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Is there a game today GameDay thread


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3 hours ago, KeptPounding89 said:

It’s also funny how the Panthers won today and there’s next to no engagement on the site. Normally after a loss I’d come here and see post after post ready to blame Bryce, Tepper, and the coaching staff. Tonight there’s little to no talk about anything, which tells me the most active posters on here have an agenda and if there’s nothing to feed of of them they choose to ignore it. Quite ironic. 

Why would there be? The Falcons gifted this game, Bryce and the offense were pathetic for 50 minutes of the day, and one win doesn't change nearly a decade of crap team management nor the brutally dim prospects of the very near future. There is no agenda - this is truly a reflection of where even maybe hardcore fans are at. 

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7 hours ago, KSpan said:

Why would there be? The Falcons gifted this game, Bryce and the offense were pathetic for 50 minutes of the day, and one win doesn't change nearly a decade of crap team management nor the brutally dim prospects of the very near future. There is no agenda - this is truly a reflection of where even maybe hardcore fans are at. 

It was a deluge and he completed 75% of his passes. Not really a game  of his to be complaining about 

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3 hours ago, csx said:

It was a deluge and he completed 75% of his passes. Not really a game  of his to be complaining about 

The first 50 minutes were atrocious - that is certainly eligible for critique. Prior to that last drive the team was something like 2-12 on third down and Bryce had barely over 100 yards passing. As I said before, most of those throws on the last drive were NFL minimum at best and were still low quality, and had Atlanta not inexplicably gone into prevent and turned off the pressure (DL clearly went into contain mode) this isn't even a discussion. It took a team reverting to playing no actual defense for this to happen... I just don't understand the praise. He and the offense have been so bad this year that the bar has fallen so far to make this level of play seem impressive. 

Hell, Ridder only three for 15 fewer yards but had a TD. If not for that awful interception he had a better day than Bryce, or at least as good, but folks seems happy to roast him.

Edited by KSpan
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10 minutes ago, KSpan said:

The first 50 minutes were atrocious - that is certainly eligible for critique. Prior to that last drive the team was something like 2-12 on third down and Bryce had barely over 100 yards passing. As I said before, most of those throws on the last drive were NFL minimum at best and were still low quality, and had Atlanta not inexplicably gone into prevent and turned off the pressure (DL clearly went into contain mode) this isn't even a discussion. It took a team reverting to playing no actual defense for this to happen... I just don't understand the praise. He and the offense have been so bad this year that the bar has fallen so far to make this level of play seem impressive. 

Hell, Ridder only three for 15 fewer yards but had a TD. If not for that awful interception he had a better day than Bryce, or at least as good, but folks seems happy to roast him.

Same thing for the Texans game.  Final drive, prevent defense and they give Bryce his underneath throws.  We can't rely on a near perfect day for the defense and Eddy not to miss a kick for a victory every game. It just isn't realistic.

Crazy thing is if Eddy had missed both the Texans' kick and the one yesterday, we'd 0-14 and he'd be 100% cut.  Meanwhile, the hopium huffers are doing victory laps while crowning Young.

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48 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Same thing for the Texans game.  Final drive, prevent defense and they give Bryce his underneath throws.  We can't rely on a near perfect day for the defense and Eddy not to miss a kick for a victory every game. It just isn't realistic.

Crazy thing is if Eddy had missed both the Texans' kick and the one yesterday, we'd 0-14 and he'd be 100% cut.  Meanwhile, the hopium huffers are doing victory laps while crowning Young.

Eddy made the kicks and the games turned out how they did, so that is what it is. It is not speculation though to recognize how defensive decisions accommodated those final drives, and while the offense can only play against the defenses on the field it always confuses me when teams stray from defensive strategies that have worked for an entire game in favor of the prevent. At least find a middle-ground or something, but don't suddenly just let a QB hang out, especially with how bad the Panthers receivers are. It's about the only fomrula that would allow them to score and yet Arthur Smith did it anyway. 

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1 hour ago, 45catfan said:

Same thing for the Texans game.  Final drive, prevent defense and they give Bryce his underneath throws.  We can't rely on a near perfect day for the defense and Eddy not to miss a kick for a victory every game. It just isn't realistic.

Crazy thing is if Eddy had missed both the Texans' kick and the one yesterday, we'd 0-14 and he'd be 100% cut.  Meanwhile, the hopium huffers are doing victory laps while crowning Young.

