Saints just cut starting OG Larry Warford

[Soul Rebel]

17 hours ago, Peon Awesome said:

Great idea guys. Let's get rid of one overrated 3 time pro bowl guard whose play was noticeably declining so we can overpay for another who's 3 years older. That sounds smart! New Orleans loved him so much they drafted his replacement with their most valuable draft pick instead of solidifying another position (like say, wr 2 in a historically good wr draft class), cut him and accepted the $5 million dead cap. 

We didn't "get rid of" Trai, we upgraded our LT spot by trading him. Signing Warford would essentially replace the vacancy from trading Trai, while improving our LT situation. 

Also, it appears NO cut Warford because of that $8M salary in order to sign someone else.... possibly a CB - which scares me more. We need a CB and if the Saints swoop up someone like Logan Ryan our CB options get diminished. 

[JARROD]

I would say you have to go get that MF.

[MMA]

Sign this fool! Wtf are we doing? Traded Trai away for Okung who is old and injured. Warford is a 3x pro bowler. 

[Mr. Scot]

Bears and Texans were in pursuit. Now comes word that the Bears have dropped out.

That's probably not a good sign.

[kungfoodude]

9 hours ago, onmyown said:

Denver in 2015 was one of the few exceptions in the past decade.

I’m not sure where you’re getting that...we were unanimously ranked in the top 5 (usually 2-4) from just about every stat perspective.

https://www.pff.com/news/ranking-all-32-nfl-offensive-lines-entering-week-9

https://www.pff.com/news/pro-ranking-all-32-offensive-lines-this-season

There are some sites who rank them around #10.

However there are players on the line that ranked poorly

 

Sure there have been some that ranked out of the top 10. But the majority since 2010 haven’t. 
 

you’re still saying fug the odds ignoring the line and trying to be that rare team that pulls it off, for what tho?

 

IDK, does PFF suck or is it great now? I can never figure out which way the Huddle is leaning.

 

Yes, I realize some players on that OL were actually quite good. Still, we all saw what we saw. It was the undoing of the team, ultimately. 

 

 

[AU-panther]

15 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

IDK, does PFF suck or is it great now? I can never figure out which way the Huddle is leaning.

 

Yes, I realize some players on that OL were actually quite good. Still, we all saw what we saw. It was the undoing of the team, ultimately. 

 

 

The Huddle tends to like PFF only when it reinforces what they want to believe.

 

[Pantherzack179812]

22 hours ago, cookinbrak said:

No, we kept drafting tall receivers.

2015, 2016, 2019, 2020 Saw the Panthers use a 1st or second on Defensive line... We drafted Funchess in 15 and KB in 14... 5 1st or 2nd rounders on Defensive line and we don't even know if it's fixed yet lol. Drafting DTs in the 1st is like taking OGs in the top 10... DTs almost never meet their expectations, pressure almost always comes from the edges. To further reinforce my claim, one of the top 3 DTs was a 5th round pick... and played for 4 years 2 hours away from this organization. So much for Hog Molly expert Gettleman. 

 

[Peon Awesome]

8 hours ago, Soul Rebel said:

We didn't "get rid of" Trai, we upgraded our LT spot by trading him. Signing Warford would essentially replace the vacancy from trading Trai, while improving our LT situation. 

Also, it appears NO cut Warford because of that $8M salary in order to sign someone else.... possibly a CB - which scares me more. We need a CB and if the Saints swoop up someone like Logan Ryan our CB options get diminished. 

The trade seemed to be more of a "get whatever we can for Trai" situation moreso than the Panthers targeting Okung. I admit I could be wrong but I just don't see the Panthers investing much in someone with only a 1 year contract coming off an injury-riddled season. Makes more sense if you see it as a Trai dump. Now if you think we are really high on Okung and were giving up Trai begrudgingly for what we thought would be a bigger upgrade on the team, maybe you could justify looking into Warford assuming the price isn't exorbitant. But that's not my assessment of the situation. I also think we have enough options at guard that whatever we spend on Warford would be better spent elsewhere, like the cb spot you mentioned.

Don't get me wrong, I think Trai was fine and Warford is probably fine too. But the Saints, like us, decided their pro bowl guard was overvalued and not worth what he thought he's worth and cut ties for a cheaper option. We've effectively done that by swapping out Trai for Miller. To then go back and throw a bunch of money on the Saints older version of Trai doesn't make much sense to me. 

[onmyown]

4 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

IDK, does PFF suck or is it great now? I can never figure out which way the Huddle is leaning.

 

Yes, I realize some players on that OL were actually quite good. Still, we all saw what we saw. It was the undoing of the team, ultimately. 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, AU-panther said:

The Huddle tends to like PFF only when it reinforces what they want to believe.

 

I don’t mind PFF, I find the posterS who poo on it can’t seems to point to somewhere they like. I’m all for looking elsewhere yet no one has an answer. Strange.

No metric is perfect, period. Regardless that’s just a quick google search. Other sites you’ll still find the 2015 oline was one of the better ones in the league. And watching that season, clearly they were dominate most the season. Even Remmers who shitted in the SB and faded out to average looked better throughout the season beforehand. No olineman can handle Von Miller alone. River didn’t adjust, Broncos D went on record stating they were surprised and took advantage. Those who have watched Rivera weren’t all that shocked.

