QB breakdowns by Josh McCown

[MHS831]

1 hour ago, ForJimmy said:

Yeah I can't grasp the people who don't want a QB in the first or even trading up.  If our staff is as good as advertised we would be losing 2 mid to late first rounders for the chance to have a new franchise QB.  I think we are so accustomed to having a top 10 pick we think those first rounders could be CMC, Horn, Brown, or even another Luke but honestly it's more like another Shaq, Benjamin etc...  Burns was a solid pick in the middle of the draft though, but the money we save having a QB on the rookie scale can be used to sign a pass rusher.  

It hurts, but you have to do it.  It really is the only reason I was in tank mode this year.  Winning a meaningless game is like getting a Valentine from the ugliest girl in third grade.  When you are an adult.

[Martin]

2 hours ago, Kentucky Panther said:

I am absolutely burnt out from the recycled QBs we’ve had the last three seasons. And I like a lot of what I see from CJ. If our staff is all in then I definitely am as well. The picks won’t hurt as bad if we have a couple solid seasons. Which I think we are more than capable of having with this staff and roster. 

I agree, and this is the hard part. We just want some kind of hope at this point

[LinvilleGorge]

10 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

One of my favorite criticisms is "Stroud throws to open WRs."  Umm that's what he is suppose to do???

I get the criticism though. Due to the offensive system and the incredible surrounding talent he simply has more opportunities to throw to guys who are just wide ass open. It's why evaluating QBs that play for elite college teams is tough. His team is simply considerably more talented and better coached than the opposing team virtually every week. It's not a criticism of the prospect as much as it's simply an acknowledgement of that particular scouting challenge. Is he still the same guy in a less favorable situation?

 

[ForJimmy]

9 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I get the criticism though. Due to the offensive system and the incredible surrounding talent he simply has more opportunities to throw to guys who are just wide ass open. It's why evaluating QBs that play for elite college teams is tough. His team is simply considerably more talented and better coached than the opposing team virtually every week. It's not a criticism of the prospect as much as it's simply an acknowledgement of that particular scouting challenge. Is he still the same guy in a less favorable situation?

 

It's not criticism though.  It's nothing he is doing wrong.  It is more of an unknown like you have already stated.  Honestly though I have seen him make plenty of tough throws in tight windows.  I know he had a great WR in Harrison Jr, but Stroud got plenty of other playmakers involved and many of those BIG10 defenses had NFL talent at the CB position.  He also really didn't have a drop off when he played against UGA's defense.  

[jayboogieman]

48 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Hmmm...

https://www.si.com/nfl/panthers/gm-report/thomas-brown-describes-offensive-identity-what-he-wants-in-a-qb-more

What kind of quarterback he wants

"A really good one. There's all different kind of guys that come in all shapes and sizes. But to me, it's an ongoing conversation we've had over the last couple days. It's about who fits into this system, being selfless from a mentality standpoint, but also having a point guard mentality. Being able to distribute the ball to your playmakers. And on third down, red zone, two-minute, go play Superman."

Sounds like Young to me

[MHS831]

3 minutes ago, jayboogieman said:

Sounds like Young to me

That last line, about going to play superman, might be any of them--but you could be right.  I doubt they are going to say anything that would reveal who they are picking, but there are the tea leaves.

[jayboogieman]

1 hour ago, mrcompletely11 said:

Weight.  Frame.   

Fran Tarkenton weighed 190 or so when playing. Sonny Jurgenson was maybe 202 when playing. Eddie LeBaron was 5'7" and weighed less than 170 and played 12 years in the NFL. Doug Flutie weighed 180 during his playing days. Drew Brees was only a little over 200 pounds during his playing days.

All these height, weight, frame arguments don't mean poo. If the guy can play and take a hit, he can play. And Young can has proven he can do that against future NFL guys.

[jayboogieman]

7 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

That last line, about going to play superman, might be any of them--but you could be right.  I doubt they are going to say anything that would reveal who they are picking, but there are the tea leaves.

Yeah, they're not going to tip their hand if they can help it. From day 1 when the coaches were saying what they wanted in a QB made me think Young was the guy they had in mind. Stroud would be the second choice provided you're getting UGA game Stroud instead of can't handle pressure in his face Stroud. Richardson and Levis are more of mixed bags.

