Sam Howell declares for the draft

[WOW!!]

1 minute ago, Bartin said:

Trade down 9 times, draft 14 OL because they can't all suck then let Darnold fail for another year, fire Rhule then draft the Bama or Ohio State QB in 2023 with the #1 pick

Yeah other then the Madden plan of trading down 9 times.. I agree trade down build the Oline and find your QB next season..

[AU-panther]

37 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

I mean less than 50% for each prospect individually. 

We just aren't going to agree on this. I view this as a bad QB draft class and you don't. It is what it is.

I certainly hope that the team doesn't share your rosy view because I don't really want to see us end up in further QB purgatory as we go down this Cleveland Browns road we are currently on.

I agree that a team might evaluate this QB class and feel like none have a good enough chance to be great to warrant a pick, but the Browns are a terrible example.

They weren't bad because they kept drafting QBs, they were bad because they were bad at drafting QBs.

They had one of the best LTs of all time and it did them no good.

 

 

[kungfoodude]

2 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

I agree that a team might evaluate this QB class and feel like none have a good enough chance to be great to warrant a pick, but the Browns are a terrible example.

They weren't bad because they kept drafting QBs, they were bad because they were bad at drafting QBs.

They had one of the best LTs of all time and it did them no good.

 

 

The Browns is only a bad example because at this point in their run from 1999-2017, they had a lot more success than we have had.

Make no mistake, we are the Cleveland Browns, circa 99-17.

[KatsAzz]

10 hours ago, ladypanther said:

No QB until we get an Oline.

Bingo. No QB is going to succeed with the Panthers until they get a quality NFL type offensive line. To think outherwise would be foolish.

[CPantherKing]

Only 1 QB in this draft class that could win a championship at the NFL level, and he won't be among the first 5 QBs selected.

So, strong pass on Howell as a starting NFL QB. UNC fan blinders are on with this one.

[AU-panther]

4 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

The Browns is only a bad example because at this point in their run from 1999-2017, they had a lot more success than we have had.

Make no mistake, we are the Cleveland Browns, circa 99-17.

Were the browns bad because they had a bad LT or bad QB? 

[LinvilleGorge]

Anyone wishing any rookie QB here as long as Rhule and company here is a sick bastard. 

Fire Rhule. Hire an offensive minded HC who will prioritize OL. THEN address QB. That could still be in this year's draft. But #1 and #2 have to precede #3.

[KatsAzz]

2 hours ago, Ivan The Awesome said:

I'm a UNC die hard and I don't want him.. tf. xD

I am UNC diehard fan also and i don't want him.

[LinvilleGorge]

Just now, AU-panther said:

Were the browns bad because they had a bad LT or bad QB? 

They had the best LT of his era for a decade.

[kungfoodude]

1 minute ago, AU-panther said:

Were the browns bad because they had a bad LT or bad QB? 

They were bad because they had no fuging clue what they were doing as a franchise and paraded QB after QB out there to fail.

Fun fact, we've had more QB's start games than they did during the beginning of that stretch.

[AU-panther]

2 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

They were bad because they had no fuging clue what they were doing as a franchise and paraded QB after QB out there to fail.

Fun fact, we've had more QB's start games than they did during the beginning of that stretch.

Then we have the same problem.  We need to find a QB.

[electro's horse]

here's a good write up on Howell from someone who works in the industry on another board

tl;dr he sucks

This is about comparing him to baker mayfield

Quote

They’re actually right in a physical/tangible sense. Gunslinger isn’t really the term for either of them because that implies big arms. Gambler or improviser is probably a better category. The more I see of him, the more I think he’s fool’s gold and headed for bust territory.

He’s not really a gunslinger because that implies he’s pressing into windows he can hit. Even with an extremely aggressive and torque-y delivery that should maximize velocity, his arm isn’t there and he misses windows he’s trying to throw to with balls that float and are too soft. Baker does do that delivery but has a bigger arm and showed way better placement in an offense that let him read more than Howell’s fisher price RPO offense with trash tier blocking. They’ll both do some scrabble drill bullshit too and can move on rolls and boots to at least try to improve angles he can throw into.

The fundamental problem is this—consider Mayfield. When he’s hurt or has anything wrong that throws off his mechanics, he doesn’t have enough arm to compensate because he’s at his limit, meaning he either has to lighten up to hit a spot or risk missing. To steal a strength coach line, “absolute strength is the glass, skills are the water”, where your arm is absolute strength. Similarly, he’s limited on height. When he can’t move out of pocket and has injuries to his legs or shoulders, he moves less which limits his vision since his ability to get to read 3+ usually requires at a minimum stepping up or sideways. That’s another limitation with little margin.

Now consider Howell. Objectively worse arm than baker in every facet. Arguably recognizes things similarly if a little worse but in a simpler offense. He can see better and is a bit bigger but is always running to get to read 2+ because his line will kill him if the play design doesn’t. He might see more from the pocket in the NFL than baker, but it doesn’t matter what you see if you can’t hit it for one reason for another. So even my most generous read of his abilities would inherently mean he’s coming in from a far worse place than prospect Baker.

I wouldn’t touch him before round 3 personally. The upside isn’t worth what you’d need to do.

Ranking upside:

Willis
Ridder
Corral
Strong
Pickett
Howell

Ranking floor:
Pickett
Corral
Ridder
Strong
Howell
Willis

Howell has shown the least potential in the simplest offense and just doesn’t show a remarkable trait I would bank on in the NFL. Willis could run. Corral has a plus arm and moves well enough to run verts. Strong throws an amazing deep ball. Pickett does everything Howell does but way cleaner. Ridder is just as accurate as Howell but with better physical traits. He really just feels like a guy that will stay on rosters as a clubhouse guy who learns the playbook but just doesn’t have enough to him. Bryce Petty wouldn’t be an unfair comparison at this point.

 

Edited January 3, 2022 by electro's horse

[KatsAzz]

7 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

Only 1 QB in this draft class that could win a championship at the NFL level, and he won't be among the first 5 QBs selected.

So, strong pass on Howell as a starting NFL QB. UNC fan blinders are on with this one.

 

What is the name of the  QB  that in your opinion that could win a championship at the NFL level, but won't be among the first 5 QBs selected?

[mrcompletely11]

4 minutes ago, AU-panther said:

Then we have the same problem.  We need to find a QB.

we draft a qb at 6 and then what?