The 49ers Super Bowl problem

[kungfoodude]

5 hours ago, pantherclaw said:

I've seen enough of Purdy to know he's not a system QB and has a bright future ahead of him. 

The 49ers controlled the game the first half. 

 

Despite losing a very good linebacker, and one of their starting guards,  they still had the lead in the 2nd half. 

I don't care how many touchs a RB has... the 2nd half with the lead is the time to lean on that run game. 

They completely abandoned the run, especially on early downs.  Their offense was unable to sustain drives.  

Despite all the other miscues in the game, including CMC's rare fumble,  the 49ers would be champions right now if they had leaned on the8r run game in the second half.  That's without scoring anymore than they did.  Knowing how well a good run game opens things up...they probably would have scored another touchdown....but that's a what if. 

Kyle outsmarted himself.  Not sure why he does it, but he has a history of doing it now. Don't blame Purdy for Kyle's decisions. 

I think a Panthers Brock Purdy in 2023 would have been pretty bad. I do think a lot of his success is that system.

After all, Jimmy G looked good in that system too.

[RumHam]

On 2/12/2024 at 9:08 AM, kungfoodude said:

Which of these statements is the MOST true:

1. Kyle Shanahan is a choker.

2. The 49ers lack an elite QB.

3. Wrong place, wrong time. Mahomes is possibly the GOAT(TBD, also he lost to Brady).

 

Or what are the other obvious problems? Objectively, they are/were insanely more talent stacked than KC this year.

its shanahan.

[DeAngelo Beason]

13 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

Cam drug WR's 1000x times worse to a one loss regular season and SB appearance.

Rodgers if anything is the most overrated QB of his generation based on the playoffs.

As much as I love Cam Newton, he doesn't compare to Aaron Rodgers.  Calling Rodgers overrated is a little mind boggling.  There are so many holes to poke in that statement that I frankly would rather not even start for the sake of saving time.

[blackcat]

We've got much worse SuperBowl problems.....

[CRA]

24 minutes ago, DeAngelo Beason said:

As much as I love Cam Newton, he doesn't compare to Aaron Rodgers.  Calling Rodgers overrated is a little mind boggling.  There are so many holes to poke in that statement that I frankly would rather not even start for the sake of saving time.

personality issues aside.  I think there is a little bit of a comparable with Dan Marino when it comes to Rodgers (largely just the talent vs end game resume).   Could argue both were the best pure QBs of their era and yet didn't really have the success you would think should come with it. 

[LinvilleGorge]

On 2/12/2024 at 9:08 AM, kungfoodude said:

Which of these statements is the MOST true:

1. Kyle Shanahan is a choker.

2. The 49ers lack an elite QB.

3. Wrong place, wrong time. Mahomes is possibly the GOAT(TBD, also he lost to Brady).

 

Or what are the other obvious problems? Objectively, they are/were insanely more talent stacked than KC this year.

Yes to all honestly.

1. Shanny did it again. He bafflingly abandoned the run with a lead in the SB. Why? Is he a choker? Is he just getting cute with a lead trying to show off his offensive brilliance? No clue the reason but he's done the same thing twice on the biggest stage in sports.

2. Yeah, Purdy is a JAG surrounded by an elite team in a great offensive system. 

3. Yeah, Mahomes is that dude. And give the Chiefs' D credit. They played their asses off too.

[Day1PanthersFan]

there is a possibility A team can outclutch them 

Mahommes will find his kryptonite, a team more determined , like the Eli manning led giants laughed in the face of the unbeatable patriots , twice 

[pantherj]

When a game managing QB faces a HoF QB the team with the game manager has to have an "A" game to win. You can't have major mistakes and expect to beat a team with a HoF level QB. CMC fumbled and the other guy fumbled as well among other major mistakes. A game manager QB needs near perfect play from everyone to defeat a HoF type QB. That's why I don't really want a game manager, and I'd rather just cycle through QBs until we hit on an elite guy. Otherwise we're kidding ourselves if we think we're beating Mahomes for a SB trophy.