You expect a kicker to make a cheap shot like yesterday tho. I'll agree on relying on the D. I think being disappointed in the offense but happy with the final drive itself is reasonable.

Calling Young's throws on that final drive underneath throws is a bit wild tho.  He had 3 deep throws that drive for like 60 yards... Amusingly probably his three longest completions all day...

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12 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

You expect a kicker to make a cheap shot like yesterday tho. I'll agree on relying on the D. I think being disappointed in the offense but happy with the final drive itself is reasonable.

Calling Young's throws on that final drive underneath throws is a bit wild tho.  He had 3 deep throws that drive for like 60 yards... Amusingly probably his three longest completions all day...

Passes of 18, 19 and 20.  Correct like 60 yards, but it's a sad state of affairs when 15-20 yard passes are considered deep throws.  Granted, they aren't check down throws, but Falcons got passive on their pressures on the last drive, so no need for dump offs to the hot read.

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18 minutes ago, mav1234 said:

You expect a kicker to make a cheap shot like yesterday tho. I'll agree on relying on the D. I think being disappointed in the offense but happy with the final drive itself is reasonable.

Calling Young's throws on that final drive underneath throws is a bit wild tho.  He had 3 deep throws that drive for like 60 yards... Amusingly probably his three longest completions all day...

Yeah but they were 20-yard, 19-yard and 19-yard screens behind the line of scrimmage in garbage time against a team running Prevent defense with a 1-point lead.

#HuddleLogic

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6 minutes ago, 45catfan said:

Passes of 18, 19 and 20.  Correct like 60 yards, but it's a sad state of affairs when 15-20 yard passes are considered deep throws.  Granted, they aren't check down throws, but Falcons got passive on their pressures on the last drive, so no need for dump offs to the hot read.

In ANY offense, 18, 19, and 20 yards are deep throws... That's just what they are... If Young hit those throws more consistently, I'd be more hopeful.  As it is, he's only had a few drives where he completes passes like that more than once.

I do not think that drive was a prevent defense  btw.  I am pretty sure they rushed 4 or 5  every play... I'd have to re-watch it tho.

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2 minutes ago, Carl Spackler said:

10 defenders within 5 yards of the LOS is a weird Prevent.

Screenshot 2023-12-18 at 11.59.27 AM.png

Yeahhh... I don't remember feeling like the Falcons had gone full prevent.

100% honest it feels like some posters are unable to allow any praise at all for some players. There's very little good from Young this year, but like it or not, he's had a few really good drives.

