No one has a long Leash (including Reich)

[tukafan21]

2 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

I feel like there is a very similar path with the possibility of Evero and Morgan taking over in the offseason or earlier to see what they can do before the full reset in 2025.  

I could see it happening, but with Morgan and Deuce, not Evero.

I wouldn't be okay with Evero as HC, or any defensive minded coach for that matter, not in today's NFL.

Perfect reason why is to look at the Bills right now.

Defensive minded coaches who end up with great offenses because of an OC, lose that OC to another HC job and then can't replace the magic, look how much worse Allen has been since they lost Daboll.

You can't need to depend on needing to replace your OC every few years and expect long term success, not with today's game and how it's moving.  You need to get the HC who keeps the offensive philosophy flowing, it's how teams like the 49ers are able to keep cycling in new OC's without a problem, but teams like the Bills or Patriots can't get it done because of their DC based HC's.

[OldhamA]

Just now, tukafan21 said:

And replacing Reich with someone who isn't going to be an elite HC is the right move?

It will literally only put us in a worse place moving forward.

It's not about intentionally tanking the season, it's about being realistic about the attractiveness of your franchise and it's ability to bring in a high quality HC candidate.

Unless Bryce has some miracle turnaround in the second half, no good HC candidate is going to tie their career to that wagon, they just won't.

Most HC's get one chance at the job, not many get a second.  They're not going to tie themselves to Bryce and an owner that has proven to have a short leash if not successful.

That's all it's about, and sure, I feel bad for people who spend their money on the product, but if you're a PSL owner who wants to keep your tickets forever, do you really want to make yet another move that will set us back even more?

How do you know they're not going to be an elite HC?

The move that needs to be made in the offseason is a new GM, with full control over football operations, being brought in - he then hires his own HC and is given 3 years to rebuild the roster. 

We don't have a first round pick next year, but we have a pick in the next 6 rounds AND we have to work out what we're doing with Burns (either tagged and traded or given an albatross contract). Do you really want Fitterer in charge of any of that? It just delays the rebuild and handcuffs the next GM.

[tukafan21]

18 minutes ago, BrisbanePanther said:

This feels like a repeat of a Rhule-era post unfortunately.

I'm not advocating for a 7 year plan, that was just a stupid statement from the start.

But this franchise is bare bones at the moment, we don't have a single long term franchise building block at the moment.

We're in year 0 of a complete re-build at the moment and we don't even have our 1st round pick coming up.

People don't like the truth, but it's the unfortunate reality we are current in with this franchise.

[OldhamA]

6 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

I feel like there is a very similar path with the possibility of Evero and Morgan taking over in the offseason or earlier to see what they can do before the full reset in 2025.  

I wouldn't mind Evero being given interim-HC duties (even though it's a kiss of death), but he wouldn't be first in line for it. I'd like him to interview for the HC job next year - he's got that MASH unit playing much better than the sum of its parts. 

Morgan can get to steppin'. He is complicit in the Young Draft pick. 

[tukafan21]

1 minute ago, OldhamA said:

How do you know they're not going to be an elite HC?

The move that needs to be made in the offseason is a new GM, with full control over football operations, being brought in - he then hires his own HC and is given 3 years to rebuild the roster. 

We don't have a first round pick next year, but we have a pick in the next 6 rounds AND we have to work out what we're doing with Burns (either tagged and traded or given an albatross contract). Do you really want Fitterer in charge of any of that? It just delays the rebuild and handcuffs the next GM.

Because we're going to be at best, the 7th most attractive HC opening this offseason if we were to fire Reich.

Short of just getting lucky, we're not finding an elite HC in that situation.

And while I agree on the GM front, Tepper is an analytics guy and all the analytics out there say you should be hiring a GM and HC in tandem, not in separate seasons.

If we move on from Fitterer this offseason, I think Morgan gets the job and unless he hits grand slams with his picks and FA moves, he'll only get one season and then do the GM/HC at the same time after the 2024 season.

[MillionDollarCam]

Jeeze man… Day Trader Dave just isn’t going to learn is he.

Not every problem can be fixed with money. Until he takes his hands off of the personnel decisions our FO will be just like our OL, a turnstile. And unlike our OL, I’m not sure you can blame the FO and staff for the failures of the man pulling all the strings, David Tepper.

He needs to realize this isn’t the corporate bullshit world where he can just throw money at the problem to make it disappear, he can’t just buy a first round draft pick for $100 million dollars (though he’d probably try).

We’re in the situation we are in because he was impatient and sold the farm for the one steed that he thought would fix the problem, yet he ended up buying a pony and now the future looks bleak because we have a ton of issues on both sides of the ball and we don’t have the draft capital to fix the problem.

Please Dave, for the love of God, take your grimy Wall Street hands off of all the football personnel decisions involving the Panthers and let the people who have actual NFL experience do their jobs.

