The 49ers Super Bowl problem

[rayzor]

the problem with dynasty's and really any team that consistently go deep in the playoffs (not something we see much of these days) is that they are able to handle clutch situations on that stage better just because of experience. the moment isn't too big for them because they have experience in it. occasionally they will meet a team that beats them one year, but they are typically one and done...the next year they drop off a cliff.

shanny doesn't know how to get a team to handle those clutch moments and he doesn't know how to handle them himself. 

that's what it boils down to. this era we're in right now belongs to the chiefs because they have the right mix of players, coaches, and experience. like the pats, they didn't always have the most outstanding team during the regular season and there would always be those teams who look like they could give them a run for the money come playoff time, but when playoff time comes...that's when the great teams really shine

With these teams, there isn't much you can do to stop them except become them and that won't happen for another decade.

[jamos14]

1 minute ago, rayzor said:

the problem with dynasty's and really any team that consistently go deep in the playoffs (not something we see much of these days) is that they are able to handle clutch situations on that stage better just because of experience. the moment isn't too big for them because they have experience in it. occasionally they will meet a team that beats them one year, but they are typically one and done...the next year they drop off a cliff.

shanny doesn't know how to get a team to handle those clutch moments and he doesn't know how to handle them himself. 

that's what it boils down to. this era we're in right now belongs to the chiefs because they have the right mix of players, coaches, and experience. like the pats, they didn't always have the most outstanding team during the regular season and there would always be those teams who look like they could give them a run for the money come playoff time, but when playoff time comes...that's when the great teams really shine

With these teams, there isn't much you can do to stop them except become them and that won't happen for another decade.

I agree that it contributes to Chiefs success.  But this SF has it too.  They were just in the Super Bowl 4 years ago and have been to the NFC title game 3 out of 4 years since then.     They are more experienced than probably every other team in the NFL except KC.

[t96]

50 minutes ago, jamos14 said:

 

2. 

 

I think Shannahan has the choker label because he hasn't had an elite QB and is forced to run the ball to have success.  But his play calling stye gets away from the run game too easily.  Especially when it's working.

 

SF wins last night if CMC had 30 carries (which is a lot) but Purdy wasn't doing anything unless a receiver was wide open.  Purdy 38 throws is stupid!    CMC was gashing them all night.

Honestly looking back at the game I really can't fault Shanahan for not running the ball more. It was more of a timing of when to run it issue. He basically abandoned it in the 3rd quarter before going back to it heavily in the 4th. McCaffrey had 22 carries and pretty low yards per carry so not sure giving him the ball more would've helped them. Not sure why they didn't run Deebo at all though.

 

To the OP, 1&2 equally. Chiefs are incredible but they are beatable and on paper the 49ers have a better team outside of QB. Also I think it's important to note that having Mahomes/Reid and Brady/Belichick on the other sideline can really get in the head of the opposing coach. We've seen it all postseason with the Chiefs, both the Bills and Ravens abandoned the run too against them. I'm not sure that Shanny would choke like that against a less imposing QB/HC combo on the other sideline. Not to excuse the choking just think that factors in too

[Mr. Scot]

7 minutes ago, rayzor said:

the problem with dynasty's and really any team that consistently go deep in the playoffs (not something we see much of these days) is that they are able to handle clutch situations on that stage better just because of experience. the moment isn't too big for them because they have experience in it. occasionally they will meet a team that beats them one year, but they are typically one and done...the next year they drop off a cliff.

shanny doesn't know how to get a team to handle those clutch moments and he doesn't know how to handle them himself. 

that's what it boils down to. this era we're in right now belongs to the chiefs because they have the right mix of players, coaches, and experience. like the pats, they didn't always have the most outstanding team during the regular season and there would always be those teams who look like they could give them a run for the money come playoff time, but when playoff time comes...that's when the great teams really shine

With these teams, there isn't much you can do to stop them except become them and that won't happen for another decade.

There are certain quarterbacks (Jackson, right now) who look unstoppable in a regular season but fade in the playoffs.

I'd say there are certain coaches that do that too.

And then there's Shanahan? 

Does he fade in the playoffs? He fades in the Super Bowl.

I questioned in another thread whether he qualifies as a "chessmaster" head coach. My answer would be no. He's like the kid who's really good at chess and can beat everybody around him, but loses when it goes up against the best of the best.

To be fair, that would have been a pretty good description of Andy Reid as well up to a few years ago, so maybe he has a chance to overcome that.

We'll see.

[SCO96]

43 minutes ago, jamos14 said:

 

2. 

 

I think Shannahan has the choker label because he hasn't had an elite QB and is forced to run the ball to have success.  But his play calling stye gets away from the run game too easily.  Especially when it's working.

 

SF wins last night if CMC had 30 carries (which is a lot) but Purdy wasn't doing anything unless a receiver was wide open.  Purdy 38 throws is stupid!    CMC was gashing them all night.

I tend to agree with you on the run game aspect. They should have run it a little more to:

a) wear down the defense and run down the clock

b) Keep Mahomes off of the field .

