The Career Arc

[Bartin]

3 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

I'm not convinced Rivera can handle the latest versions of NFL offenses.

To that point, I'm not really sure anyone is. We are squarely in the middle of the pack defensively right now. The team with the best defense is the Bears but they have invested an extreme amount of resources to that side of the ball. With the rules the way they are and the spread offenses, that's all the more reason to jump on the offensive bandwagon when we move on from Ron.

My biggest issue is that there aren't many hot shot OCs out there right now. Most have been given head jobs over the past couple years with McVay,Nagy, Shanahan, Pederson and Reich. Lincoln Riley would be the dream but I don't think we have a chance in hell at getting him and I'm not a big fan of John DeFilippo or Dan Campbell. Don't think I want to go down the McDaniels road after the stunt he pulled last year, but the new Browns OC is intriguing if he ends being let go with the coaching change.

[electro's horse]

It's not me....it's you.

[rayzor]

6 hours ago, ChibCU said:

My worst memories:

1) 2015 Super Bowl Loss

2) 2003 Super Bowl Loss

3) Delhomme's six-turnover game in 2009

I would add the 2001, 2007 and 2010 seasons.

And Kerry Collins gave me ulcers.

[trueblade]

13 minutes ago, Bartin said:

The team with the best defense is the Bears but they have invested an extreme amount of resources to that side of the ball. With the rules the way they are and the spread offenses, that's all the more reason to jump on the offensive bandwagon when we move on from Ron.

The Bears have been helped out by their schedule, too. No Saints, Rams (yet), or Chiefs. The best offense the Bears have faced this season is New England, and they hung 38 on them. Scoring is the only 'defense' in 2018.

[electro's horse]

also the bears went and got the best defensive player in the league at a position that can directly impact the QB. 

Panthers have a rotating cast of at best number 3 DEs, and their big money DT has taken the year off. 

[Mr. Scot]

7 hours ago, CarolinaNCSU said:

I think a lot of people clinging to Rivera are scared our next coach will suck.  Fair, it's a risk...but we have to get an offensive mind in here.  Our young talent is essentially all on the offensive side of the ball...our future success, depends on them. 

Rivera's seat has been hot, what...3 times now?  He has seemingly wasted one of the most talented rosters year after year outside of a couple of years.  He refuses to change. He wants the glory days back.  Even Norv, successful as he is...was a safe hire.  He's a scared coach.  The Riverboat BS is NOTHING without Cam Newton to begin with.  

Said it before: If the choice is between a coach who might be bad and a coach who I know is bad, I'll take my chances.

[Mr. Scot]

7 hours ago, d-dave said:

I do agree about the idea of coaching "magic."  Some coaches can capture it and burn really bright.  But most of them fail due to brain drain.  Look at our defense.  Since McDermot left, our D has gotten worse each year as guys move on.  Unless you are a generational coach, like a Bill Belichek with Tom Brady, everyone levels off towards "average."  Even the mighty Pats have had their down years and challenges.

The icky problem we have is that we are in the prime of our two biggest stars in Cam and Luke.  Who is the coach to take us and them to the next level?  That's what Tepper has to identify.  You can't just hope some 30 something offensive coordinator is going to bring the magic when dealing with two players who could very well end up in Canton once it's all said and done.  You not only have to have the right head coach, but also the best coordinators to work with that coach.

Sure, we could burn the coaching offices down and fire everyone.  But who do we bring in?  How long will it take to turn the team around?  Cam's 30, Luke's 28 when we bring in someone new.  Their time, our two most important player's time, is very valuable.  That's going to be the big challenge for us moving forward.  How do we reinvent our team in time to maximize Luke and Cam's talents for the next five years?

The answer to that question is: it's not Ron Rivera.

I think it was Parcells who said eventually you come to a point where the players have heard all your speeches, know all your tricks, etc. That's why some guys are better college coaches because nobody stays more than four years. Maybe that'd be a better place for Rivera too.

Yeah, getting the next head coaching choice right is a challenge, and maybe we waste a couple of good years for Cam and Luke.

But let's be real. Sticking with Rivera wastes those years just as effectively as a difficult rebuild would.

[KB_fan]

Good thread. Reasonable, rational discussion. Appreciate it!

I'm tending to agree we need a change....