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    • The referee assigned to this game is Shawn Smith. This is a critical data point for betting purposes because his crew has one of the most distinct, long-term statistical biases in the NFL. "Road Team" Bias: Historically, Shawn Smith is known as the "Road Team Referee." In a league where home teams usually win ~55% of the time, home teams in Smith's games have historically won at a rate far below league average (often hovering around 40-42%). Against The Spread (ATS): The trend is even starker here. Home teams have covered the spread at a rate of roughly 37-40% in his career. The Mechanism: Analysis shows his crew tends to call a higher rate of False Start and Unnecessary Roughness penalties on the Home Team. This negates the traditional home-field advantage (crowd noise causing false starts for the visitors). Impact on This Game: This specific assignment heavily favors the Buccaneers (Road Team). If you believe the referee influences the game, Smith's presence suggests the Panthers will struggle to get "home cooking" calls and may face untimely procedural flags that stall drives. The Panthers have only had Shawn Smith officiate four home games since he became a head referee in 2018, and they are all losses. Date Opponent Result Score Nov 24, 2024 vs. Kansas City Chiefs Loss 27–30 Oct 9, 2022 vs. San Francisco 49ers Loss 15–37 Dec 12, 2021 vs. Atlanta Falcons Loss 21–29 Nov 25, 2018 vs. Seattle Seahawks Loss 27–30 Considering the how rare it is for Shawn Smith to officiate a Panthers game at all, this seems like an odd time to assign him to a Panthers game, unless the NFL wants to kill the Panthers season once and for all.  The Panthers' offensive line situation creates a "perfect storm" for referee Shawn Smith's specific tendency to call False Starts on the home team. The "Carousel" Factor (Communication Vulnerability) The most damning stat for the Panthers' offensive line in 2025 is their lack of continuity. The Stat: By Week 13, the Panthers had already fielded their 10th different offensive line combination. The Impact: False starts are often "communication penalties"—they happen when a guard doesn't hear the center's snap count or a tackle anticipates the wrong cadence. A unit that hasn't played together struggles with non-verbal communication. The Shawn Smith Multiplier: Shawn Smith’s crew calls False Starts at a high rate on home teams. He will likely look for flinches on the exterior of the line. A disjointed line that is constantly rotating players (due to the injuries of starters like Cade Mays and the illness issues with Robert Hunt earlier this season) is "fresh meat" for this specific referee bias. The Specific Culprits (2025 Penalties) Ikem Ekwonu (LT): Leads the team with 4 False Start penalties this season. He is the most frequent violator on the line. Taylor Moton (RT): Has been flagged for 3 False Starts. The Trap: Smith’s crew often focuses on the tackles (the players furthest from the ball) jumping early to get an edge on speed rushers. Since Ekwonu struggles with this discipline naturally, having a referee who hunts for it is a massive disadvantage. The "Managed Outcome" Synthesis The "Bucs Cover" Script: If the desired outcome is a Buccaneers win to solidify their playoff standing, the officials simply have to apply the letter of the law. Calling strict False Starts on a confused, banged-up Panthers O-line will consistently put them in "3rd and Long" situations, killing their drives and allowing the Bucs (-3.5) to cover easily. The "Close Game" Script: If the desired outcome is "Week 18 Drama" (keeping the division tied), look for the officials to ignore the Panthers' twitchy tackles. If Ekwonu jumps a split-second early and no flag is thrown, it effectively neutralizes the Bucs' pass rush, allowing the Panthers to keep the score close. Summary of the Edge Vulnerability: Extreme. The Panthers are playing backup interior linemen (like Jake Curhan or practice squad call-ups) next to jumpy tackles. Betting Implication: This strongly reinforces the Bucs -3 or -3.5 play. The combination of a "Road Team Referee" and a "Home Team O-Line in chaos" suggests the Panthers will beat themselves with procedural penalties. Based on the collision of the hard data (Referee bias + Offensive Line injuries) and the soft narratives ("Managed Outcomes"), here is the definitive recommendation. If you have to place a single Moneyline bet to win this game straight up: The Pick: Tampa Bay Buccaneers (-165) While the "Entertainment Script" hints at a Panthers upset to keep the division messy, the structural disadvantage the Panthers face in this specific matchup is too massive to ignore. Here is why the Buccaneers are the stong moneyline play: 1. The "Shawn Smith" Road-Field Advantage This is the decisive factor. In the NFL, Home Field Advantage usually accounts for about 1.5 to 2 points of value. The Reality: Referee Shawn Smith negates that advantage entirely. His crew calls penalties in a way that historically suppresses home crowd momentum (False Starts, holding). The Result: You are essentially getting the Buccaneers on a neutral field (or even a "pseudo-home" field) against a team with a worse roster. 2. The "Drive-Killer" Synergy To win as an underdog, the Panthers need to play a clean, mistake-free game to keep drives alive. The combination of Panthers' 10th O-Line combo + Jump-prone Tackles (Ekwonu) + A Referee who hunts False Starts is a recipe for disaster. The Scenario: Expect the Panthers to face multiple "1st and 15" or "3rd and 12" situations due to procedural flags. These drive-killers will force them to punt or settle for field goals, while the Bucs' offense (led by Mayfield) stays on schedule. 3. The "TV Product" Counter-Argument You asked about the "Managed Outcome." While a Panthers win creates "chaos," the NFL also values Star Power in the playoffs. Baker Mayfield and the Buccaneers are a proven national TV draw with recent playoff history. If the league has to choose between "Chaos" (Panthers) and "Ratings/Legitimacy" (Bucs), the "Script" likely leans toward ensuring the Buccaneers—the more marketable team—secure the division lead. They won't "fix" the game against the Panthers, but they won't intervene to save them from their own penalties. Final Verdict Betting on the Panthers requires you to hope for a miracle 4th-quarter collapse. Betting on the Buccaneers requires you to trust that a superior roster—aided by a favorable officiating crew—will control the game for the first 45 minutes. Take the Buccaneers Moneyline. The "Safe" money is on the Ref. The Prediction: Tampa Bay Buccaneers Win and Cover Projected Score: Buccaneers 27, Panthers 17 The Bet: Buccaneers -3 (or Moneyline -165) Confidence Level: High on the Winner; Moderate on the Spread (due to potential "garbage time" variance).
    • He isn't a good HC. I think he has proved that conclusively.
    • The missed tackle percentage is on that screen cap.
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