To Sign or not to Sign - Bridgewater vs Draft. DRAFT

[jfra78]

1 hour ago, LinvilleGorge said:

You think Teddy and his 15 TDs vs. 11 INTs were the reason we we're in position to be competitive in the 4th quarter? My god, this fan base is completely shell shocked. We have suckitis PTSD.

So what QB was playing the first 3 quarters?  If he wasn't the reason who was.  Not the defense for sure

[top dawg]

6 minutes ago, stbugs said:

We came up with the alternative last year and it was correct. It was dismissed as a culture killer with “repercussions for years to come!” which is a bunch of BS. We got nothing good out of Teddy 2020 that we couldn’t have gotten with Grier leading us to pick 1, 2 or at worst 3 with a boatload of cap rollover and more comp picks.

Listen, winning organizations have a stud QB. Stop acting like franchises are just somehow great for years without one. You may get the occasional Tampa or Chicago or Baltimore SB win with a stud D, but it’s one year. Look at Tampa. One year with Brady and they equaled their SB wins for their entire history.

I don’t care how many exclamation points you use, teams that find their QB, however they do it are legit contenders for years. People bag on being bad teams but Painter got the Colts Luck, Clausen got us Cam, Fitz and trading their best players got the Dolphins Tua and a ton of draft capital (imagine if they liked Herbert more) and Darnold/Minshew/Glennon and trading their best players got the Jets and Jags Wilson and Lawrence. Maybe Tua was a bad choice (after that injury, I’d give him another season or two) and maybe Wilson doesn’t work out but those teams put themselves in position to get a franchise QB. We didn’t and wasted a lot of cap, draft picks and opportunities to amass future picks or select a potential franchise QB.

All we can do is hope we luck into one but we botched it last year and I agree with @LinvilleGorgeand others that I’d rather save $8-18M by not having Teddy.

You're entitled to your opinion! 

[top dawg]

I do find it pretty disingenuous of you @stbugsto try and insinuate that I don't know how important stud QBs are though. That's not even an argument.

[JawnyBlaze]

 

Teddy is who he is. He isn’t going to improve enough on what was already his best ever season to make us contenders. He’s horrible, and horrible was his best. Rolling with Teddy would be the worst possible move. Better to just go with Walker or Grier and put our full efforts into getting a real QB next year. 

[top dawg]

38 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

My point is quite clear here. Teddy is the worst case scenario. Teddy caliber play at a near $23M cap hit virtually ensuring a bad season but not quite bad enough to land a legit franchise QB prospect isn't acceptable and isn't a plan built around building a winning franchise. It's the worst possible option for the betterment of the future.

Try to put whatever lipstick that you want on the pig, inherent in your thought process is us purposefully tying to play to lose--to tank! That's not going to happen! If we're going to go down the drain, it will be the old-fashioned way.

[jfra78]

11 minutes ago, stbugs said:

We had the 24th ranked scoring offense and the 18th rank scoring defense. Our offense was worse than a defense full of rookies that was ranked 31st in 2019. The Kyle Allen led offense scored 24.3 ppg when he started 13 games. We scored 21.9 ppg last year. Allen started 13 games and scored 30 or more points 6 times. Teddy started 15 games and scored 30 points 3 times.

Acting like Teddy wasn’t a huge problem when the D was ranked better overall (and even outscored Teddy one game) and we score way less points than Kyle Allen did when he started seems silly when you actually look at the results. Seems like maybe the D did keep us in games.

Carolina was 9th in the NFL in time of possession.  This had a lot to do with both of those rankings.  

[top dawg]

5 minutes ago, stbugs said:

It’s also disingenuous to act like we didn’t come up with alternatives as you just posted. That’s all we seem to be doing is posting what we think we should do. Our year to tank with no repercussions, as you call them, was 2020. A bunch of us screamed it from the mountain and folks like you said that it would ruin the culture and set us back years as if we didn’t finish 1-15 the two years prior and install an entirely new coaching staff. We add a 2-9 finish and we legitimately cost ourselves a lot. We were 100% correct and there is absolutely no way to refute that.

