Carolina Definitely Chose the Wrong QB

[mrcompletely11]

55 minutes ago, Mol3m4n said:

You don't know that. 

Lol

[Basbear]

1 minute ago, Panthercougar68 said:

I had this talk with a coworker today who has tons of family ties to college football coaching in the sun belt and he said he talks with his dad and brother all the time and believes the NFL is too quick to throw QBs to the wolves. I know Bryce was supposed to be the most ready but I do wonder how it would have been if he sat for the first few games like Allen did in 2017

Back in the stone age........all rookie QBs sat.(rare cases started) Then the draft picks were getting too much money to sit. * This is my opinion lots of college system elements were brought to the pros and they worked. SO it was easier for the transition.

Byce should have sat, but 20/20 etc etc. I mean the main issue is Stroud and for a small first 5 games Arich were named early starters and had success. Its near impossible to sit byce when those two are out there winning games and being difference makers. 

[Davidson Deac II]

14 minutes ago, Basbear said:

Back in the stone age........all rookie QBs sat.(rare cases started) Then the draft picks were getting too much money to sit. * This is my opinion lots of college system elements were brought to the pros and they worked. SO it was easier for the transition.

Byce should have sat, but 20/20 etc etc. I mean the main issue is Stroud and for a small first 5 games Arich were named early starters and had success. Its near impossible to sit byce when those two are out there winning games and being difference makers. 

I do think that coaches and fans tend to forget that each and every player is different.  Some, like Cam or Stroud adjust quickly.  Others don't.  If I was a coach, I would take the opposite approach.  Investing a number one pick would make me want to be more cautious and know throw him to the wolves.  

[strato]

2 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I do think that coaches and fans tend to forget that each and every player is different.  Some, like Cam or Stroud adjust quickly.  Others don't.  If I was a coach, I would take the opposite approach.  Investing a number one pick would make me want to be more cautious and know throw him to the wolves.  

That is what Reich was trying to do with the neutered offense, because Tepper wouldn’t okay sitting him. So Frank was trying to limit his exposure. At least that is what I believe. 

[Basbear]

33 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I do think that coaches and fans tend to forget that each and every player is different.  Some, like Cam or Stroud adjust quickly.  Others don't.  If I was a coach, I would take the opposite approach.  Investing a number one pick would make me want to be more cautious and know throw him to the wolves.  

 

29 minutes ago, strato said:

That is what Reich was trying to do with the neutered offense, because Tepper wouldn’t okay sitting him. So Frank was trying to limit his exposure. At least that is what I believe. 

I do believe frank was under heavy pressure about starting young, could have been a reason he gave up too. 

It does feel like byce in practice is different come gameday. Thats part of being a HC, you got to know fools gold when you see it. I think frank just wanted no part of "fixing" byce with knowing it may take til the off-season. He didnt even want to fix his terrible footwork, so bizarre. 

 

[Panthercougar68]

5 minutes ago, Basbear said:

 

I do believe frank was under heavy pressure about starting young, could have been a reason he gave up too. 

It does feel like byce in practice is different come gameday. Thats part of being a HC, you got to know fools gold when you see it. I think frank just wanted no part of "fixing" byce with knowing it may take til the off-season. He didnt even want to fix his terrible footwork, so bizarre. 

 

Frank also realized that he needed to retire from the game in general, when you can't work a headset during the game its a sign, I think Frank bit off more than he can chew.

[Basbear]

Just now, Panthercougar68 said:

Frank also realized that he needed to retire from the game in general, when you can't work a headset during the game its a sign, I think Frank bit off more than he can chew.

Yea, I do think fisserereererer approved frank and once things got rough he folded. tepper has been fooled twice now, both were different ways. I do think him not picking many of the staff also made him check out as well. He was like "this is going to take years and who are these coaches?!?!?"

[OldhamA]

1 hour ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I do think that coaches and fans tend to forget that each and every player is different.  Some, like Cam or Stroud adjust quickly.  Others don't.  If I was a coach, I would take the opposite approach.  Investing a number one pick would make me want to be more cautious and know throw him to the wolves.  

