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Saints sending us Sean Payton be like..

The Huddler

By The Huddler,
in Carolina Panthers

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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

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Interesting.  If he wants us, he sees something.  Maybe it is because our owner is rich and gives big contracts, but I think it is less about money than it is about his ego.  He sees the NFC South as a place he can dominate with a QB. 

5 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

Most of the narrative that is coming out is that Sean Payton is after us more than we are after him

 

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L-TownCat Grand Master

L-TownCat

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23 minutes ago, TheCasillas said:

Most of the narrative that is coming out is that Sean Payton is after us more than we are after him

My cynical side says these folks don’t just up and do things.  If we’re the spot, a plan is in place.  Nods, winks, unspoken agreements have put this into motion well in advance to us hearing about it.

16 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Im having a hard time with this. A coach as good as Payton is worth a 1st round pick. 

But could we hire an equally capable coach (Steichen) without having to give up draft capital?

Payton could have the inside track on addressing the QB problem. (Rodgers,Brady,Carr)

*not an endorsement

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philit99 Mentor

philit99

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28 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

Interesting.  If he wants us, he sees something.  Maybe it is because our owner is rich and gives big contracts, but I think it is less about money than it is about his ego.  He sees the NFC South as a place he can dominate with a QB. 

 

Mainly it means that previous coaches were not doing their job and we have a decent team. If we get a player or two we could become competitive. Sean Payton is a competitive guy, same for Jim Harbaugh. It is why they both wanted this job, higher probability of success. Both have huge egos that need stroking.

Edited by philit99
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MHS831 Grand Master

MHS831

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14 minutes ago, CanadianCat said:

Im having a hard time with this. A coach as good as Payton is worth a 1st round pick. 

But could we hire an equally capable coach (Steichen) without having to give up draft capital?

I guess we can assume that we already KNOW Payton is a good coach (although with Drew Brees, I could look good) but with Steichen, we have to predict that he will be one.  I am not sure Tepper wants to risk another experiment.

To consider the cost of surrendering a first rounder, you must also consider how much Payton will make the existing players better.  (For example, a star basketball player may score 40 points and grab 10 rebounds, but if the production of his teammates drop off when he plays, is he really a star player?)  I think Payton makes players better because he knows how to use them.   Think YGM, Chinn, Marshall, and our QB...

Now consider the actual value of a first round draft pick.  I found this on a Vikings board and it is interesting:

"Overall, only about two dozen players every draft will go on to have significant careers performing at a high level. That’s not a lot - less than one genuinely good player per team each year."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2022/4/26/23042105/nfl-draft-pick-bust-rate-remains-very-high

So if Payton makes good players great and mediocre players good, is he worth the draft pick?  I do not like surrendering a pick for a coach, but it could make sense if you look at his impact on other players.  A good coach puts players in position to succeed; a bad coach sets them up for failure.

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philit99 Mentor

philit99

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6 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

I guess we can assume that we already KNOW Payton is a good coach (although with Drew Brees, I could look good) but with Steichen, we have to predict that he will be one.  I am not sure Tepper wants to risk another experiment.

To consider the cost of surrendering a first rounder, you must also consider how much Payton will make the existing players better.  (For example, a star basketball player may score 40 points and grab 10 rebounds, but if the production of his teammates drop off when he plays, is he really a star player?)  I think Payton makes players better because he knows how to use them.   Think YGM, Chinn, Marshall, and our QB...

Now consider the actual value of a first round draft pick.  I found this on a Vikings board and it is interesting:

"Overall, only about two dozen players every draft will go on to have significant careers performing at a high level. That’s not a lot - less than one genuinely good player per team each year."

https://www.dailynorseman.com/2022/4/26/23042105/nfl-draft-pick-bust-rate-remains-very-high

So if Payton makes good players great and mediocre players good, is he worth the draft pick?  I do not like surrendering a pick for a coach, but it could make sense if you look at his impact on other players.  A good coach puts players in position to succeed; a bad coach sets them up for failure.

Great point and I’m not sure the PSL sales and current stadium atmosphere could take another 3-5 years. I’ve been to almost all the Panther games, and the SF game may have been the worst I have ever seen in that stadium. I believe it is why Rhule was fired. There is only two ways to get asses back in seats, either become a snake oil salesman and provide artificial hope, or hire the candidate with the highest probability for success and generate buzz and excitement.

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philit99 Mentor

philit99

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10 minutes ago, MHS831 said:

So if Payton makes good players great and mediocre players good, is he worth the draft pick?  I do not like surrendering a pick for a coach, but it could make sense if you look at his impact on other players.  A good coach puts players in position to succeed; a bad coach sets them up for failure.

This is the key. It takes rookie players 1-2 years to get up to speed in the NFL. If we give up 2, firsts we will feel it in years 2-4. Meanwhile, if we present the possibility of challenging for a Lombardi trophy some veteran players will chase that. Losing draft picks sucks, but you can navigate around it. You can’t navigate around having a clueless and lost head coach that wastes the talent they have on their roster. Coordinators with 1-2 years experience will need time to learn and adapt to situational football, time management, roster moves, and team moral. So do we want to compete now or in 2025-2026?

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