NFL: One down

[weyco2000]

2 hours ago, PhillyB said:

i've never ever been a pro-tanker but i would 10/10 rather have a high draft pick next year than watch kyle allen play a playoff game

What the hell happened to you, seriously it's like you're pissed off because there's a chance. How would you feel if Cam was coming back this week, bet your opion of Allen would be totally supportive wouldn't it, as it should if you're a Panthers fan.

[PhillyB]

2 hours ago, stbugs said:

Really? Damn, you are that obsessed with Cam only that you’d rather get a higher draft pick than Kyle Allen be in the playoffs?

You are a sorry ass fan if you think that. I don’t see Allen as a goat, but we’d likely have to go 6-0 and beat the Saints twice and the Falcons once to make the playoffs. If you would rather see us lose those 3 games than give hope to anyone other than Cam being our savior then I don’t know why you are in here. Just follow Cam on social media and hope he leaves so you can be happy. Please stop posting in here.

Maybe I’m being harsh but there’s a difference as a “fan” between hoping for a high draft pick because we are realistically already out of it and hoping for a high draft pick rather than finish 11-5 and be in the playoffs.

I’d be ecstatic if Cam is truly healthy next year and he leads us to a Super Bowl, but you won’t catch me, as a real fan, saying that I’d rather not make the playoffs because it might hurt Cam’s feelings because he wasn’t part of it. I know it won’t happen but you seem to be saying you’d rather not even let Allen have a shot at winning us a Super Bowl. SMH.

i agree with almost all your takes and usually enjoy your posts. not sure why you're being a colossal dick right now, but i'll let it slide and just calmly address your point:

yes, i believe a high draft pick has a better chance of helping this franchise than 34th ranked kyle allen doing anything other than literally shitting his pants in a playoff game, let alone winning a super bowl.

don't you?

[kungfoodude]

I believe FiveThirtyEight has us as a 4% chance to make the playoffs in their Elo forecast. 

[mav1234]

20 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

Yes, i believe a high draft pick has a better chance of helping this franchise than 34th ranked kyle allen doing anything other than literally shitting his pants in a playoff game, let alone winning a super bowl.

don't you?

No because if this team goes basically undefeated down the stretch, the ONLY way that us posible is if Kyle Allen makes some insane (and likely impossible) leaps in his ability that would mean he as QB may be better than whatever we can get at 5-11.... and it would mean we could address other issues.

On top of that, the growth if young players from getting into the playoffs and going on that kind of streak shouldn't be ignored.

But that isn't happening and we will miss the playoffs. 

[stirs]

8 hours ago, PhillyB said:

i've never ever been a pro-tanker but i would 10/10 rather have a high draft pick next year than watch kyle allen play a playoff game

For Kyle Allen to even be in a playoff game would mean that we'd run the board.  If that were to happen, then it would mean that the Oline comes together, the Dline shows up and all skill players start playing well.

Going 11-5 after beating the Saints twice and going to the playoffs would actually be pretty nice.

But, I think you meant to say, lets play other guys, see what we have, experiment with different formations, all leading toward the offseason.

We won't, it's not Rons way.  Look at the end of last season where we dropped 8 spots in the draft just by beating the 3rd string Saints.  Ron not playing for the teams future, only his.

[PhillyB]

55 minutes ago, stbugs said:

I think you let some idiots turn you into a Cam only fan so that you truly despise Allen and actually enjoy watching us lose.

I think I misjudged you and you're not very perceptive

 

57 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Do a quick question in your head. Would you rather Kyle Allen lead us to a Super Bowl win causing us to release Cam or would you rather we go 5-11 and Cam is our QB next year? Simple question and your answer tells you if you’re a fan or not. 

the super bowl option obviously. do i have to explain to you how stupid this is?

[Waldo]

I think fans are reasonable to back tanking sometimes. It's all situational but being into position for a franchise QB is a thing. That is literally how we got Cam, 2010 and the epic fail it was had a huge silver lining that made Panther football the best it has ever been. That doesn't make you a bad fan, just opinionated realism. If anything, please stop acting like supporting crap makes the crap less crappy.