You can't trade 5 premium players for a guy then sit him.

That means he's not worth the pick. If we'd stumbled into the #1 pick on our own, then sure - but we didn't, we mortgaged our future for a QB that was meant to come in and win now. 

[Davidson Deac II]

1 hour ago, OldhamA said:

You can't trade 5 premium players for a guy then sit him.

That means he's not worth the pick. If we'd stumbled into the #1 pick on our own, then sure - but we didn't, we mortgaged our future for a QB that was meant to come in and win now. 

I disagree, the more you invest in a rookie player, the more you need to be careful and work him in gradually.  

But at this point, its irrelevant.  

[TN05]

3 minutes ago, Davidson Deac II said:

I disagree, the more you invest in a rookie player, the more you need to be careful and work him in gradually.  

But at this point, its irrelevant.  

You don’t trade all your talent and a #1 pick for a benchwarmer.

[Davidson Deac II]

2 hours ago, strato said:

That is what Reich was trying to do with the neutered offense, because Tepper wouldn’t okay sitting him. So Frank was trying to limit his exposure. At least that is what I believe. 

You might be right.  Unfortunately, we didn't have the players to make that neutered offense remotely effective.  It might have been nice to have a running back or a wr that could easily turn a 5 yard catch into 15-20 (CMC or DJ) or a rb that could power for 4-5 ypc on average (Foreman).  But our most talented players from 2022 played for other teams this year.  

[pantherclaw]

11 hours ago, OldhamA said:

Define 'they', cos we've just sacked our HC and GM.

Do you mean Dave and Nicole?

The decision was pretty unanimous.   Ultimately the GM and HC made the decision. 

It doesn't matter.  Bryce is our guy, and while I expect competition to be brought in, they're not just going to give up on him after the poo show that this team was this last season. 

[GhostOfDocAnderson]

On 1/13/2024 at 10:04 PM, amcoolio said:

Young could have been a lot worse. Young can also improve, especially since his major problem right now is footwork and getting the ball out earlier, two things that have been improved by other QBs. Every single QB in NFL history has missed open receivers. I don’t get these “my opinion is absolute and he will never be any good” takes. 

Right now Bryce doesn't just have bad footwork. He has no footwork to speak of. He's the equivalent of a rookie NBA point guard who hasn't been trained to dribble or pass. If you want to see what bad but fixable footwork looks like, look no further than rookie Aaron Rodgers. It took him three years on the bench to fix his footwork and his throwing mechanics. Three years. How long will it take to teach Bryce proper footwork and throwing mechanics? Nobody knows, but it'd make an interesting case study and a cautionary tale.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U23QDOcBXI

 

[strato]

4 hours ago, Basbear said:

 

I do believe frank was under heavy pressure about starting young, could have been a reason he gave up too. 

It does feel like byce in practice is different come gameday. Thats part of being a HC, you got to know fools gold when you see it. I think frank just wanted no part of "fixing" byce with knowing it may take til the off-season. He didnt even want to fix his terrible footwork, so bizarre. 

 

Bizarre is right, do you think Frank even thought it possible to fix his footwork? If you have ever been okay at something and done it that way for a long enough time, and tried to change it you might agree that reverting to the familiar when it’s money time is the thing you have to conquer. And it is very very hard to do.

People are talking like changing your footwork is a simple thing to do, as if rebuilding that guy from the ground up is something you can do in two ore three months. I don’t believe that, to start with. I wonder if they can fix it period, much less on a short schedule. 

His footwork ion particular? Seems to have at least one extra move in it. Which has to precede the loading up. So you are talking time. When I think of the velocity disadvantage he has to contend with and the extra hitch in the footwork, you are talking a split second on each end of the D. up front pass rush before the release and whatever the slower velocity gives to closing defenders. 

 

FWIW footwork related to throwing position, alignment with target, was a big Stroud attribute. Something about he has one motion, very efficient, and he was in position to cock and release - with his feet pointing where the ball was going.  I hadn’t noticed it myself but could see it in the examples.

OTOH I saw Bryce’s issues right away. And we are back around to bizarre. 

Edited January 15, 2024 by strato