2016 losses recap.(Shula haters you have some explaining to do)

[NJPanthers12]

15 minutes ago, PhillyB said:

cam is an all-pro MVP. that's not a stupid call.

but when you are consistently bad at scheming around your players' strengths and weaknesses, draw plays that end up with receivers colliding in similar areas of the field, can't adjust to the opposition's changes, and generally rely on having championship-caliber players at all positions to succeed you are going to be analyzed for making those types of calls.

mike shula is not the cause of all our offensive woes, but he contributes nothing that anyone else couldn't contribute and his weaknesses have manifested themselves over and over. i think we can win championships in spite of him, but that's an embarrassing thing to have to say.

It would not have been a smart call with Cam Newton at QB, and it was an ever dumber call since it was with Derek Anderson. 

[PhillyB]

12 minutes ago, NJPanthers12 said:

It would not have been a smart call with Cam Newton at QB, and it was an ever dumber call since it was with Derek Anderson. 

i forgot it was DA. i stand corrected.

not a dumb call with cam though unless you do it 100% of the time. people try to box these things out of context and it's a bad strategy and leads to poor analysis

[arbnranger]

42 minutes ago, panther4life said:

If we fired him this offseason I'd be excited about the new offensive coordinator to see what he can do. However he's not horrible enough to have see people constantly bitch about him. The way people portray him is that no matter what we do including drafting someone like Fournette Shula is going to find a way to fug everything up for us. That's simply not true and even his biggest critics have to admit we are capable of having the number one offense in the league with Cam as his QB. 

Im cautiously optimistic about us this year even tho I'm not sold Gettleman has done enough yet. But with the draft still coming up and the possibility of landing more veteran help later in the offseason we may just get back to the promise land. But the season is a long way away and having to read people make the same tired complaints about a guy who isn't going anywhere offseason just gets annoying.

 

A - for effort my man. Good offseason discussion. 

I find myself agreeing with a lot of your points. He is nowhere near as bad as most people portray him, but he may be worse than some think. 

He is frustratingly inconsistent at being consistently good or bad.

Can we do better? I think so. Is there anyone that could step in, right now as we speak, and do a better job. Doubtful 

This year is do or die for him in my opinion . 

[DamnItJake!]

2 hours ago, OldNorthPowell said:

Run up the middle, run up the middle, and then the classic 15 yard route plays.

 

 

This.. not multiple but many  games when we have great momentum going and the  lead and they are trying to kill time off the clock  with Shula Ball and a whole minute and a half ticks off with his dumb poo play calling and kills the offense that had been working..Hence allowing the foe back on the field tiring out our defense with repetitive dumb play calling...

[Byrdman4real]

1 hour ago, Chardee MacDennis said:

 

The issue there, and you can see it by Cams reactions and facial expressions, is that Shula doesn't actually give Cam the play call until the last second. I've even seen Cam after calling a timeout yelling "get me the play. Hurry up and give it to me." In clear frustration.

15 seconds isn't all that much when you've got to call it in the huddle as quickly as possible, get up to the line, make sure everyone is set, and possibly be reading the defense for adjustments, sending a motion guy or 2, snap the ball, etc. Those plays should be flying in and done with 22 seconds left, so Cam has time to get it all done.



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This is true

It's shula strategy to control time of possession which I give him credit for because its the only thing he's good at at times. The problem is that in doing so he limits Cam time to read the defence and change the play. This also probably makes Cam feel untrusted. Shula uses time of possession to limit Cam ability to take over and cages his performance and ability. 

[Byrdman4real]

Not knowing how to adjust is a prime example of why Shula shouldn't be coordinator 

[LinvilleGorge]

2 minutes ago, Byrdman4real said:

This is true

It's shula strategy to control time of possession which I give him credit for because its the only thing he's good at at times. The problem is that in doing so he limits Cam time to read the defence and change the play. This also probably makes Cam feel untrusted. Shula uses time of possession to limit Cam ability to take over and cages his performance and ability. 

As much as this frustrates me and as much as I'd like to see us move on from Shula, IMO this is probably due to Rivera.

[Byrdman4real]

2 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

As much as this frustrates me and as much as I'd like to see us move on from Shula, IMO this is probably due to Rivera.

Could be which is why Rivera is saving his ass from being fired. We dont know and probably will never know. 

[Khyber53]

I don't think Shula has much to do with the other teams scoring a ton of points on us. 21, 27, 22, 48, 17, 41, 20, 10, 20, 20, 35, 40, 16, 15, 33, 17.

We lost three of the games where opponents scored less than 20 points on us. You can blame the offense, and thereby the OC for that. We lost every one of the games where the opponents scored 30 points or more... and we gave up 3 games with scores of 40 points or more... that is a defense completely unable to stop the opposition.

