Mike Florio & Rich Eisen discuss Rhule & Tepper

[BlitzMonster]

26 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

Last I saw, I think it was nine.

Given Rhule had a year of experience as the Giants OL coach, I thought he'd be much better at figuring out our OL problem.  I thought that would be one of his strengths.  But it's just been a mess.

• Poor talent evaluation in the free agency signings of Cameron Erving and Pat Elflein
• virtually no playing time for the rookies (even though the vets in front of them stink)
• what playing time the rooks got, they were constantly shifted to different positions 

It's like a seminar in how not to coach an NFL line.

[grimesgoat]

18 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

You seriously think someone else on the team just decided we should have a bunch of Temple and Baylor players on roster, or that Robby Anderson needed to get a big extension?

Yeah, sure

See, this is key: Those examples you cited, Matt Rhule is in charge of every one of those things.

He hires the coordinators and assistant coaches. The strength and conditioning people are his people from Baylor. He has final say over roster decisions, depth chart rankings, free agent signings and draft picks. I mean hell, he even helped choose the GM.

In the area of football operations, there's nobody that the team has hired, signed, drafted, traded for or in any way acquired that Matt Rhule didn't sign off on. That's the kind of power David Tepper have him, and it's not like he argued against it. This is the sort of arrangement he wanted.

Knowing this, any suggestion that he should be absolved of blame for the current state of the organization is pretty weak.

I have no doubt we have a number of temple and baylor players on the roster because matt rhule is familiar with those guys and they are familiar with him.  That alone does not make them unqualified.

Same with any assistants.  Who better to execute your vision is people you are familiar with and have worked with.  If these guys are good, they will stand out and get hired away to other teams.  He had success before with these people, he probably thought he could do so again.  Frankly, I was surprised we ended up with Brady because Rhule did not have a relation with him - which makes me think Tepper had his hands on that one.

I guess we agree on all of this except you see it as a bad thing but I see it as probably what happens everywhere you look.  I can't imagine a new coach going to a team and hiring a bunch of strangers he's never met to be his closest advisors.

But your last sentence is a puzzler.  I feel like you may be putting words in my mouth there.  I was onboard with hiring the guy, but given the current state, I'd be ok if we moved on at this point.  He just doesn't seem ready yet and after almost 2 years, the fanbase is all out of patience.

[Mr. Scot]

29 minutes ago, grimesgoat said:

I have no doubt we have a number of temple and baylor players on the roster because matt rhule is familiar with those guys and they are familiar with him.  That alone does not make them unqualified.

Same with any assistants.  Who better to execute your vision is people you are familiar with and have worked with.  If these guys are good, they will stand out and get hired away to other teams.  He had success before with these people, he probably thought he could do so again.  Frankly, I was surprised we ended up with Brady because Rhule did not have a relation with him - which makes me think Tepper had his hands on that one.

I guess we agree on all of this except you see it as a bad thing but I see it as probably what happens everywhere you look.  I can't imagine a new coach going to a team and hiring a bunch of strangers he's never met to be his closest advisors.

But your last sentence is a puzzler.  I feel like you may be putting words in my mouth there.  I was onboard with hiring the guy, but given the current state, I'd be ok if we moved on at this point.  He just doesn't seem ready yet and after almost 2 years, the fanbase is all out of patience.

Their origin isn't what shows them to be unqualified.

Their performance does.

The question of who better to execute your vision is a two part answer. At the pro level, it's people who are capable of coaching professional players to professional level results. If you're Matt Rhule however, and all you have is a college level vision, then your buddies from Temple and Baylor will do just fine.

And again, to be clear I don't begrudge Matt Rhule the ability to hire whomever he thinks is qualified.  Where the problem comes in is that Rhule himself isn't qualified for a pro level job, so why would he know how to hire pro level assistants?

The bottom line here is that we hired a college coach who brought with him a college staff to try and do a professional job...

...and they failed.

So here's to not making that mistake again.

[BlitzMonster]

3 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

The bottom line here is that we hired a college coach who brought with him a college staff to try and do a professional job...

...and they failed.

After 2 years in the NFL we see Rhule is clearly over his head.  No effective game plans.   No in game or in season adjustments.   Questionable personnel decisions.  Salary cap issues after handing out large contracts to guys who have underperformed.  A complete lack of young player development.  He's doing poorly at pretty much all the things an NFL coach is responsible for. 

