Wagner doesn't think Cam can beat them by throwing.

[LinvilleGorge]

The goal of any defense is to try to make the opposing offense one dimensional. You want to try to force them out of their comfort zone. If you can shut down the run and force them to have to throw the ball then you've won half the battle, no matter who the QB is.

[rodeo]

Weird how this was tweeted by the media after I posted the article on the huddle

 

 

 

Its almost like they use this joint for ideas

 

It might be time for another Fox to the Giants experiment.

[Rook35200]

So, let me get this straight...

 

They plan on taking the run away from Cam when we're going to be missing both JStew and Barner. All the while, we have Smitty, Cam, and now a legitimate home run threat in Ginn?

 

Good luck with that, Seattle.

 

 

LOL we'll see  how long that lasts during Sunday's game. Remember Cam's rookie year when everybody tried to make Cam beat them with his arm? over 300 yards in the first 2 games almost 400 in the 3rd. I pray they commit to stopping the run

[Mr. Scot]

Reasonable thought. Seattle has one of the best corner tandems in the league. They are big corners and play man press. Newton will see tighter windows to throw into and he hasn't looked all that accurate in preseason. If "It is what it is isn't good enough" then Cam needs to get better in the short passing game. The Hawks will force him to. There will be no more quantifying his performance with " for a rookie" or "in his second year". He said it himself. The time is now or Gettleman will be looking to draft a QB in a year or 2.

 

I don't think I'd play 'man press' with Ted Ginn.

 

Seahawks may be confident enough to do that.  I wouldn't.

[TbTeRRoR]

Force Newton to pass...

 

 

                ..... The guy who has more passing yards then any QB in his first two seasons.

 

He acts like Newton can't pass

Well  I was at the Seattle game last year and Cam sure as heck couldn't pass  in that one.    The only game I"ve been to in the Cam era that was worse was the Titans game the year before........*Shudders

 

 

Don't jump my nuts I know Cam can pass.......I'm just saying their only experience against Cam he was not really playing great.

[The Huddler]

Well  I was at the Seattle game last year and Cam sure as heck couldn't pass  in that one.    The only game I"ve been to in the Cam era that was worse was the Titans game the year before........*Shudders

 

 

Don't jump my nuts I know Cam can pass.......I'm just saying their only experience against Cam he was not really playing great.

fair enough!

[Mr. Scot]

Well  I was at the Seattle game last year and Cam sure as heck couldn't pass  in that one.    The only game I"ve been to in the Cam era that was worse was the Titans game the year before........*Shudders

 

Don't jump my nuts I know Cam can pass.......I'm just saying their only experience against Cam he was not really playing great.

 

Will grant that, but would add this:

 

If they haven't done their study on him using more than just that game, they're not doing their jobs.

 

 

[Floppin]

No shock.  That's probably going to be the same tactic defenses use all season.

 

Fair or not, the book on Newton is "take away the run and force him to pass".

 

It'll be up to Newton to prove it's a bad strategy.

 

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. That was the strategy during the first two games of 2011 and Cam literally tore the Cardinal and Packer defenses a new asshole. They sold out against the run and paid the price, though both ended up winning in shootout fashion because our defense was about half a dick-length better than the Saints of last year.

 

The strategy from that point forward was to play cover 2 and cover 3 zone schemes with various pre-snap defensive shifts to confuse Cam, while allowing your general 5 or 6 man box fronts to hold the running game at bay. 

 

You know why this worked? Well for the most part it didn't in 2011, it backfired in a way. Sure Cam's passing numbers went down, but our rushing totals went through the fuging roof that year. Again, our defense just sucked donkey ass.

 

It did work in 2012, however, because our O-line was absolute poo all year. Remember, going into the draft that year we, literally, didn't have a single LG, RG, or RT on the roster. We ended up singing Gary fuging Williams (who got hurt) so we signed Hangartner at RG, we let a Div 3 player start at LG and some UDFA lumbering fat guy from Kentucky (literally the worst BCS program in the country) start at RT. You want to know why they didn't have to focus on the run? Because Liberty University could have stuffed the run against the Panthers with their front four, last year. 

 

Anyhow, TL;DR version. Teams haven't sold out against the run on us since the first two games of 2011. If any team decides to show 8 and 9 in the box on a consistent basis, they are in for an assraping because Cam and our receivers can destroy 1v1 coverage all fuging day, and our defense is finally strong enough to keep the other team from scoring at will. 

[Mr. Scot]

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. That was the strategy during the first two games of 2011 and Cam literally tore the Cardinal and Packer defenses a new asshole. They sold out against the run and paid the price, though both ended up winning in shootout fashion because our defense was about half a dick-length better than the Saints of last year.

 

The strategy from that point forward was to play cover 2 and cover 3 zone schemes with various pre-snap defensive shifts to confuse Cam, while allowing your general 5 or 6 man box fronts to hold the running game at bay. 

 

You know why this worked? Well for the most part it didn't in 2011, it backfired in a way. Sure Cam's passing numbers went down, but our rushing totals went through the fuging roof that year. Again, our defense just sucked donkey ass.

 

It did work in 2012, however, because our O-line was absolute poo all year. Remember, going into the draft that year we, literally, didn't have a single LG, RG, or RT on the roster. We ended up singing Gary fuging Williams (who got hurt) so we signed Hangartner at RG, we let a Div 3 player start at LG and some UDFA lumbering fat guy from Kentucky (literally the worst BCS program in the country) start at RT. You want to know why they didn't have to focus on the run? Because Liberty University could have stuffed the run against the Panthers with their front four, last year. 