CMC is a beast. But, he is still a small back. I really think the 49ers should consider drafting a big back in the mid to late rounds. Someone who is about 6'2/235 to complement Christian. They need someone who can convert in those 3rd and short situations. I'd be looking for the type of back that no defender wants to tackle late in games. It would give them a 1-2 punch and keep both backs from tiring during the game.

If Shanahan had our "double trouble" duo of Williams and Stewart, they would have run all over KC last night.

[rayzor]

15 minutes ago, jamos14 said:

I agree that it contributes to Chiefs success.  But this SF has it too.  They were just in the Super Bowl 4 years ago and have been to the NFC title game 3 out of 4 years since then.     They are more experienced than probably every other team in the NFL except KC.

you could make an argument that is because the rest of the NFC is just so bad rather than the 49ers are that great. 

i just don't see greatness in the 49ers, not the level the chiefs have. i'm not a chiefs fan, btw. i want them knocked down for the sake of parity within the league. i think the chiefs will likely be back in the superbowl next year. i don't see that happening with the 49ers. they might make it to the NFCCG, but i think someone else will pass them by.

the biggest thing that will hold them back is shanny. they'll be really good, but they will never be great like the chiefs and the pats.

[rayzor]

13 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

To be fair, that would have been a pretty good description of Andy Reid as well up to a few years ago, so maybe he has a chance to overcome that.

what helped him the most was finding/stumbling on the right QB to fit what he had in his head. 

that's kind of like with bill and brady. would the patriots or either of them have been that great if it was missing either one of those two commodities? i doubt it. it was the ight fit and it was an incredibly rare fit.

 same thing going on with reid and mahomes. right fit at the right time and again, it's an incredibly rare thing. 

if shanahan finds his mahomes, then maybe he could turn that corner. i just don't think that it will happen.

[OldhamA]

Purdy wilted last night - that Trey Lance trade finally came back to bite them.

He left so many yards on the field - I had flashbacks to Young last night. 

[NAS]

Purdy is a system QB and is really good in that system.  But he's not a QB who can improvise a lot or take over a game like Mahomes or other elite QBs. 

[Mr. Scot]

18 minutes ago, rayzor said:

what helped him the most was finding/stumbling on the right QB to fit what he had in his head. 

that's kind of like with bill and brady. would the patriots or either of them have been that great if it was missing either one of those two commodities? i doubt it. it was the ight fit and it was an incredibly rare fit.

 same thing going on with reid and mahomes. right fit at the right time and again, it's an incredibly rare thing. 

if shanahan finds his mahomes, then maybe he could turn that corner. i just don't think that it will happen.

Shanahan might genuinely believe he can do it with Purdy.

I'd call that a Ron Rivera style emotional decision.

[Ricky Prickles]

1 hour ago, dave-o said:

Travis Kelce should have been sent to the locker room not to return after what he did to coach...

What did he do, I missed that

[SCO96]

10 minutes ago, Mr. Scot said:

There are certain quarterbacks (Jackson, right now) who look unstoppable in a regular season but fade in the playoffs.

I'd say there are certain coaches that do that too.

And then there's Shanahan? 

Does he fade in the playoffs? He fades in the Super Bowl.

I questioned in another thread whether he qualifies as a "chessmaster" head coach. My answer would be no. He's like the kid who's really good at chess and can beat everybody around him, but loses when it goes up against the best of the best.

To be fair, that would have been a pretty good description of Andy Reid as well up to a few years ago, so maybe he has a chance to overcome that.

We'll see.

Shanahan reminds me of Tom Landry.

Landry was super intelligent...and arguably the only guy in NFL history during the SB era who could be his own own offensive and defensive coordinator. Yet, the Cowboys often chocked in big games under Landry. He tended to over analyze things and make big mistakes in crucial moments of championship games. Pete Gent (North Dallas Forty author) has said he never understood how someone so smart would freeze up at the worst possible times.

The Cowboys were preseason favorites to win the championship from 1967-1970 and fell short every year. Each loss was to a less talented team. Landry finally got over the hump in 1971 when Staubach took over at the QB position. 

Shanahan has lost 2 SB's to Reid. And both times his team outplayed KC for the majority of the game. His offense lost their first half momentum in both losses. He was also the OC for Atlanta when they blew a 28-3 to NE and lost the SB. He needs to figure out why his teams can't put games away when it counts. Had his teams scored 1 more TD in the 2nd half in any of the above 3 SB losses, they would have walked away as world champions. 

 

[DeAngelo Beason]

I think it's going to take a very special team to unseat Mahomes. The talent on the 49ers outclassed the Chiefs at so many positions, but Mahomes elevated that team like no one I've ever seen.  He's the best quarterback to ever play the game in my opinion.  I think Rodgers is probably a distant second.  

[t96]

1 hour ago, NAS said:

Purdy is a system QB and is really good in that system.  But he's not a QB who can improvise a lot or take over a game like Mahomes or other elite QBs. 

as Cam said and got absolutely trashed for... I'm loving Cam as a media analyst