[emhoward]

Ron lasted 8 years. That's a long time for an NFL coach. No shame in that.

[AceMan]

2015 Ron Rivera is extremely overrated

[JARROD]

I’m all about getting a Defilippo or Arians in here,.. maybe Pat Shurmur if Getts gets trigger happy and fires him,..

but to compare, teams like Tampa as referenced that parted ways with Gruden, have gone through like 4 coaches since 2009,.. the Browns, Lions, Jets, Miami, Tennessee,.. 

these teams rotate coaches,... keep trying to excite their fan base on the next hire but it’s a no go.

Also, the Rams have won nothing yet.  If they win the Super Bowl then kudos,.. Pederson right now is the real new hire hero,.. taking Phily and winning with Nick Foles? Wow. Proved that defense and running game along with a prime time quarterback can take it all the way MVP be damned.

the Chiefs have won nothing yet either— everyone was high on Phily before with Reid too,.. no Super Bowl,.. 

I’m going to laugh when the Super Bowl ends up being Seattle and the Steelers or Patriots,... again,.. New offenses be damned,...

[d-dave]

13 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

The answer to that question is: it's not Ron Rivera.

I think it was Parcells who said eventually you come to a point where the players have heard all your speeches, know all your tricks, etc. That's why some guys are better college coaches because nobody stays more than four years. Maybe that'd be a better place for Rivera too.

Yeah, getting the next head coaching choice right is a challenge, and maybe we waste a couple of good years for Cam and Luke.

But let's be real. Sticking with Rivera wastes those years just as effectively as a difficult rebuild would.

I don't disagree with you =)

Ron as a college coach....how interesting is that!

[Mr. Scot]

10 hours ago, JARROD said:

I’m all about getting a Defilippo or Arians in here,.. maybe Pat Shurmur if Getts gets trigger happy and fires him,..

but to compare, teams like Tampa as referenced that parted ways with Gruden, have gone through like 4 coaches since 2009,.. the Browns, Lions, Jets, Miami, Tennessee,.. 

these teams rotate coaches,... keep trying to excite their fan base on the next hire but it’s a no go.

Also, the Rams have won nothing yet.  If they win the Super Bowl then kudos,.. Pederson right now is the real new hire hero,.. taking Phily and winning with Nick Foles? Wow. Proved that defense and running game along with a prime time quarterback can take it all the way MVP be damned.

the Chiefs have won nothing yet either— everyone was high on Phily before with Reid too,.. no Super Bowl,.. 

I’m going to laugh when the Super Bowl ends up being Seattle and the Steelers or Patriots,... again,.. New offenses be damned,...

I seriously doubt Seattle has a real shot at the Super Bowl. Heck, the Steelers just lost for the woeful Broncos (that kinda hurts). I'd add that it doesn't look like the Patriots are going to have home-field advantage throughout this year.

As to us, Rivera's had eight years. No one can call us "trigger happy".

[JARROD]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

I seriously doubt Seattle has a real shot at the Super Bowl. Heck, the Steelers just lost for the woeful Broncos (that kinda hurts). I'd add that it doesn't look like the Patriots are going to have home-field advantage throughout this year.

As to us, Rivera's had eight years. No one can call us "trigger happy".

Definitely not trigger happy. 

The steelers laid their egg, but they will be back— they did just lose their bye to the Patriots,.. again,..

there are definitely some interesting coaches out there.  Bruce Arians would be my pick if he would be coaxed,..

Going back to the offensive coach thing—

the Saints this year quietly have the number 1 run defense,... 73 yards per game, no one over 70 rushing yards, held Atlanta to 1.6 yards per carry,..Giants, Gurley,. All under 50 yards.

they also have a top 5 rushing attack.

So people are all about the air raid attacks but the thing that goes unnoticed and unmentioned is the defense and running game of teams that can win the Super Bowl.

the key mentioned for the Saints in the ESPN article I’m too lazy to link said it’s their front 7, no scheme change from last year— just execution from the linebackers—- a position others have said is “worthless” now.

we do need a new coach, one that works relentlessly on details like Belicheck does— players coming out of New England stress that’s the biggest difference— repetitions and attention to details, execution above all else.

Lombardi was about that too. Focus on detail and execution above all else.

Rivera never has the team ready to play— maybe ready in spirit but never in reality.