Ekwonu doesn’t get dog walked under 2 minutes in the 4th, we drive, kick a FG and win

[Navy_football]

43 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

 

Yeah, and Ikey is prone to mistakes but I am not gonna crush him as a pivotal reason why we lost that game. Especially in the midst of a very good season for him overall. 

I think the blame goes almost entirely to Canales and the coaching staff and the bulk of the remnant once again falling on Bryce.

Other players like Ikey, Ransom, etc certainly had their fair share of critical individual mistakes but I think the top line issues are the overwhelmingly biggest.

I wouldn't go that far. I think the defense should get the lion's share. But in their defense there were some very questionable calls that extended drives. But giving up those 3rd and longs were back breakers.

Bryce isn't asked to carry the team. He's asked to make his 4 or 5 big plays, usually towards the end of games. That's how you win with this version of Bryce. I think he made more than that yesterday. I thought he did a good job of manipulating the pocket and escaping when he had to. He just didn't get the help he needed to win the game. I'm not saying that's always the case. But it was yesterday. I think. I plan to watch the All-22 today. The eye in the sky don't lie.

[Navy_football]

9 minutes ago, mrBdawg said:

Chase Young bull rushes Ickey almost straight into Bryce in 2 seconds, who is looking right trying to push the ball downfield. He goes down.

And we are all here seriously talking about how Ickey did his job and Bryce didn’t 

I think a lot of it has to do with Bryce's past play that folk can't let go at this point. He used to hold the ball forever and just take sacks. Now the oline was bad but more than a few were on him. I judge him game to game, play to play, with no expectations. But he hasn't really been a sitting duck since his rookie season and maybe a little before the benching. Earlier this season he took sacks and fumbled the ball way too often. But he wasn't just sitting back there like a statue. He just didn't know when to give up on plays. 

[Waldo]

52 minutes ago, Tr3ach said:

So many people that hate bryce no matter what dont understand how progressions work.  He was clearly reading right to left.  The bull rush got to him before he would have ever had time to get to the dowdle read.

You're just going to avoid the step into the pocket and not be behind the LTs part? I never mentioned Dowdle either

[SmokinwithWilly]

8 minutes ago, mrBdawg said:

Chase Young bull rushes Ickey almost straight into Bryce in 2 seconds, who is looking right trying to push the ball downfield. He goes down.

And we are all here seriously talking about how Ickey did his job and Bryce didn’t 

Not saying Icky did his job yesterday, but do you know how much easier it is to rush if you don't have to worry about a QB stepping up into the pocket frequently? You can attack because there's only about a 20-30 degree windows of where the QB is going to end up instead of 90. You don't have to worry about adjusting so much, you can just go. Easier to run a straight line when there's little need to worry about changing direction. 

Icky's weakness coming out of college was pass pro. Young played like the DROY yesterday and Icky got handled. Your OC has to adjust to that. Your QB needs to adjust to that. We didn’t. See results. 

[kungfoodude]

24 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

I wouldn't go that far. I think the defense should get the lion's share. But in their defense there were some very questionable calls that extended drives. But giving up those 3rd and longs were back breakers.

Bryce isn't asked to carry the team. He's asked to make his 4 or 5 big plays, usually towards the end of games. That's how you win with this version of Bryce. I think he made more than that yesterday. I thought he did a good job of manipulating the pocket and escaping when he had to. He just didn't get the help he needed to win the game. I'm not saying that's always the case. But it was yesterday. I think. I plan to watch the All-22 today. The eye in the sky don't lie.

Yeah, which I am mostly attributing to the coaching staff(penalties, sloppy, unprepared) but we are almost fully three years into The Bryce Young Experience and we are still largely having to play like he is a 3rd string QB that is barely getting us by. That is a MASSIVE problem for a 3rd year, #1 overall draft pick of which the compensation given up was immense. Truthfully, based on those other factors alone, he currently is arguably the biggest bust for a #1 overall draft pick.

He so rarely elevates anyone on the team that it hampers the offense considerably. You just can't be a minor bit player in a critical game during a playoff chase. Bad games even elite players have but almost being a complete non-factor is less excusable. Especially when almost 85% of your career starts are either bad or non-factors.

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, which I am mostly attributing to the coaching staff(penalties, sloppy, unprepared) but we are almost fully three years into The Bryce Young Experience and we are still largely having to play like he is a 3rd string QB that is barely getting us by. That is a MASSIVE problem for a 3rd year, #1 overall draft pick of which the compensation given up was immense. Truthfully, based on those other factors alone, he currently is arguably the biggest bust for a #1 overall draft pick.

