Fanbase Temperature Gauge: Who do you like and who do you want? (3/21/23)

[RJK]

Now that I’m off work and can dive in to the stroud pro day, the most impressive thing Stroud did today was run the workout himself. Mature beyond his years and great leadership.

[Ivory Panther]

29 minutes ago, tukafan21 said:

Not at all, I think every fan base could say the same thing, it's all part of the equation.  That's why there isn't a consensus on who should be the #1 pick, because Stroud is not really a lesser talent, just different and I'd rank Young only marginally ahead as a pure QB prospect.  

I also think the areas that Young is a better prospect, in terms of seeing the game, can be taught to Stroud, particularly since it's not like he's terrible at it, he's just not quite as good as Young there.  But you can't do anything about Young's size at all, sure you can get him in the gym and on a diet plan that will hopefully put a little bulk onto him, but he has a small frame, he can only get so big to help insulate him to injuries.

If there was a sizable gap between them as prospects, like if it was Young vs Levis, then no, the size factor doesn't play into it the same way and you take Young, easy call.

But I think they're very close as prospects, and when they're that close, you factor in Young's size given how small he really is.

The way u phrased it at 1st, I thought u meant it was a clear gap in ur opinion…but put it like u did, size tips it strouds way, if u worry abt it.

for me the gap is sizable. Not the throwing or accuracy or even processing, all of which are close. 
For me it’s the “clutch” gene.
But Because that’s an unintangible trait, it’s hard for most to count it.

But, I’ve seen bryce in high pressures situation over & over & dude rises to the occasion 90% of the time. He is a baller!
I don’t think Bryce loses twice to Michigan in the biggest game of the year in back to back years while having arguably comparable talent (some may argue better talent). 

I think CJ is very good & will be good for us if we draft him, but watching him for 2 yrs, he didn’t have that, “U left too much time on the clock for CJ”.
That’s obviously an opinion but that’s how I feel. 

[jfra78]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

To be fair, that's an awfully tough thing to do at the NFL level.

Brady made a career of it

[rayzor]

7 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

To be fair, that's an awfully tough thing to do at the NFL level.

It's a tough thing for most at the college level. Once the game slows down for CJ at the pro level (because you know it's going to have to), watch out  

You watch college play to see tendencies...good and bad. A lot will transfer to the next level eventually. I think the demeanor and control he has will show up at some point in the pros, probably sooner rather than later.

[Wolfcop]

8 hours ago, Ivory Panther said:

The way u phrased it at 1st, I thought u meant it was a clear gap in ur opinion…but put it like u did, size tips it strouds way, if u worry abt it.

for me the gap is sizable. Not the throwing or accuracy or even processing, all of which are close. 
For me it’s the “clutch” gene.
But Because that’s an unintangible trait, it’s hard for most to count it.

But, I’ve seen bryce in high pressures situation over & over & dude rises to the occasion 90% of the time. He is a baller!
I don’t think Bryce loses twice to Michigan in the biggest game of the year in back to back years while having arguably comparable talent (some may argue better talent). 

I think CJ is very good & will be good for us if we draft him, but watching him for 2 yrs, he didn’t have that, “U left too much time on the clock for CJ”.
That’s obviously an opinion but that’s how I feel. 

CJ was very clutch in the UGa game. He had the game won if the kicker does his job. Also, if OSU had Alabama”s defense, they would have easily won it all, including the Michigan game. Did you see all the big plays OSU’s defense gave up in that game? It was ridiculous. 

I do appreciate your post, though. It was well thought out and humble. If we do draft Young, I will support him 100%. 

 

[SmittyCity]

Sure Pro Day it a meaningless exercise, but is it fair to say that Stroud’s deep ball was a bit underwhelming (and often under-thrown) yesterday? 