 

Anyhow, TL;DR version. Teams haven't sold out against the run on us since the first two games of 2011. If any team decides to show 8 and 9 in the box on a consistent basis, they are in for an assraping because Cam and our receivers can destroy 1v1 coverage all fuging day, and our defense is finally strong enough to keep the other team from scoring at will. 

 

Here's the thing:

 

Take a look at the paragraph you wrote about 2012. 

 

Now tell me you couldn't make those same statements about 2013 so far.

 

And here's another thing.  Teams haven't needed to play 8 in the box against us to stop the run for a long, long time.  That was especially true during the period when Chudzinski was stuck in 'read option' mode.

 

If you go by 'what have you done lately' (which all NFL teams do) then the strategy they describe is exactly what you'd want to use.  That, plus a 'spy' linebacker for when he runs.

 

Whether it's fair or not, opponents perception of Newton is that he's not a good enough passer to beat them with his arm.

 

My hope is that he proves that idea to be folly.  Until he does, this is what they'll say.

[Floppin]

Here's the thing:

 

Take a look at the paragraph you wrote about 2012. 

 

Now tell me you couldn't make those same statements about 2013 so far.

 

And here's another thing.  Teams haven't needed to play 8 in the box against us to stop the run for a long, long time.  That was especially true during the period when Chudzinski was stuck in 'read option' mode.

 

If you go by 'what have you done lately' (which all NFL teams do) then the strategy they describe is exactly what you'd want to use.  That, plus a 'spy' linebacker for when he runs.

 

Whether it's fair or not, opponents perception of Newton is that he's not a good enough passer to beat them with his arm.

 

My hope is that he proves that idea to be folly.  Until he does, this is what they'll say.

 

That may be what they say, but that's not how they play the defense. They don't sell out to stop the run, because they haven't needed to. Saying that they will "stop the run" doesn't really equate to anything other than "we don't think they can run". They aren't game planning in any way that is specific to stopping our prolific rushing attack. They are game planning to stop the passing attack, while summarily treating the run game as an after-thought. 

 

Now as to your "take a look at your paragraph about 2012" - take a second and think about it yourself. After Kalil went down in week three, we, literally, had TWO starting lineman (Gross, and Bell) from the year before. The whole middle of the line were NEW scrubs, and I'm sure you realize that the middle of the line is the most important part for the running game

 

We had:

Gross at LT,

a Div 3 Rookie (Amini) at LG,

Jeff fuging Byers an UDFA who had never started a game for anyone at C,

Hangartner (IE the worst RG in the league last year) at RG  

Bell again a second year and incredibly slow UDFA from Kentucky at RT

 

It can't get any worse than that. People say the Bears have the worst line, and I say that if Cutler had to play behind that line, he would be paralyzed right now. 

 

Sure they idea is that they stop the run and make Cam throw, but that doesn't mean that they are focused on the run - as I said. They will play a "passing defense" IE cover 2 and 3 zone schemes, under the assumption that our run game is going to sputter by default. Because if they actually play a defense geared towards stopping the run, then we will light their asses up. 

[MHS831]

I think we can upset them.  I just hope our biggest mismatch is not at head coach.

[Floppin]

Basically what I'm saying, boils down to this. 

 

There is no "book on stopping Cam", there's a book on "Stopping the Panthers" and that book the past two years has been "Sell out on the Pass because they can't run on a High School Team" 

 

Saying teams focus on stopping the run is just wrong, teams don't worry about us running because we haven't been able to in a year. If we had had a defense worth a poo in 2011 you would have seen what I mean. We had a top 5 offense with teams trying to stop the pass, because we ran all over their asses. Reason being those first two games when they sold out with 8,9 and 10 man fronts, Cam threw for almost 900 yards in two games. His first two games ever played in the NFL. If you think he's regressed since then as a passer then I've got news for you Jack. 

[Mr. Scot]

That may be what they say, but that's not how they play the defense. They don't sell out to stop the run, because they haven't needed to. Saying that they will "stop the run" doesn't really equate to anything other than "we don't think they can run". They aren't game planning in any way that is specific to stopping our prolific rushing attack. They are game planning to stop the passing attack, while summarily treating the run game as an after-thought. 

 

Now as to your "take a look at your paragraph about 2012" - take a second and think about it yourself. After Kalil went down in week three, we, literally, had TWO starting lineman (Gross, and Bell) from the year before. The whole middle of the line were NEW scrubs, and I'm sure you realize that the middle of the line is the most important part for the running game

 

We had:

Gross at LT,

a Div 3 Rookie (Amini) at LG,

Jeff fuging Byers an UDFA who had never started a game for anyone at C,

Hangartner (IE the worst RG in the league last year) at RG  

Bell again a second year and incredibly slow UDFA from Kentucky at RT

 

It can't get any worse than that. People say the Bears have the worst line, and I say that if Cutler had to play behind that line, he would be paralyzed right now. 

 

Sure they idea is that they stop the run and make Cam throw, but that doesn't mean that they are focused on the run - as I said. They will play a "passing defense" IE cover 2 and 3 zone schemes, under the assumption that our run game is going to sputter by default. Because if they actually play a defense geared towards stopping the run, then we will light their asses up. 

 

Remember the comments from opposing defenders about how the way to beat Newton was to play coverage rather than blitzing?

 

I've seen no indication that opposing DCs think any differently.  on the contrary: Wagner's comments confirm they still think that way.

 

You can think they're wrong - and I hope they are - but at this point, that's still their take.

[Jackofalltrades]

Over 400 yards per in his first 2 games as a pro.

At least get the facts straight.