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I’ve never seen Panthers.com poop on a starting QB this much, not even Clausen

thunderraiden

By thunderraiden,
in Carolina Panthers

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KSpan Grand Master

KSpan

Posted
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15 minutes ago, cookinbrak said:

Let me preface by saying we need a change at qb, but think about this- Teddy went 5-0 last year in the NO system, yet was 4-11 in ours. Part of the problem is that we have average play at several positions. Teddy diidnt win or lose any game single-handidly. So, by all means, let's trade away our best players and draft picks.

That encapsulates the entire experience though with this type of QB. Their team can win when they're surrounded with excellence, but they can't/won't elevate the team when they're not: we saw that time and again this year.

With the nature of the NFL (injuries, roster churn, etc.), IMO that's simply not acceptable for a full-time starter of a team that wants to compete year in and year out. "Possibly good enough when everything goes right" can't preclude striving for better, particularly when the weaknesses are so glaring and easily exploited.

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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15 minutes ago, SetfreexX said:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/carolina-panthers/teddy-bridgewater-14441/

Teddy is here until 2022, 20M in dead money if cut this off-season (2021), the June 1st designation if memory serves is to spread the hit out over two seasons. That would make no sense when we need that money. 

In this case it's cheaper to keep him, give the new QB, most likely a rookie someone to compete with. 

He said trade. The cap hit is smaller in a trade scenario after June 1st. 

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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8 minutes ago, KSpan said:

That encapsulates the entire experience though with this type of QB. Their team can win when they're surrounded with excellence, but they can't/won't elevate the team when they're not: we saw that time and again this year.

With the nature of the NFL (injuries, roster churn, etc.), IMO that's simply not acceptable for a full-time starter of a team that wants to compete year in and year out. "Possibly good enough when everything goes right" can't preclude striving for better, particularly when the weaknesses are so glaring and easily exploited.

Hence why I was so averse to bringing in a game managing type QB. It makes the job of building a successful franchise so much harder. Game managers don't have the greatness to cover the weaknesses of others. 

It's amazing that some Panthers fans don't have an appreciation for that after watching Cam have to drag a perpetual assortment of "who dat" players on offense up and down the field most Sundays. 

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davos Grand Master

davos

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1 hour ago, Soul Rebel said:

Though I'd love it, I don't see how we make a deal more appealing than what the NYJ or MIA can offer him without setting our team back 4-5 seasons with lost assets. 

NYJ: Darnold (25 yr old QB former #3 overall pick), 2021 #2 overall pick, 2021 #23 overall pick

MIA: Tua (23 yr old QB former #5 overall pick), 2021 #3 overall pick, 2021 #18 overall pick ... and, it's South Beach in a state with no income taxes.

CAR: Bridgewater (28 yr old QB) or CMC (former #8 overall pick), 2021 #8 pick

Watson can veto any trade, so I could see that possibly with NYJ, but Miami....come on.  A top-5 NFL QB making $20+million a year and could go be thee premier star in a major metropolis like Miami, why would I go to Carolina over that?

Miami is a Watson QB away from being a perennial AFC contender. Flores is a coach that players want to play for, that team is young and knocking on the door of the playoffs. 

What Houston would ask of us would set us back so far. I'm okay with three years' worth of firsts and Teddy, but after that I think the risk-reward starts to hurt too much. We still have an incomplete OL, no CB1, a dance partner needed for Brown at iDL and three WRs that are within two years of walking.

If we overpay, we are no better than Houston was with Watson.

Valid points regarding Houston's potential returns but I think the huddle is undervaluing Shaq Thompson who I think is a perfect trade piece and could fit really well in their 3-4 base w/4-3 packages as an ILB.  They've also needed a stable LB for some time now.  He's not a superstar but there's a lot of teams that he could very much help.

My ideal package (cue the madden jokes) would be something along the lines of:

2021 1st/8th overall + 2021 3rd + 2022 1st + 2024 1st + CMC + Shaq Thompson.  You do 3 1sts to outbid the Jets and teams higher in the draft. 

That also evens out the cap differential and then we cut Bridgwater after June 1st.  $15 mil dead cash but we'll get like 5 mil in space, then we'd have picks in rd 2, 4, 5, 6, 6 comp at a minimum to look at OL, CB, & RB.  On Houston's end, they can cut David Johnson this offseason and I don't think they'd mind CMC on offense and Shaq on defense to fit with maybe Trey Lance or maybe they hold out for Howell with all their new capital.

With Short & Weatherly cut, we could tag Moton and have some room to sign a vet or two ~1-2 year deals 1-2.5m per year.  Then we bank on Roy & Kerr growing into their roles and Jackson, Pride, & Elder again in the back with maybe a new draftee. 

My overall objective would be keeping either our 2022 or 2023 1st in a Watson trade.  Just one of those two.  It's A LOT of assets but maybe, just maybe...

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