[mrcompletely11]

12 minutes ago, jayboogieman said:

Fran Tarkenton weighed 190 or so when playing. Sonny Jurgenson was maybe 202 when playing. Eddie LeBaron was 5'7" and weighed less than 170 and played 12 years in the NFL. Doug Flutie weighed 180 during his playing days. Drew Brees was only a little over 200 pounds during his playing days.

All these height, weight, frame arguments don't mean poo. If the guy can play and take a hit, he can play. And Young can has proven he can do that against future NFL guys.

Fran tarkatan you say?

[kungfoodude]

20 minutes ago, jayboogieman said:

Fran Tarkenton weighed 190 or so when playing. Sonny Jurgenson was maybe 202 when playing. Eddie LeBaron was 5'7" and weighed less than 170 and played 12 years in the NFL. Doug Flutie weighed 180 during his playing days. Drew Brees was only a little over 200 pounds during his playing days.

All these height, weight, frame arguments don't mean poo. If the guy can play and take a hit, he can play. And Young can has proven he can do that against future NFL guys.

This will just be another thing to laugh at in a few years when height and weight are brought up. Same shade that keeps getting thrown at these smaller QB's that are currently getting massive contracts in the NFL.

The thought process just isn't sound.

[MHS831]

1 hour ago, jayboogieman said:

Yeah, they're not going to tip their hand if they can help it. From day 1 when the coaches were saying what they wanted in a QB made me think Young was the guy they had in mind. Stroud would be the second choice provided you're getting UGA game Stroud instead of can't handle pressure in his face Stroud. Richardson and Levis are more of mixed bags.

When I think of the person who is a student of the game and can process quickly, Young is the guy.  Nothing against Stroud--Stroud might be the most cerebral QB (meaning more reliant on his brain and less reliant on his athleticism) Ohio St QB in a very long time.  Stroud reads defenses, and running is not as much of an option as it was with Fields and those before him--I could be wrong--just my take.

[jayboogieman]

1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

This will just be another thing to laugh at in a few years when height and weight are brought up. Same shade that keeps getting thrown at these smaller QB's that are currently getting massive contracts in the NFL.

The thought process just isn't sound.

I don't blame the players asking for as much as they are. These guys know they have a limited NFL window regardless of their size. I also get the feeling a lot of the younger guys don't love the game truly and view it more of as a means to an end. And that end is getting rich.

And yeah, the whole size things is a dumb argument. Cam was one of the biggest QBs ever and it didn't do him a bit of good. He barely made it a decade in the NFL. Brees, a much smaller QB, played nearly 20 years in the league. Playing style seems to matter more and Young has a style that translates to longevity in the NFL.

[jayboogieman]

10 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

When I think of the person who is a student of the game and can process quickly, Young is the guy.  Nothing against Stroud--Stroud might be the most cerebral QB (meaning more reliant on his brain and less reliant on his athleticism) Ohio St QB in a very long time.  Stroud reads defenses, and running is not as much of an option as it was with Fields and those before him--I could be wrong--just my take.

I agree with you. Young can also make plays dancing around in the pocket or rolling out that the others just haven't done. If Young had Stroud's size, people would say Young is a unicorn or generational talent. Instead, people focus on his size and claim he's too small ignoring his body of work and NFL history.

I still think Stroud benefited from his supporting cast more than any other QB in the draft. He had the best WR by miles and probably the best Oline while being in a very QB friendly system. Even Georgia's vaunted defense barely got pressure on him in their game. That's what I'm concerned with the most in Stroud's case. He had one good game against an equal or perhaps superior team where he truly stepped up, which was on the largest stage. Can he do that week in and week out? I don't think he can. Young on the other hand had stepped up in those sorts of games more than once and even lost some where he didn't play his best. Yet, he still did enough to win if Bama's defense could have gotten a stop or two. Young's a gamer and should be the pick if the Panthers have the chance.

[Tr3ach]

4 hours ago, ladypanther said:

Like I said, I trust this staff.  My concern is whether any of these guys are really worth the price.  If Young were taller he would be a no brainer.

Exactly.  I would love for them to really feel 100% on a qb and i hope they do, but if they dont, i dont agree with all the fans saying theyre tired of not drafting a qb so take one early no matter what because we need one.  What if we had just taken one early no matter what the past couple drafts?  We still wouldnt be set 100% at qb because none of them in the past 2 drafts have looked great.  Some people will make a case for Fields but im not there yet.  He could be fine in a really specialized offense.