So the big question becomes "can Rhule get better ?"  And that's a tough one.   Tepper is an experienced owner and Fitterer has many years in the NFL as well.  Can they guide Rhule to become a better head coach ?  Do they think Rhule is salvageable ? It's much easier to just fire an underperforming employee than to manage them toward better job performance.  

[Mr. Scot]

10 minutes ago, BlitzMonster said:

After 2 years in the NFL we see Rhule is clearly over his head.  No effective game plans.   No in game or in season adjustments.   Questionable personnel decisions.  Salary cap issues after handing out large contracts to guys who have underperformed.  A complete lack of young player development.  He's doing poorly at pretty much all the things an NFL coach is responsible for. 

So the big question becomes "can Rhule get better ?"  And that's a tough one.   Tepper is an experienced owner and Fitterer has many years in the NFL as well.  Can they guide Rhule to become a better head coach ?  Do they think Rhule is salvageable ? It's much easier to just fire an underperforming employee than to manage them toward better job performance.  

You hire a head coach to guide an organization toward being a championship contender.

If you have to mold that coach into a guy that can do that (basically coach the coach) then you're essentially admitting he can't do that in his own ability. And if you've got to teach him what to do, how long does that take?

And geez, why the hell would any team want to go that route?

Edited December 15, 2021 by Mr. Scot

[BlitzMonster]

52 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

You hire a head coach to guide an organization toward being a championship contender.

If you have to mold that coach into a guy that can do that (basically coach the coach) then you're essentially admitting he can't do that in his own ability. And if you've got to teach him what to do, how long does that take?

And geez, why the hell would any team want to go that route?

Every manager should help their direct reports get better at their jobs, including Tepper and Fitterer.  But you shouldn't be expected to teach the person absolutely every job task.  And that's what seems to be necessary with Rhule.   I really can't think of anything that he's doing well as a Head Coach in the NFL.   It would require a huge amount of effort to get him competent for this role. 

[Captain Obvious]

Don't care. I am officially all out of fugs to give about this damn team this year.

 

 

[jayboogieman]

2 hours ago, grimesgoat said:

Frankly, I was surprised we ended up with Brady because Rhule did not have a relation with him - which makes me think Tepper had his hands on that one.

Not true. According to the article posted here when Brady was fired, Rhule admitted he went out of his comfort zone and hired Brady as a splash move to impress Tepper.

[jayboogieman]

1 hour ago, BlitzMonster said:

 Tepper is an experienced owner and Fitterer has many years in the NFL as well.  Can they guide Rhule to become a better head coach ?

Tepper having experience running a hedge fund and being a minority owner does not mean he is an experienced majority owner. It also doesn't mean he has the experience to coach a football coach.

Fitterer is under Rhule in the hierarchy, so I highly doubt Rhule would listen to him when it comes to coaching decisions.

And as Mr Scot said, if Rhule needs coaching up, he's not the man to be an NFL head coach.

[Ricky Spanish]

32 minutes ago, Captain Obvious said:

Don't care. I am officially all out of fugs to give about this damn team this year.

 

 

I have already written this year off, but the reason I'm bitching so much right now is that I still have hope that we will move on from Rhule at year's end. 

If we keep him one more year, I'm honestly not bothering with this team until Rhule starts winning or he gets fired, whichever comes first.

[Mr. Scot]

42 minutes ago, BlitzMonster said:

Every manager should help their direct reports get better at their jobs, including Tepper and Fitterer.  But you shouldn't be expected to teach the person absolutely every job task.  And that's what seems to be necessary with Rhule.   I really can't think of anything that he's doing well as a Head Coach in the NFL.   It would require a huge amount of effort to get him competent for this role. 

There was a time when it would have been possible to have someone with experience help him transition into an NFL head coaching role.

That time would have been when he was hired, and the appropriate person would have been a former NFL head coach added to his staff.

That didn't happen, and two years in we're waaaay past the time when that would be practical.

[Basbear]

1 hour ago, Captain Obvious said:

Don't care. I am officially all out of fugs to give about this damn team this year.

 

 

[Ship]

Hurney was kept, along with Ron because Tepper wanted to learn the personnel side of football management. He wanted to see them in action and make his own decision. Then he fired both of them.

[jerrya]

10 hours ago, glenwo2 said:

Not sure if I've done this yet to you but I apologize for being such an asshat in my misguided defense of Sam.

I wanted so bad for him to be NOT-who-he-really-is that I ignored the warning signs you were putting out. 

Would like to see Sam run the Offense with the new OC