Which trade was worse 2nd for Darnold or 3rd for Henderson?

[firefox1234]

1 minute ago, electro's horse said:

why do people keep bitching about the fifth year option

who cares

the cap isn't real in the nfl and money is no issue for the owner. It's not like we're the raiders who couldn't physically pay for khalil mack

i think at the time picking up the fifth year option was a way to boost his confidence which is its own different bag of poo, to be fair, but if you trade for him thinking you can turn him around you absolutely don't let him do it without another year in place. 

Or having no viable back up QB if things go bad….

[TheRumGone]

Just now, electro's horse said:

why do people keep bitching about the fifth year option

who cares

the cap isn't real in the nfl and money is no issue for the owner. It's not like we're the raiders who couldn't physically pay for khalil mack

i think at the time picking up the fifth year option was a way to boost his confidence which is its own different bag of poo, to be fair, but if you trade for him thinking you can turn him around you absolutely don't let him do it without another year in place. 

Uh because it’s just dumb and locks him in for another year. He’s the worst starting qb in the league. We could’ve used the 18 million on other places and were not the saints with whatever the fug it is they do down there. Like let’s throw some money at some olineman or use that 18 million to sign DJ or whatever the fug. It’s just cap space down the drain. 
 

if Sam had played well then were negotiating a contract with him after this season regardless. Made absolutely no sense. And like you said if they did it to boost his confidence then damn what are we doing with him in the first place with no backup plans or competition.

[BurnNChinn]

I tried to tell everyone the trade for Henderson was dumb!

[Seltzer]

7 minutes ago, BurnNChinn said:

I tried to tell everyone the trade for Henderson was dumb!

Disagree on that.  Henderson was definitely worth a 3rd.

Darnold was dumb, and Rhule has no one to blame but himself...

Rhule said too many things about Teddy for that relationship to last more than last year, which predicated us getting into the QB derby where we lost big-time.

Watson was obviously the 1st choice, that fell through, then Stafford chose the Rams.  Rhule got desperate and rather than wait until the draft to see where the chips fell, they hitched their wagon to what they (wrongly) perceived was one of the only remaining viable options at starting QB.

People vastly overestimate the hit rate on 3rd rounders... getting a top 10 pick after 1 year for a 3rd is smart business.

The 2nd rounder for Darnold isn't even that bad from a draft compensation standpoint, it was just a massive failure of hubris to believe this coaching staff could correct 3+ years of bad film

[electro's horse]

3 minutes ago, TheRumGone said:

Uh because it’s just dumb and locks him in for another year. He’s the worst starting qb in the league. We could’ve used the 18 million on other places and were not the saints with whatever the fug it is they do down there. Like let’s throw some money at some olineman or use that 18 million to sign DJ or whatever the fug. It’s just cap space down the drain. 
 

if Sam had played well then were negotiating a contract with him after this season regardless. Made absolutely no sense. And like you said if they did it to boost his confidence then damn what are we doing with him in the first place with no backup plans or competition.

he's not locked in. They can cut him whenever. Again, the cap isn't real. 

What offensive lineman would you have liked them to sign? There weren't any real options. 

If we're going to bitch about not extending DJ, sure, but i think the Anderson extension is far more culpable than the Sam contract. At least DJ might be cheaper after this season. 

And no, we would not have been negotiating a contract with him regardless. If Sam had just come in and played league average then his 5th year would have looked like a steal, and I still think he could have if the offensive line hadn't fallen apart. Not that it matters now, since everyone has gone pear shaped.

Again, Sam was at least the third option for this team, behind Watson and Stafford. You don't have a lot of choices at that point. With the gift of hindsight, realistic options would have been to keep Teddy (revolt), or trade for Minshew or sign Trubisky. None of those really inspire confidence either. 

[cardiackat88.]

On 11/8/2021 at 3:38 AM, flagfootballcoach28 said:

Henderson. You don't trade 1st round cb's a year later for no reason. There had to be some SERIOUS concerns about the kid. We were the naive team that took the bate. Cringe. 

Bait.

[Varking]

Darnold. Henderson can help us later this year and next year. He isn’t going to play over Gilmore, Bouye and Jackson. Darnold should be cut. 