He so rarely elevates anyone on the team that it hampers the offense considerably. You just can't be a minor bit player in a critical game during a playoff chase. Bad games even elite players have but almost being a complete non-factor is less excusable. Especially when almost 85% of your career starts are either bad or non-factors.

A "good game" for Bryce is sub-200 yards, hovering around 20 attempts, hopefully a TD and no turnovers. That's low level game manager stuff. Backup QB stuff. And that's the real problem. Our starting QB forces us to run a backup QB offense. 

[kungfoodude]

21 minutes ago, Navy_football said:

I think a lot of it has to do with Bryce's past play that folk can't let go at this point. He used to hold the ball forever and just take sacks. Now the oline was bad but more than a few were on him. I judge him game to game, play to play, with no expectations. But he hasn't really been a sitting duck since his rookie season and maybe a little before the benching. Earlier this season he took sacks and fumbled the ball way too often. But he wasn't just sitting back there like a statue. He just didn't know when to give up on plays. 

A lot of young QB's struggle with holding on to the ball top long. He has gotten better progressively in that regard.

Pocket Time(in Sec):  2.5(2023), 2.3(2024), 2.2(2025)

Time to Throw(in Sec): 2.9(2023), 2.79(2024), 2.82(2025)

The divedends have been fairly small, is the issue.

[kungfoodude]

3 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

A "good game" for Bryce is sub-200 yards, hovering around 20 attempts, hopefully a TD and no turnovers. That's low level game manager stuff. Backup QB stuff. And that's the real problem. Our starting QB forces us to run a backup QB offense. 

Precisely. I feel line people are giving away the participation trophy equivalent of praise to Bryce in almost all his "good" games. 

He isn't a top 25 starting QB. No matter how you dice it, that is always going to be a problem. Especially when his "ascent" is at such a glacial pace as to be almost imperceptible.

Does anyone really want to wade through another few years of wishing and hoping?

[SmokinwithWilly]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Precisely. I feel line people are giving away the participation trophy equivalent of praise to Bryce in almost all his "good" games. 

He isn't a top 25 starting QB. No matter how you dice it, that is always going to be a problem. Especially when his "ascent" is at such a glacial pace as to be almost imperceptible.

Does anyone really want to wade through another few years of wishing and hoping?

Not at 50m AAV 

[LinvilleGorge]

5 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

Precisely. I feel line people are giving away the participation trophy equivalent of praise to Bryce in almost all his "good" games. 

He isn't a top 25 starting QB. No matter how you dice it, that is always going to be a problem. Especially when his "ascent" is at such a glacial pace as to be almost imperceptible.

Does anyone really want to wade through another few years of wishing and hoping?

The "Bryce curve" is just so built into expectations now that mediocre games are good. Because Bryce's "good" is NFL mediocre.

[kungfoodude]

5 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Not at 50m AAV 

Yep and the truth is even if we were able to get him on the bottom end of the scale, it would be a salary cap issue for a roster that has more holes than Swiss cheese.

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, LinvilleGorge said:

The "Bryce curve" is just so built into expectations now that mediocre games are good. Because Bryce's "good" is NFL mediocre.

Yeah, can you imagine if this same curve was applied to Cam Newton???

All the fanbase Cam hate would almost be nonexistent instead of a sizeable contingent. 

[Tr3ach]

42 minutes ago, Waldo said:

You're just going to avoid the step into the pocket and not be behind the LTs part? I never mentioned Dowdle either

He could have felt it maybe sure, but it is the qb blind side for a reason.  He read the blocking scheme and knew it was 1 on 1.  Sometimes the defense wins too, you are going to blame bryce no matter what happens so Im not sure why im wasting my time telling you how youre wrong. 

[LinvilleGorge]

1 minute ago, kungfoodude said:

Yeah, can you imagine if this same curve was applied to Cam Newton???

All the fanbase Cam hate would almost be nonexistent instead of a sizeable contingent. 

I'm just kinda baffled by it. He was a #1 overall pick that we traded a king's ransom for because we were betting on him being a game changer and yet there's a decent chunk of the fanbase that wants to treat him like a mid-round pick drafted to be a likely backup. If we'd drafted Bryce in say the 4th round and he was a backup forced into action I'd be singing his praises. We would be getting pretty decent play based on the level of expectations. I'd be saying you can't move forward with this guy as a starter because of his low ceiling but as a mid-round backup QB I can't really be mad at how he's playing. This is what you expect out of a mid-round backup QB. But when you're getting mid-round backup QB play out of a third year #1 overall pick you've mortgaged the franchise for and have tried to tailor your offensive roster and play calling to support, you really need to be shifting the perspective to realizing that you it's time to move on.