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A Lot of Talk About LT ... Are You All Just Dismissing Greg Little?

SetfreexX

By SetfreexX,
in Carolina Panthers

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Peon Awesome Experienced

Peon Awesome

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, Snake said:

Luke had two major concussions. Little has had two major concussions in a year. There is no could be. There is facts. 

 

4 hours ago, mrcompletely11 said:

You dont think 2 concussions is a valid argument given that our HOF linebacker just literally retired because of them?  Am I reading that right?

You could just as easily make the argument that Luke had 2 major concussions and proceeded to go 3 full years without another concussion, garnering 2 1st team all-pros and a 2nd team all-pro in the process. Luke also never publicly proclaimed his retirement was due to concussions. Why retire nearly 4 years after your last concussion if that's the reason you're retiring? I'm sure trying to leave with his health intact was important to him, but he didn't once mention health concerns in his retirement announcement. Sounded more like someone who didn't feel like he was enjoying the game the way he used to and felt like he lost a step. Also no reason to think if he wanted to, he couldn't have been productive for at least few more years. Most players don't go from 2nd team all pro to washed up in 1 year. Even if you agree he wasn't peak Kuechly, he still looked like one or the better linebackers in the league despite getting zero help in front of him. 

Anyhow getting a little off tangent. Bottom line is if you're trying to argue Little is done because he'll end up just like Luke Kuechly, well I'd say we can only hope to be so lucky. 

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Toomers Mentor

Toomers

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48 minutes ago, Peon Awesome said:

 

You could just as easily make the argument that Luke had 2 major concussions and proceeded to go 3 full years without another concussion, garnering 2 1st team all-pros and a 2nd team all-pro in the process. Luke also never publicly proclaimed his retirement was due to concussions. Why retire nearly 4 years after your last concussion if that's the reason you're retiring? I'm sure trying to leave with his health intact was important to him, but he didn't once mention health concerns in his retirement announcement. Sounded more like someone who didn't feel like he was enjoying the game the way he used to and felt like he lost a step. Also no reason to think if he wanted to, he couldn't have been productive for at least few more years. Most players don't go from 2nd team all pro to washed up in 1 year. Even if you agree he wasn't peak Kuechly, he still looked like one or the better linebackers in the league despite getting zero help in front of him. 

Anyhow getting a little off tangent. Bottom line is if you're trying to argue Little is done because he'll end up just like Luke Kuechly, well I'd say we can only hope to be so lucky. 

  How did he go 3 years without one again? 
 

The first of the concussions in September 2015 caused him to miss three games. From the last, in October 2017, he was able to clear protocol and play the next week. The worst, however, was the middle one, a Grade 3 concussion in November 2016 that cost him the final six games of that season.

 

   If you watched him in college for 3 years, you could see the flaws. Effort being the main one. His was falling in the draft for a reason. 

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Peon Awesome Experienced

Peon Awesome

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23 minutes ago, Toomers said:

  How did he go 3 years without one again? 
 

The first of the concussions in September 2015 caused him to miss three games. From the last, in October 2017, he was able to clear protocol and play the next week. The worst, however, was the middle one, a Grade 3 concussion in November 2016 that cost him the final six games of that season.

 

   If you watched him in college for 3 years, you could see the flaws. Effort being the main one. His was falling in the draft for a reason. 

My bad, forgot about the one in 2017 since he came back so quick. But that's still 2 and a half years without one. And all the more reason to say that Luke is not the person you should be using as an example that Greg can't recover from his concussions. He actually had 3 and still came back as an elite linebacker. Greg having 2 isn't a definitive death sentence.

Whether Little will amount to anything is still up in the air. He may not. My point is that definitively making up your mind after an injury-shortened rookie year is premature, particularly when the learning curve for left tackles is tremendous. Simiarly, we shouldn't be ready to anoint him as our franchise left tackle already. I aspire to cautious hopefulness. 

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SmokinwithWilly Grand Master

SmokinwithWilly

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2 hours ago, Peon Awesome said:

In what world is Cam getting a 5 year $175 million contract? If he somehow plays this year at a level to deserve that contract without us investing in the offensive line, then the man must deserve it. I'm sorry but I don't think you're making the point you're trying to make and if you are, then you're not communicating it well. 