[frankw]

8 hours ago, Ivory Panther said:

The way u phrased it at 1st, I thought u meant it was a clear gap in ur opinion…but put it like u did, size tips it strouds way, if u worry abt it.

for me the gap is sizable. Not the throwing or accuracy or even processing, all of which are close. 
For me it’s the “clutch” gene.
But Because that’s an unintangible trait, it’s hard for most to count it.

But, I’ve seen bryce in high pressures situation over & over & dude rises to the occasion 90% of the time. He is a baller!
I don’t think Bryce loses twice to Michigan in the biggest game of the year in back to back years while having arguably comparable talent (some may argue better talent). 

I think CJ is very good & will be good for us if we draft him, but watching him for 2 yrs, he didn’t have that, “U left too much time on the clock for CJ”.
That’s obviously an opinion but that’s how I feel. 

Even if a QB shows a "clutch gene" in college it doesn't mean it will translate to the NFL. And some of the current most clutch QB's in the league weren't necessarily that in college. It's foolish to anoint either Stroud or Young before they have put on an NFL uniform. Both have significant talent and ability. But there's no guarantee all or any of it will translate. Who even knows which QB will be the best from this years class it may not even end up being one of them. When you go all in on one prospect and elevate your level of expectations to near walk on water levels you are going to get hit in the forehead by reality. I think we should temper those expectations in the coming months regardless. Let these kids grow and learn. We can't put the weight of the world on their shoulders from the jump. It's going to be a process. Just enjoy the journey.

Edited March 23, 2023 by frankw

[Ivory Panther]

1 hour ago, Wolfcop said:

CJ was very clutch in the UGa game. He had the game won if the kicker does his job. Also, if OSU had Alabama”s defense, they would have easily won it all, including the Michigan game. Did you see all the big plays OSU’s defense gave up in that game? It was ridiculous. 

I do appreciate your post, though. It was well thought out and humble. If we do draft Young, I will support him 100%. 

 

Bama’s defense was actually pretty bad this year. They r the reason they lost 2 games. vs TEN they gave up almost 50 pts. vs LSU it was abt the same. Vs Tex, Ewers was eating them up until he got hurt & many other games.

Since the UGA game was the only time I’ve seen CJ being clutch in a big moment I’d say he had a clutch moment. 2 Mich loses in back to back yrs bothers me. It’s not all on him, but that’s a red flag to me when we r talking elite winner.

again, he is very good with many great traits. I absolutely love his accuracy & throws. It’s like art! Just beautiful to see him throw.
But I don’t know if he elevates the team around him. 

I’ve seen bryce will Bama to victory time after time again. 

[Ivory Panther]

46 minutes ago, frankw said:

Even if a QB shows a "clutch gene" in college it doesn't mean it will translate to the NFL. And some of the current most clutch QB's in the league weren't necessarily that in college. It's foolish to anoint either Stroud or Young before they have put on an NFL uniform. Both have significant talent and ability. But there's no guarantee all or any of it will translate. Who even knows which QB will be the best from this years class it may not even end up being one of them. When you go all in on one prospect and elevate your level of expectations to near walk on water levels you are going to get hit in the forehead by reality. I think we should temper those expectations in the coming months regardless. Let these kids grow and learn. We can't put the weight of the world on their shoulders from the jump. It's going to be a process. Just enjoy the journey.

Not even sure what u r talking abt. Didn’t say Bryce was gonna make the HOF, or win many superbowls etc…

didn’t anoint him of anything.
Like 1000s do, I have made observations abt traits I’ve seen from him in 2yrs in college. Is that not something we are all doing with draft prospects?

don’t get triggered every time someone brings up a positive aspect of Bryce’s game…

As I keep saying, both QBs r good. if we draft CJ, I’ll support him & hope he has the intangibles I think make top 5 QBs great.
but right now I prefer Bryce because I’ve seen the intangibles. 