Now here we are in 2021 and unfortunately it is looking like we might be out in the cold on a rookie QB and also Watson. Trying to act like we shouldn’t be pissed off a bit since we did list out full plans/alternatives and that we shouldn’t be worried at all makes no sense. I’ll again hope it works but it sure seems like we are sliding into being like the Bears and the only way we dig out of it is lucking into a QB or having another great draft.

Yeah, what you're doing us saying that we should set ourselves up to lose in consideration of draft position. That's NOT what winning organizations do. Period! That is NOT a realistic alternative, nor will it ever be! 

A cookie for being right about Teddy! The only thing I ever said about Teddy is that I didn't mind us giving him a chance because what's done is done. What I've also said, from the very moment that I learned about his contract, is that I was surprised at the amount and the structure! So you're basically talking b.s.

Edited March 28, 2021 by top dawg

[LinvilleGorge]

4 minutes ago, jfra78 said:

Carolina was 9th in the NFL in time of possession.  This had a lot to do with both of those rankings.  

A stat that means a lot to the Foxes and Riveras if the world who play not to lose but a stat that has very little correlation with winning.

[top dawg]

Just now, stbugs said:

Such a naive statement. We are 3-24 to end the last three seasons. We’ve basically been tanking. Our two worst years starting QB scrubs netted us Cam and Peppers followed by Luke and Gross. Oh no, the horror of tanking leading us to SB berths and multiple playoff appearances.

Dude, you try to be so upbeat and act like we don’t want to see our team get better but there is no way you can legitimately state that we wouldn’t be in a much better place if we went full rebuild or tank last year (don’t sign Teddy or others, get our 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th comp picks, save $70M in cap space and get pick 1, 2 or 3). We’d either have the QB of our choice or just fleeced SF for two future firsts and a third and two more comp picks and a ton of cap space to use or rollover. Feel free to tell me how a 1-4 win season last year would have somehow put us in a worse spot than we are.

It's the height of naivité to think that we're going to purposefully set ourselves up to lose! That's not in a professional player's or coach's DNA that turns out to be a winner! Period!

[mav1234]

1 hour ago, TheRumGone said:

No way I’m spending capital on a backup this draft when we don’t even have a franchise qb. It doesn’t matter right now imo.

All I mean is that if we can't get a QB in the first I still expect them to draft one at some point.

[top dawg]

2 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Ugh, such a pile of steaming pile of poo every time. There’s no having a rational discussion when you can’t even see that the brightest years of our own team started because we had the shittiest seasons. Rhule had 3 wins total in his first seasons at Baylor and Temple and that didn’t tarnish his rebuilds. Lunacy.

What's lunacy is you believing that we're going to purposefully tank. That's the highest tier level of poo right there!

Edited March 28, 2021 by top dawg

[Varking]

2 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Ugh, such a pile of steaming pile of poo every time. There’s no having a rational discussion when you can’t even see that the brightest years of our own team started because we had the shittiest seasons. Rhule had 3 wins total in his first seasons at Baylor and Temple and that didn’t tarnish his rebuilds. Lunacy.

He’s been trolling in multiple threads. I’d just ignore him. He’s going on my list. 

[jfra78]

3 minutes ago, stbugs said:

How do we have these discussions when every response to factual posts becomes a tangent? So being 9th in TOP meant we sucked more on offense but Teddy was better? So it’s better to win the TOP battle than just score more points?

No one ever said that

TOP led to the scoring offense and defense being ranked where they were. 

[Toomers]

1 minute ago, top dawg said:

What's lunacy is you believing that we're going to purposefully tank. That's the highest tier level of poo right there!

  So it’s your opinion that the FO made the correct decision in spending 80M of unnecessary cap space to be be in a better position to win 5-6 games? What if you trade a player at the trade deadline for a pick? Is that tanking? It hurts your team immediately. Do all the remaining players on the team boycott? Since you know so much about the culture of an NFL team from your vast experiences on the “juice-box” circuit. That’s what’s disingenuous about all this.