But I digress. Other than QB, oline is the most important positions in football,  it’s a very tough thing to build. Offensive lineman have the most dangerous/toughest jobs on the field and are suciptaable to big injuries. Ignoring it almost never will get you anywhere.

 

[kungfoodude]

4 hours ago, onmyown said:

 

I don’t mind PFF, I find the posterS who poo on it can’t seems to point to somewhere they like. I’m all for looking elsewhere yet no one has an answer. Strange.

No metric is perfect, period. Regardless that’s just a quick google search. Other sites you’ll still find the 2015 oline was one of the better ones in the league. And watching that season, clearly they were dominate most the season. Even Remmers who shitted in the SB and faded out to average looked better throughout the season beforehand. No olineman can handle Von Miller alone. River didn’t adjust, Broncos D went on record stating they were surprised and took advantage. Those who have watched Rivera weren’t all that shocked.

But I digress. Other than QB, oline is the most important positions in football,  it’s a very tough thing to build. Offensive lineman have the most dangerous/toughest jobs on the field and are suciptaable to big injuries. Ignoring it almost never will get you anywhere.

 

IMO PFF is a valid metric, although it is based on subjective criteria. As you say, none of those metrics are perfect. I like PFR's AV metric, as well. It isn't as detailed but it seems to be pretty solid.

I was not as high on the 2015 OL as some were at the time, I think in hindsight that proved accurate. It was one of our better lines we had with Cam as QB, although that isn't much of a mark to hit.

I hope our "new look" franchise finally decides to invest in this.

[DeAngelo Beason]

I would love it if we brought him in.  

[ForJimmy]

On 5/9/2020 at 10:40 PM, Peon Awesome said:

The trade seemed to be more of a "get whatever we can for Trai" situation moreso than the Panthers targeting Okung. I admit I could be wrong but I just don't see the Panthers investing much in someone with only a 1 year contract coming off an injury-riddled season. Makes more sense if you see it as a Trai dump. Now if you think we are really high on Okung and were giving up Trai begrudgingly for what we thought would be a bigger upgrade on the team, maybe you could justify looking into Warford assuming the price isn't exorbitant. But that's not my assessment of the situation. I also think we have enough options at guard that whatever we spend on Warford would be better spent elsewhere, like the cb spot you mentioned.

Don't get me wrong, I think Trai was fine and Warford is probably fine too. But the Saints, like us, decided their pro bowl guard was overvalued and not worth what he thought he's worth and cut ties for a cheaper option. We've effectively done that by swapping out Trai for Miller. To then go back and throw a bunch of money on the Saints older version of Trai doesn't make much sense to me. 

I think you are right we. We got rid of Turner to free up future cap space. Okung’s contract is done after this year which is exactly what our staff was looking for. He will serve as either a bridge for Little or Daley to learn the position and ease in or he will be a placeholder until we address the position next year. People say we got fleeced on the Turner/Okung trade, but I don’t think so. They freed up a lot of cap space for next year and have a proven/decent LT if Little needs time/isn’t the answer. Now the Chargers will be carrying a high priced G on their roster for the next couple years.

[LinvilleGorge]

On 5/9/2020 at 8:40 PM, Peon Awesome said:

The trade seemed to be more of a "get whatever we can for Trai" situation moreso than the Panthers targeting Okung. I admit I could be wrong but I just don't see the Panthers investing much in someone with only a 1 year contract coming off an injury-riddled season. Makes more sense if you see it as a Trai dump. Now if you think we are really high on Okung and were giving up Trai begrudgingly for what we thought would be a bigger upgrade on the team, maybe you could justify looking into Warford assuming the price isn't exorbitant. But that's not my assessment of the situation. I also think we have enough options at guard that whatever we spend on Warford would be better spent elsewhere, like the cb spot you mentioned.

Don't get me wrong, I think Trai was fine and Warford is probably fine too. But the Saints, like us, decided their pro bowl guard was overvalued and not worth what he thought he's worth and cut ties for a cheaper option. We've effectively done that by swapping out Trai for Miller. To then go back and throw a bunch of money on the Saints older version of Trai doesn't make much sense to me. 

If that's the case, then Trai should've absolutely been traded for draft assets instead of an aging LT coming off of injury and going into the last year of his contract. I definitely think we wanted to try to upgrade LT.

[MHS831]

8 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

If that's the case, then Trai should've absolutely been traded for draft assets instead of an aging LT coming off of injury and going into the last year of his contract. I definitely think we wanted to try to upgrade LT.

Getting ready to talk about something I have not looked into, but on this board, I am in the majority:

Trai had to be a contract move---too much money at RG--get a year insurance policy to develop Little--way too soon for anyone to give up on him, despite the extremely lofty degree of expertise in that area on the Huddle--and move some money.  I also think there might be more to to the Cam/Turner relationship than anyone knows.  They knew Cam was gone, keeping his outspoken, overrated, overpaid buddy did not make sense.  If you are building a team, you do not need a pro bowling vet bad mouthing the establishment--not sure he did or would have, but...

Again, not even an opinion--just a theory.