I also dont think Allen will get Trent Dilfer'ed into a SB, not this year here. He has positive traits but not enough to overcome his glaring negatives. This team isnt good enough around him this year to have that realistic expectations from me. He is another weak link in a chain that is completely underwhelming and mediocre.

[Snake]

9 hours ago, SBiii said:

Which is it, in your opinion?

What's your official position on Riverboat and Hurndog as it relates to them being employed by the Panthers in the 2020 season?

Will either remain employed with the team next year?

I think it's both and history backs me up. I think they both suck at talent evaluation and building a team together. If I was Tepper and had to choose just one it's Hurney. His FA picks and Draft picks have bombed quite bady. We know Rivera can win so long as there is a good GM behind him. What this team really needs is a reboot and Hurney isn't the man to do that. 

[Snake]

9 hours ago, Swedish Butt-Whistle said:

Fans accepting mediocrity.

More like owners. The stadium at home games shows what fans think. All those people are forced to pay no matter what yet they choose to do something else. 

[Mr. Scot]

I disagree with @PhillyB on this.

But I understand the temptation of the position.

I will always cheer for the Panthers to win. Embracing the idea of tanking just isn't in me.

But do I seriously believe this team has a chance?

No. I don't think even Lloyd Christmas would buy that idea.

That's why it's easy to think you'd rather the team be in a better position next year than win some meaningless games this year. And while I get that, my preference would still be that we win as many as we can and just make the best of whatever position we happen to be in when the time comes.

That comes with other pitfalls, mind you. Putting up a good showing might mean we keep our current coach and GM. I believe that's a horrible idea, but again, I just can't embrace losing. I'd rather hope that we win but still decide to move on (unlikely as that may be).

Regarding Kyle Allen, I don't think Phil is saying that he doesn't want him to succeed, but rather that he doesn't believe he can, and therefore it would be painful to watch.

Me? I still think Allen has potential, but my position on him is the same as it is on Newton. I don't really care who's quarterbacking as long as we win.

[Waldo]

33 minutes ago, stbugs said:

We have no chance to even make the playoffs. I’d rather lose out than go 8-8 and miss the playoffs by 3 games. That said, I’m not going to make a stupid comment about losing out being better than seeing Allen in the playoffs. True colors showing.

I didn't say losing out being better than seeing Allen in the playoffs. I said losing out would give us a better chance at a franchise QB which would be better than Allen. As far as the true colors bs, allen is not the answer and it doesn't make me more of a fan to play pretend. It's not because of Cam or Ron or whatever, it's because of Allen. That's my opinion. Just like I can want Ron and Hurney gone and yet still cheer and enjoy the team. You have over simplified it and I dont agree. I respect your right to an opinion even if I dont agree with it. The attitude I dont think is warranted.

[Waldo]

10 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Didn’t mean to imply you said that. Other guy, my bad carrying over the annoyance of people who reply as if they don’t want us to succeed because it slights Cam. I’m on the same page as you, losing out would be the best for the future and while it’s not impossible for Allen to improve, he may never so we need a better answer. We have maybe 7 or 8 wins at most. 5 wins would actually help us in the draft. 

This year is tough to swallow and I don't blame people for being angry and unsatisfied and just plain unreasonable. It happens and no worries. I have stepped that line a couple of times the last two years.

My approach to players who may get better or be more but aren't yet is to keep looking until you have the answer and even then it may not be the answer next year. I dont see it as attacking the player or being mean, I just see it as making the team better. Turner was a great OG and we had an answer at RG until he got paid and now we have an issue there. I'm not afraid of players having tough competition or being called out for not doing better. If Allen proves me wrong, I'll get over it and give him his due.

 

[Mr. Scot]

7 minutes ago, Waldo said:

My approach to players who may get better or be more but aren't yet is to keep looking until you have the answer and even then it may not be the answer next year. I dont see it as attacking the player or being mean, I just see it as making the team better. 

I agree with the approach.

I would say in one case, we've seen all we need to see.

That'd be Darryl Williams.

[Waldo]

Just now, Mr. Scot said:

I agree with the approach.

I would say in one case, we've seen all we need to see.

That'd be Darryl Williams.

It is still amazing how bad he really is and we have see a lot of it this year from him. This takes the whole worst case scenario thing to new depths.