If our fan base just wants to be at the middle of the pack, then any game managing QB will do if we have good coaches and a great GM. Eventually we'll construct a "one shinning moment" roster where we face Mahomes in the SB and lose. Then the roster will erode due to free agency, and the process of trying to piece together another mega roster beings, and the next thing you know you're in a old folks home and the Panthers never won a SB. I'd rather not go that route. I say cycle though QBs until you hit on a total badass, or die trying. Both are risky, but I'd rather go for it all.

[Ricky Prickles]

59 minutes ago, pantherj said:

When a game managing QB faces a HoF QB the team with the game manager has to have an "A" game to win. You can't have major mistakes and expect to beat a team with a HoF level QB. CMC fumbled and the other guy fumbled as well among other major mistakes. A game manager QB needs near perfect play from everyone to defeat a HoF type QB. That's why I don't really want a game manager, and I'd rather just cycle through QBs until we hit on an elite guy. Otherwise we're kidding ourselves if we think we're beating Mahomes for a SB trophy.

If our fan base just wants to be at the middle of the pack, then any game managing QB will do if we have good coaches and a great GM. Eventually we'll construct a "one shinning moment" roster where we face Mahomes in the SB and lose. Then the roster will erode due to free agency, and the process of trying to piece together another mega roster beings, and the next thing you know you're in a old folks home and the Panthers never won a SB. I'd rather not go that route. I say cycle though QBs until you hit on a total badass, or die trying. Both are risky, but I'd rather go for it all.

Yep, agreed. Keep churning those QB's until you hit on that freak of nature HOF type guy who could do it all and carry a team. If that pot of gold is found at the end of the rainbow the franchises who trajectory should trend upward. They are so rare but I would take the risk trying to find them until I did. 

[Khyber53]

Every year, one team loses the Super Bowl. 

And the pundits roll out about how terrible of a coach that team has, or what a group of over achievers they were and that they were bound to come crashing down.

And yanno what? It's total bullshit.

And in this case, it's really bullshit.

They had the champs on the ropes and took them not just to the final bell, but into overtime. And they scored first in overtime, taking a field goal because the other team was the world champs for a reason. And then, they couldn't hold off Patrick Mahomes and one of the best assembled teams in recent history.

Yes, they lost. But they aren't the losers, including their HC (and DC, too) are being made out to be.

It was a good game, well fought and narrowly lost. Let that be the history, not this race to the bottom, hot takes punditry that ruins every fuging thing.

[MasterAwesome]

2 hours ago, pantherj said:

When a game managing QB faces a HoF QB the team with the game manager has to have an "A" game to win. You can't have major mistakes and expect to beat a team with a HoF level QB. CMC fumbled and the other guy fumbled as well among other major mistakes. A game manager QB needs near perfect play from everyone to defeat a HoF type QB. That's why I don't really want a game manager, and I'd rather just cycle through QBs until we hit on an elite guy. Otherwise we're kidding ourselves if we think we're beating Mahomes for a SB trophy.

If our fan base just wants to be at the middle of the pack, then any game managing QB will do if we have good coaches and a great GM. Eventually we'll construct a "one shinning moment" roster where we face Mahomes in the SB and lose. Then the roster will erode due to free agency, and the process of trying to piece together another mega roster beings, and the next thing you know you're in a old folks home and the Panthers never won a SB. I'd rather not go that route. I say cycle though QBs until you hit on a total badass, or die trying. Both are risky, but I'd rather go for it all.

But based on everything you've outlined above, I could also accurately frame it as the HoF QB needing his team to have near perfect play to barely defeat a game managing QB.  49ers lost 2 fumbles and missed an XP, and yet they took that HoF QB to overtime.