Dak just got offered 33m per year and turned it down. You think if Cam plays a full year, a former MVP isnt going to command some coin on the open market? I see 4-5 years/33-36 per year, 100m guaranteed is what he could be offered on the open market. It's not that far fetched. 

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Toomers Mentor

Toomers

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36 minutes ago, Peon Awesome said:

My bad, forgot about the one in 2017 since he came back so quick. But that's still 2 and a half years without one. And all the more reason to say that Luke is not the person you should be using as an example that Greg can't recover from his concussions. He actually had 3 and still came back as an elite linebacker. Greg having 2 isn't a definitive death sentence.

Whether Little will amount to anything is still up in the air. He may not. My point is that definitively making up your mind after an injury-shortened rookie year is premature, particularly when the learning curve for left tackles is tremendous. Simiarly, we shouldn't be ready to anoint him as our franchise left tackle already. I aspire to cautious hopefulness. 

  I made up my mind well before we picked him. Last year did nothing to change my opinion of him. 
 

    

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Peon Awesome Experienced

Peon Awesome

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7 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

Dak just got offered 33m per year and turned it down. You think if Cam plays a full year, a former MVP isnt going to command some coin on the open market? I see 4-5 years/33-36 per year, 100m guaranteed is what he could be offered on the open market. It's not that far fetched. 

My point is that the only scenario where any team would even contemplate offering Cam that kind of insane contract after his first healthy year in 3 years is if he comes back and plays at an MVP level. And if he's able to do that with our offensive line as it is currently constructed, then you could argue he might actually deserve that. But if he comes back and has an expectedly shaky year behind our shaky line, then no one, not the Panthers or any other team, is going to offer him anything close to that.

Going back to your original post, giving him a better offensive line isn't going to make it more likely that we give Cam a contract he's worth; if anything it's more likely to do the opposite and cause us to overpay him. Let's say we give him the best offensive line in the NFL so he has forever to pass and looks better than he probably should get credit for. Then we decide to throw a bajillion dollars at him, leaving us with little money to keep the line intact, so the second someone gets injured, Cam is running for his life and looks human again. And of course he'll likely start racking up the hits and might get hurt again. Now we're stuck with a broken Cam that we can't get rid of cause we gave him $100 million in guarantees, all cause we made him look immortal for 1 year behind a premium offensive line.

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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15 hours ago, JARROD said:

Micheal Oher played like 10 seasons before being applesauce.

we should be so lucky if Little worked out like that.

I am just impressed he was able to squeeze 10 seasons of play into an 8 year career.

Also, his 2015 campaign of being above average was the best season of his career. He was an average NFL OT. Given our current plight at LT, average would be amazing.

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JARROD Contributor

JARROD

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6 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

I am just impressed he was able to squeeze 10 seasons of play into an 8 year career.

Also, his 2015 campaign of being above average was the best season of his career. He was an average NFL OT. Given our current plight at LT, average would be amazing.

“Like”  google boy

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Snake Grand Master

Snake

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19 hours ago, Peon Awesome said:

 

You could just as easily make the argument that Luke had 2 major concussions and proceeded to go 3 full years without another concussion, garnering 2 1st team all-pros and a 2nd team all-pro in the process. Luke also never publicly proclaimed his retirement was due to concussions. Why retire nearly 4 years after your last concussion if that's the reason you're retiring? I'm sure trying to leave with his health intact was important to him, but he didn't once mention health concerns in his retirement announcement. Sounded more like someone who didn't feel like he was enjoying the game the way he used to and felt like he lost a step. Also no reason to think if he wanted to, he couldn't have been productive for at least few more years. Most players don't go from 2nd team all pro to washed up in 1 year. Even if you agree he wasn't peak Kuechly, he still looked like one or the better linebackers in the league despite getting zero help in front of him. 

Anyhow getting a little off tangent. Bottom line is if you're trying to argue Little is done because he'll end up just like Luke Kuechly, well I'd say we can only hope to be so lucky. 

You could also say he retired because of those concussions. Oh wait that's exactly why he retired early. Not to mention LBs are at a lower risk level than OTs. I mean there is that. 

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