive. 

I know all of this is nitpicking but given how little support he has around here, I feel obliged to point out any successes he may have had lol

 

Reasonable people understand he should get that. I don’t like Any of them getting credit for handing the ball off. Bryce or another guy. 
My issue is that the criteria for determining it is too broad and waters down whatever you might be able to get from it to the point I feel it is useless. 

Edited 17 hours ago by strato

[PNW_PantherMan]

3 hours ago, ForJimmy said:

Tremble is such a weird player.  I feel like he has the potential to be very good.  Already a good blocker, was pretty raw as a receiving threat but has some wiggle and explosiveness but he doesn't seem to get many targets.  I'm not sure if it's because we like to use him as a blocker or our other guys in Evans and JT simply have better hands or what?  

I had high expectations for him but I think he probably is what he is at this point.

[strato]

4 hours ago, Navy_football said:

Dude just needs to keep pushing the ball down the field and stop dinking and dunking all the time. We know he can do it. He just has to know it. 

I made a golf analogy a while back. You could use lots of sports or games but a lot of people play golf so ….

Let’s say your normal game runs from maybe high 70s to maybe 82, 83. You can do worse. And you can do better. Harder to do better. 
Anyhow one day you tee off right down the middle and it is tee to green in regulation all day. And you make some putts. You total maybe one or two over par.  
So great you did it. You know you can do it.

Try to go out there and do it again. 
That’s Bryce so far. Does it once or twice a year.  The rest is just nothing special. 
I feel like he needs to put it in gear and make the very good games his floor. Not next year. Not in two more years. Now. 

Edited 17 hours ago by strato

[Navy_football]

2 hours ago, strato said:

That’s Bryce so far. Does it once or twice a year.  The rest is just nothing special. 
I feel like he needs to put it in gear and make the very good games his floor. Not next year. Not in two more years. Now. 

Agree. I think Canales was calling plays that require downfield passing, or a check down. Make Bryce show you he can push the ball downfield by just taking away all of those 5-10 yards routes every play. 

[Mr. Scot]

Yes, he does.

Mind you, I've said many times that game winning drives are kind of a double edged sword because it tends to mean you're going into a lot of final quarters losing.

It's great to see them, but it's even better not to need them.

[Car123]

18 hours ago, Navy_football said:

I mean if you're taking GWDs off the record because he didn't throw a pass, should we add a few where he took the lead or tied the game with less than a minute and a half left in the game, and the defense crapped the bed? Or if the WR drops a perfectly thrown ball that hits him in both hands and the stomach/chest area? Seems like similar logic to me. 

A lot of QBs get freebie GWDs. It's not just a Bryce thing. Dude just needs to keep pushing the ball down the field and stop dinking and dunking all the time. We know he can do it. He just has to know it. 

Exactly, this thread is dumb. Diminishing his effort in the Cowboys game even though he made good passes on the final drive. You can make this thread for every quarterback.

[Navy_football]

22 minutes ago, Car123 said:

Exactly, this thread is dumb. Diminishing his effort in the Cowboys game even though he made good passes on the final drive. You can make this thread for every quarterback.

He had 3 TDs against Dallas. If someone's diminishing his contributions in that game, then they have an agenda. 

[strato]

3 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

He had 3 TDs against Dallas. If someone's diminishing his contributions in that game, then they have an agenda. 

I thought he hit his ceiling in the Dallas game. Because it was a 4 quarter effort not the more typical suck and then redeem yourself just enough with a decent half or quarter. 
 

I think Sunday looked more like his ceiling but the idea is execute what you asked to do without fuging it up. If they need you to make a play, you make the play. Do it for 60 minutes. 

There have been games Canales needed to hide him as well, and hope we could get through them playing that way. 

[Navy_football]

48 minutes ago, strato said:

I thought he hit his ceiling in the Dallas game. Because it was a 4 quarter effort not the more typical suck and then redeem yourself just enough with a decent half or quarter. 
 

I think Sunday looked more like his ceiling but the idea is execute what you asked to do without fuging it up. If they need you to make a play, you make the play. Do it for 60 minutes. 

There have been games Canales needed to hide him as well, and hope we could get through them playing that way. 

This past Sunday is definitely a ceiling and required big plays from WRs, TEs and RBs after the catch. I don't feel like Canales was hiding Bryce. It was more like Bryce was playing like he didn't trust his receivers. Playing not to lose instead of playing to win. He has to get out of that mindset, because he's a much better QB when he goes out there as a playmaker. Granted early on in the season, the pass pro was not up to par and Bryce couldn't figure out how to take a sack without fumbling the dang ball. 

[strato]

We will disagree on the hiding part. Protecting from turnovers is how I saw it but not worth a million words.  
I thought the receivers were given better balls than normal, as a result of the QB being sharper with his throws.  
At the same time when you have games with 11 completions they aren’t getting a lot of chances compared to 31 or whatever it was.