It feels like people are trying to paint this image of a JAG QB with an all-time great team around him while Mahomes carried a bunch of bums to a Super Bowl victory through his sheer greatness.  Purdy does have a great team around him no doubt, but the Chiefs' defense was damn elite - 2nd in yards and TDs on the season, and allowing less than 14 points a game in the postseason leading up to the Super Bowl...they had just held the league MVP to 10 points in the AFC Championship.  Reid + Spagnuolo is virtually indisputably the best offensive/defensive coaching duo.  49ers for sure have the much better offensive skill players.  But all things considered (offense, defense, coaching) - I don't think the gap between the 49ers and Chiefs outside of QB is all that significant, and yet it was a damn close game.  I'm sorry, but if you give me two relatively evenly matched teams and you tell me one has a JAG at QB and the other has a HoF QB in his prime, I'm not expecting an OT nail-biter.  It ain't adding up.

[CRA]

Just now, MasterAwesome said:

But based on everything you've outlined above, I could also accurately frame it as the HoF QB needing his team to have near perfect play to barely defeat a game managing QB.  49ers lost 2 fumbles and missed an XP, and yet they took that HoF QB to overtime.

It feels like people are trying to paint this image of a JAG QB with an all-time great team around him while Mahomes carried a bunch of bums to a Super Bowl victory through his sheer greatness.  Purdy does have a great team around him no doubt, but the Chiefs' defense was damn elite - 2nd in yards and TDs on the season, and allowing less than 14 points a game in the postseason leading up to the Super Bowl...they had just held the league MVP to 10 points in the AFC Championship.  Reid + Spagnuolo is virtually indisputably the best offensive/defensive coaching duo.  49ers for sure have the much better offensive skill players.  But all things considered (offense, defense, coaching) - I don't think the gap between the 49ers and Chiefs outside of QB is all that significant, and yet it was a damn close game.  I'm sorry, but if you give me two relatively evenly matched teams and you tell me one has a JAG at QB and the other has a HoF QB in his prime, I'm not expecting an OT nail-biter.  It ain't adding up.

sports is sports.  the better team doesn't always win.   KC is a well coached and one that catches a lot of breaks IMO.  That's sports. 

I mean, I still don't think KC was the best actual team in the NFL this year.  Just like I don't think Denver was in 2015.   I wouldn't even say Denver was the 2nd best on the year.  They were there at the end and won that game  though.  They get the trophy. 

You can replay that game, and I'd still take the 49ers. 

[kungfoodude]

7 hours ago, DeAngelo Beason said:

As much as I love Cam Newton, he doesn't compare to Aaron Rodgers.  Calling Rodgers overrated is a little mind boggling.  There are so many holes to poke in that statement that I frankly would rather not even start for the sake of saving time.

He is overrated in the sense of winning. His talent isn’t questionable but he is also 11-10 in his career in the playoffs. For reference, a much less talented Eli Manning was 8-4 in the playoffs. Heck, Cam was 3-4. 

That's the point. He had an embarrasment of talent over his career in GB yet delivered one title. I don't see how he is in the same class as a winner as the guys he is compared to.

 

[kungfoodude]

57 minutes ago, Khyber53 said:

Every year, one team loses the Super Bowl. 

And the pundits roll out about how terrible of a coach that team has, or what a group of over achievers they were and that they were bound to come crashing down.

And yanno what? It's total bullshit.

And in this case, it's really bullshit.

They had the champs on the ropes and took them not just to the final bell, but into overtime. And they scored first in overtime, taking a field goal because the other team was the world champs for a reason. And then, they couldn't hold off Patrick Mahomes and one of the best assembled teams in recent history.

Yes, they lost. But they aren't the losers, including their HC (and DC, too) are being made out to be.

It was a good game, well fought and narrowly lost. Let that be the history, not this race to the bottom, hot takes punditry that ruins every fuging thing.

Well the difference is that this just happened to them in 2020. That doesn’t make this an outlier.