Our defense last season played a lot like the Atlanta Falcons Super Bowl defense... lights out for the first half and completely gassed by the second half. Of course, we had some very key injuries and a secondary with training wheels, but Bill Belichick couldn't survive giving up 30+ points as regularly as we did.

You can make your case with a simple "dur hur Shula sucks" and let that stand. Morons have been doing it for a while now, but you can't put all the blame for losses on his shoulders and then look at the prior season and give him no credit at all for the 15-1 season.

There's more truth to the OP's post than most can understand.

Let's see how they do this year. There was a lot at play that hurt this team in 2016, not the least of which was the extended 2015 season and a very short offseason.

[Cpt slay a ho]

I'm cool with people who want to upgrade Shula but when we're signing teams 4th and 5th string receivers as upgrades, and taking a big flyer on Kalil. How can you complain about upgrades at oc when we're not making the necessary upgrades on the offensive end??? And this had been going on for some years now. Shula is near the bottom of the list as far as upgrades IMO.

Ps the play clock myth got busted when da started, no issues when getting the call in, so there's more to it then simply blaming Shula


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[Hoenheim]

There have been some really great posts in this thread. There isn't a single real Panther fan that can deny that Shula's terrible playcalling is a significant weakness of this team. I found myself last season saying things like "oh bet its run up the gut, bet its long pass on 3rd and 1" , and I'm usually right. Its bad if some random football fan like me can predict what Shula is going to call more often than not, what do you think defensive coordinators and coaches of the other teams we're playing against are thinking then? Probably that this guy is an uncreative predictable dumb ass of an OC. And easily counter his unchanging antiquated stratagems .

Sure we could have better offensive talent. But no coach or team in the league is in the perfect situation and you can not expect Shula to have an all star offensive roster filled to the brim with perrenial pro bowlers and world beaters. The vast majority of teams are lucky to have one super star on offense, I think as a coach its what you do with role players shows youre ability to be a great coach (ala Bill Bellicheck) , rather than just overly relying on mega talent to have a consistently great offense.

[panther4life]

1 hour ago, stbugs said:

Exactly.

Sorry OP, but many of the games you listed you blame a sack (Minny) or INT (Tampa DA) or a bad block for a sack (KC) or a stupid dipsy doo screen pass for a pick 6 (Oak) when in those games, a better play call wins us the game. Guess what, if you want to, you can easily take every bad play call and find a scape goat of the QB, WR, TE, RB or OL. That said, still a bad play call. Denver as well, we went from good play calls where we gave Remmers help, took short drops and negated Miller. Then we jump back to our SB mold play calling after we have a nice lead and put Remmers on an island. It's almost as if we didn't learn anything.

Sorry, almost every bad play you listed for the offense could have also been thrown under the category of a bad call by Shula when a different play like a run on 1st and goal from the 1 or 1st and 10 at KC's 20 when a FG puts us up 3 scores going into the 4th.

First of all. I never said Shula is blameless or above average. I just stated that he's not so horrible that he is the #1 deciding factor in whether we win or lose a game. 

I didn't make a post about all of our wins and say hey look because Shula is so brilliant we overcame the odds and beat this team.

I just highlighted turnovers mostly that were the difference in close games last year. If you think about it we had a much lower turnover ratio in 15 and the results in the close games all swung in our favor. 

So when reviewing the turnovers I broke it down to bad playcall or bad execution.

Yes I blamed the players not executing properly. I also listed why they were on the players more so than the play call itself. 

If a player fumbles a ball on long drive, then how can Shula be at fault for that. 

Im sorry but DA should be kicked off the team if he can't handle a 1 yard pass play.It was first down and throwing away was an option, giving us 2 more chances to try and punch it in. Stewart was out for that game so you'd of had to trust Artis-Payne or Whittaker to punch it in and not lose yards. 

The chiefs game we were in control the whole time. Worst case scenario we go to overtime. Then Benjamin fumbles it. Do you really think that can be blamed on Shula? 

 

 

 

[tyger0876]

I've always argued that Blaming Shula is the laziest excuse I have ever seen panther fans make. First 4 responses only strengthen my stance on that. I'm open for debate on the matter, I presented my case in favor of him,someone please show me how I am wrong. 
 

Agree completely

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[Khaki Lackey]

So far is this thread:
"Dumbass throws on first and goal from the one!"
"Dumbass runs the ball three times in a row on first and goal!"
"Dumbass with the long developing routes!"
"Dumbass with the dipsy doo screens!"
"Dumbass calls for short routes when we need long yardage and vice versa, yet is completely predictable!"
Shula is all things to all people. I think he is evil incarnate and the worst person that has ever walked the earth. (I like to channel my outrage, and until Shula wins me over with a bitchin' yogurt commercial, he will continue to be my target.)



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