[frankw]

17 minutes ago, Ivory Panther said:

Not even sure what u r talking abt. Didn’t say Bryce was gonna make the HOF, or win many superbowls etc…

didn’t anoint him of anything.
Like 1000s do, I have made observations abt traits I’ve seen from him in 2yrs in college. Is that not something we are all doing with draft prospects?

don’t get triggered every time someone brings up a positive aspect of Bryce’s game…

As I keep saying, both QBs r good. if we draft CJ, I’ll support him & hope he has the intangibles I think make top 5 QBs great.
but right now I prefer Bryce because I’ve seen the intangibles. 

You generally only discuss Bryce Young and do so glowingly in all aspects while downing other prospects. If you read that post discussing the very realistic realities for both prospects and thought to yourself "triggered" perhaps it's time to consider if you are too enamored with your favorite draft pick. Good talk.

[Ivory Panther]

19 minutes ago, frankw said:

You generally only discuss Bryce Young and do so glowingly in all aspects while downing other prospects. If you read that post discussing the very realistic realities for both prospects and thought to yourself "triggered" perhaps it's time to consider if you are too enamored with your favorite draft pick. Good talk.

Not sure why u have an issue with me being “enamored with Bryce. Why does that bother u? 

[stratocatter]

Re Young, I see people making this argument that he is in the SEC and playing against the people he will be playing against in the NFL, and is fine. 
I guess that seems like proof to a lot of people but not All those players are going to the NFL. And, none to very few, are what they will be after a single season of NFL football. Men. Real honest to goodness badass, Men. 
That is a big difference  

I have yet to see someone use coaching as a rebuttal, but it is for sure a variable not being accounted for in that particular argument being made on Young’s behalf. 

You guys know that a db coach at Missouri or Florida, or SC, is not going be at the level of tneir NFL counterparts, with an exception here or there granted. Like Wilks was at Missouri, okay he is an exception. Extrapolate that to HCs, OCs, DCs, OL coaches, the whole collection of college football coaches.  Even the top HCs are generally not up to NFL level. 

Young will have to go against much better coached players, and schemes where even the weak player being protected was a college all star. So there is no direct parallel, at all really. 

It seems like an argument that just won’t fly. 

 

Edited March 23, 2023 by stratocatter

[ForJimmy]

17 minutes ago, stratocatter said:

Re Young, I see people making this argument that he is in the SEC and playing against the people he will be playing against in the NFL, and is fine. 
I guess that seems like proof to a lot of people but not All those players are going to the NFL. And, none to very few, are what they will be after a single season of NFL football. Men. Real honest to goodness badass, Men. 
That is a big difference  

I have yet to see someone use coaching as a rebuttal, but it is for sure a variable not being accounted for in that particular argument being made on Young’s behalf. 

You guys know that a db coach at Missouri or Florida, or SC, is not going be at the level of tneir NFL counterparts, with an exception here or there granted. Like Wilks was at Missouri, okay he is an exception. Extrapolate that to HCs, OCs, DCs, OL coaches, the whole collection of college football coaches.  Even the top HCs are generally not up to NFL level. 

Young will have to go against much better coached players, and schemes where even the weak player being protected was a college all star. So there is no direct parallel, at all really. 

It seems like an argument that just won’t fly. 

 

What was the best SEC defense he played last year and where do they rank as a defense in the NCAA? The SEC had some good offenses, but it seemed like a down year for defenses…. I’m a SEC fan, but would argue the Big10 had the tougher defenses and of course weather conditions this year.

[stratocatter]

I don’t even know, I don’t watch a ton of college.  I do watch SEC more than the rest but that isn’t enough watching to make me know much. 

I am a pretty typical fan. I know bad footwork leads to errant throws, but I could not assess the footwork of a QB and judge anything off of what I see.  I am untrained for that job. I can see when a guy loafs, or takes a bad angle, or looks lost. But it’s all general observation stuff that people who pay attention will see. I

And I can see 5’10” eye to eye. He is going to have to be really, exceptionally great to excel at the NFL level.