[BurnNChinn]

10 minutes ago, Seltzer said:

Disagree on that.  Henderson was definitely worth a 3rd.

Darnold was dumb, and Rhule has no one to blame but himself...

Rhule said too many things about Teddy for that relationship to last more than last year, which predicated us getting into the QB derby where we lost big-time.

Watson was obviously the 1st choice, that fell through, then Stafford chose the Rams.  Rhule got desperate and rather than wait until the draft to see where the chips fell, they hitched their wagon to what they (wrongly) perceived was one of the only remaining viable options at starting QB.

People vastly overestimate the hit rate on 3rd rounders... getting a top 10 pick after 1 year for a 3rd is smart business.

The 2nd rounder for Darnold isn't even that bad from a draft compensation standpoint, it was just a massive failure of hubris to believe this coaching staff could correct 3+ years of bad film

Yeah Darnold sucks big time, but disagree on Henderson. It does matter if u give a third for someone that never plays. I don’t think he will amount to anything so yes that’s was a bad trade.

[Toomers]

17 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

he's not locked in. They can cut him whenever. Again, the cap isn't real. 

What offensive lineman would you have liked them to sign? There weren't any real options. 

If we're going to bitch about not extending DJ, sure, but i think the Anderson extension is far more culpable than the Sam contract. At least DJ might be cheaper after this season. 

And no, we would not have been negotiating a contract with him regardless. If Sam had just come in and played league average then his 5th year would have looked like a steal, and I still think he could have if the offensive line hadn't fallen apart. Not that it matters now, since everyone has gone pear shaped.

Again, Sam was at least the third option for this team, behind Watson and Stafford. You don't have a lot of choices at that point. With the gift of hindsight, realistic options would have been to keep Teddy (revolt), or trade for Minshew or sign Trubisky. None of those really inspire confidence either. 

[TheRumGone]

20 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

he's not locked in. They can cut him whenever. Again, the cap isn't real. 

We’re locked in for his cap hit. That’s what I meant. If the cap isn’t real then why aren’t teams just throwing mega contracts outbidding teams for players they want? Why isn’t Tepper with his billions doing that? Damn if he only knew that we could’ve had an all star team! And he didn’t have to hire all those people in the org that manage the cap! The cap can be finagled but it’s still real and can have compounding effects.

20 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

What offensive lineman would you have liked them to sign? There weren't any real options. 

I’m talking with the 18 million next year for Sam we could’ve used on signing some decent olineman or making a splash for one in FA. We gave 15 million guaranteed to pat and cam who said they were “surprised” lol. Those are a little above vet minimum type players. We’re paying them as starters.

 

20 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

If we're going to bitch about not extending DJ, sure, but i think the Anderson extension is far more culpable than the Sam contract. At least DJ might be cheaper after this season. 

Look at my posts. Didn’t want to sign Robby with tmj drafted and DJ coming up next. DJ won’t be cheaper because the league knows how Sam affects skill players. And they know how talented DJ is. He’s gonna get paid big. 

 

20 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

And no, we would not have been negotiating a contract with him regardless. If Sam had just come in and played league average then his 5th year would have looked like a steal, and I still think he could have if the offensive line hadn't fallen apart. Not that it matters now, since everyone has gone pear shaped.

I said we’d be negotiating a contract with him this coming off-season if he played well. If he was average let him walk. This has been talked about in the MNF thread but Sam is #2 in pocket time. It means he is making this offensive line worse then they are because he cannot process and react quickly enough. Go read that thread for info. We gave a second rounder for Sam Darnold.

 

20 minutes ago, electro's horse said:

Again, Sam was at least the third option for this team, behind Watson and Stafford. You don't have a lot of choices at that point. With the gift of hindsight, realistic options would have been to keep Teddy (revolt), or trade for Minshew or sign Trubisky. None of those really inspire confidence either. 

I get this and it’s good they’re proactive. Sam should’ve never been on the table at that price though. Ever. You roll with someone else for much cheaper and less draft capital. You bring in a vet. Whoever. Doesn’t matter. And I wanted to draft fields. Darnold was not inspiring confidence for anyone with a brain. This fanbase is dead. 

Edited November 9, 2021 by TheRumGone