[Mr. Scot]

1 minute ago, MillionDollarCam said:

Jeeze man… Day Trader Dave just isn’t going to learn is he.

Not every problem can be fixed with money. Until he takes his hands off of the personnel decisions our FO will be just like our OL, a turnstile. And unlike our OL, I’m not sure you can blame the FO and staff for the failures of the man pulling all the strings, David Tepper.

He needs to realize this isn’t the corporate bullshit world where he can just throw money at the problem to make it disappear, he can’t just buy a first round draft pick for $100 million dollars (though he’d probably try).

We’re in the situation we are in because he was impatient and sold the farm for the one steed that he thought would fix the problem, yet he ended up buying a pony and now the future looks bleak because we have a ton of issues on both sides of the ball and we don’t have the draft capital to fix the problem.

Please Dave, for the love of God, take your grimy Wall Street hands off of all the football personnel decisions involving the Panthers and let the people who have actual NFL experience do their jobs.

I think that's what we're all afraid of...

[ForJimmy]

4 minutes ago, OldhamA said:

I wouldn't mind Evero being given interim-HC duties (even though it's a kiss of death), but he wouldn't be first in line for it. I'd like him to interview for the HC job next year - he's got that MASH unit playing much better than the sum of its parts. 

Morgan can get to steppin'. He is complicit in the Young Draft pick. 

Who on our staff is next in line for the interim-HC job? 

[toldozer]

18 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

I know a lot of people won't like it, but the best long term move for the franchise is to bring back both Fitterer and Reich next season.

The statistics have long shown that teams are more successful with a GM and HC hired in the same offseason, not separately. 

And the unfortunate truth is that if Bryce is so bad the rest of this season that it gets Reich fired, it will also get Fitterer fired, while at the same time it would make us an extremely unattractive franchise for the top candidates out there for both jobs.

GM's and HC's don't want to go into their first season without a first round pick and stuck with an undersized QB who has looked as bad as Bryce has.  Sure, there are only 32 jobs of each in the world, so there will be plenty of people interested in them, but they won't be the best candidates out there.

So in reality, the best path forward is to just make smart building block decisions this offseason and then let Reich takes his lumps next year while we have our first round pick again in 2025.

You then fire both of them after 2024 and tell the new GM/HC that they have full control.  If they want to give Bryce a 3rd season to see if they can fix him, they can and it's considered a "free season" for them and won't put their jobs at risk given the situation they're stepping into.  But at the same time, if they just want to cut bait and draft someone new in 2024 or even just sign a vet to replace him, they can.

By being open with them about knowing what Bryce is at that point and giving them the necessary leeway and time to fix things, it would help us become a much more attractive destination.

The fortunate thing for us is that thankfully the rest of the division has also screwed themselves moving forward and short of something crazy happening, none of the other 3 teams will have found their franchise QB's before the 2025 season anyways.  Carr, Baker, Ridder/Heineke aren't the futures for any of them and they also are all going to end up winning too many games this year to end up with a Top 5 pick to get one of the top QB's in the draft.

Agree with bringing them back but fit shouldn't be allowed to sign anything over a 1 year deal, trade any picks or players. Any player that won't carry dead cap into 2025 should be let go. Start fresh in 2025 with new gm, coach and qb. And they all need to be on the same page and that page is anytime Tepper says anything other then "where's my pen?" They tell him to sit down and shut the fug up

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, ForJimmy said:

Who on our staff is next in line for the interim-HC job? 

Probably Duce Staley...

[CamWhoaaCam]

We can fix all this by going after Jim Harbaugh. Watch him end up with the Chargers and they go on to win a SB.

 

 

[Killah_Ray]

Let Dan Morgan get a crack at GM before we have another Brandon Beane situation. 

[ForJimmy]

11 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

I could see it happening, but with Morgan and Deuce, not Evero.

I wouldn't be okay with Evero as HC, or any defensive minded coach for that matter, not in today's NFL.

Perfect reason why is to look at the Bills right now.

Defensive minded coaches who end up with great offenses because of an OC, lose that OC to another HC job and then can't replace the magic, look how much worse Allen has been since they lost Daboll.

You can't need to depend on needing to replace your OC every few years and expect long term success, not with today's game and how it's moving.  You need to get the HC who keeps the offensive philosophy flowing, it's how teams like the 49ers are able to keep cycling in new OC's without a problem, but teams like the Bills or Patriots can't get it done because of their DC based HC's.

Deuce would work!  He would absolutely have this team playing fired up similar to Pierce in LV right now and what Wilks did for us last year.  Give him 2024 to put his stamp on the roster and see what he can do.  If all else fails we can do a full reset in 2025.  

[ForJimmy]

3 minutes ago, CamWhoaaCam said:

We can fix all this by going after Jim Harbaugh. Watch him end up with the Chargers and they go on to win a SB.

 

 

Harbaugh might punch Tepper in one of their meetings.