JC Horn talks about receiver imposible to cover and not TMac!

[jb2288]

6 hours ago, tukafan21 said:

Seems very possible that Thielen could end up being the odd man out of the WR rotation this year and I think we may end up trading him.

If Renfrow proves to be just as, if not more, effective as a possession WR out of the slot, then there really isn't a role for Thielen.  As he isn't at all an outside WR these days, Horn is going to be the speedster in the slot, and then we have T-Mac/XL/Coker who can all play outside or slide into the slot and likely will be rotating who lines up where all year.

If he's going to be our #6 in that sense, find a WR needy team at the end of camp and try and flip him for a MLB if possible, he's gotta be useful to a contending team who needs a steady presence and sure hands in the slot (Buffalo?).

I'd love to have him around to mentor T-Mac/XL/Coker, but there's also no reason that can't be Renfrow either and we badly need a MLB or even another CB, much more than we need a 6th WR.

I mentioned this 2 weeks ago as a very long shot hypothetical, but with Jewell gone now I think this could become likely. I’d look at the Pats

[jb2288]

16 minutes ago, theinstrumental said:

Coker had ~80% of Thielen’s yardage last year. As a UFA, not the first option.

 

It feels like everyone’s anchoring on that outlier stretch Thielen had two years ago. He hasn’t been in that form since. He should comfortably be behind T-Mac this year, and not such a big focus that it’s worth taking the reps from XL and Coker. And if Renfrow can give us the same vet presence, but is five years younger? Pretty easy to see how AT gets crowded out.

Imo ATs value is not volume at this point in his career and our personnel. If he has 800 yards great, but his real value is having a guy you know can get separation on a critical 3rd and 5 or 4th and 2. If Renfrow can do that, AT becomes less valuable. 

[kungfoodude]

2 hours ago, Camp Fodder said:

This and people saying trade Thielen are people thinking too highly of Coker and XL. Outside of a catch or two what has Coker done in actual games?

poo, what has XL done? Coker is far better in comparison, especially when you consider targets/opportunities.

The point being, our fans are putting way too many eggs in the XL/Tmac/Coker/Horn basket.

If AT and Renfrow just fuging work, they need the reps. It's not just about the development of those young WR's, it's about figuring out if we have a franchise QB or not. That's a significantly more important question to answer.

Doesn't mean I want to jettison those guys.

[Tbe]

The odds of AT and Renfro both staying healthy all season is low.

Keep both. We’ll need them.

[kungfoodude]

4 minutes ago, Tbe said:

The odds of AT and Renfro both staying healthy all season is low.

Keep both. We’ll need them.

There is that too. 

[ECHornet]

If you’re building the right culture, and imo we are, you only trade Theilen this year if he requests it or becomes a locker room problem which I can’t foresee. 
 

The guy contemplated retirement and wanted to come back here to continue building the foundation of that culture. He’s been more than solid for our offense and Bryce. He’s also been great in the community. You don’t turn around and ship him off, unless he wants to go contend and we’re out of it. That would be a bad look imo. 

Edited August 2 by ECHornet

[CRA]

2 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

poo, what has XL done? Coker is far better in comparison, especially when you consider targets/opportunities.

The point being, our fans are putting way too many eggs in the XL/Tmac/Coker/Horn basket.

If AT and Renfrow just fuging work, they need the reps. It's not just about the development of those young WR's, it's about figuring out if we have a franchise QB or not. That's a significantly more important question to answer.

Doesn't mean I want to jettison those guys.

XL IMO has the highest ceiling of any WR on the roster….

he has one season in the books as a rookie with inconsistent QB play.  People are way too hard on XL IMO

and I will continue my prediction here, if Renfrow can stay healthy….top 3 in receptions 

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, CRA said:

XL IMO has the highest ceiling of any WR on the roster….

he has one season in the books as a rookie with inconsistent QB play.  People are way too hard on XL IMO

and I will continue my prediction here, if Renfrow can stay healthy….top 3 in receptions 

XL is the highest ceiling and the lowest floor on the roster for WR's.

I also think Renfrow will play a big role if he can stay healthy. He is significantly better than most of our young WR's.

 

[PNW_PantherMan]

I’m gonna go with the guy we took top 10 as the highest ceiling.

XL has room to grow but I’m not sure about highest on the team.

Id add that if you’re gonna be that generous with ceilings then jimmy horn JR has the highest cause you can’t teach speed.  But it quickly becomes pretty clear how useless of a statement that is.

Edited August 2 by PNW_PantherMan

[Shotgun]

Its a bummer he wasn't talking about Tmac or XL.

[CRA]

1 minute ago, PNW_PantherMan said:

I’m gonna go with the guy we took top 10 as the highest ceiling.

XL has room to grow but I’m not sure about highest on the team.

Id add that if you’re gonna be that generous with ceilings then jimmy horn JR has the highest cause you can’t teach speed.  But it quickly becomes pretty clear how useless of a statement that is.

TMac a more polished WR coming in.  XL IMO is better built for the NFL when you look at his size and speed combo.   XL was a first rounder because of his potential/ceiling essentially.  TMac sort of got a quirky skillset.   Not super fast and doesn’t play really like his size suggests. 

If Horn projected with a high a ceiling he wouldn’t have been a 6th round flier. 

[csx]

2 hours ago, ECHornet said:

If you’re building the right culture, and imo we are, you only trade Theilen this year if he requests it or becomes a locker room problem which I can’t foresee. 
 

The guy contemplated retirement and wanted to come back here to continue building the foundation of that culture. He’s been more than solid for our offense and Bryce. He’s also been great in the community. You don’t turn around and ship him off, unless he wants to go contend and we’re out of it. That would be a bad look imo. 

I think you consider trading him toa contender mid season if he's interested and gets interest.

That makes everyone happy

[frankw]

2 hours ago, ECHornet said:

If you’re building the right culture, and imo we are, you only trade Theilen this year if he requests it or becomes a locker room problem which I can’t foresee. 
 

The guy contemplated retirement and wanted to come back here to continue building the foundation of that culture. He’s been more than solid for our offense and Bryce. He’s also been great in the community. You don’t turn around and ship him off, unless he wants to go contend and we’re out of it. That would be a bad look imo. 

The way some people here speak about the guy you would think he was a first ballot hall of famer.

How many other competitive franchises are agonizing over 35 year old WR's? Are the Texans? The oldest WR on their roster is 29. They have two playoff wins in 2 years. Is the goal competing and winning in the postseason or....?

Edited August 2 by frankw

[PNW_PantherMan]

2 hours ago, CRA said:

XL IMO has the highest ceiling of any WR on the roster….

he has one season in the books as a rookie with inconsistent QB play.  People are way too hard on XL IMO

and I will continue my prediction here, if Renfrow can stay healthy….top 3 in receptions 

Ability to actually catch footballs is part of that ceiling.  Without that it’s useless.

I'm not giving up on him but I don’t think you’re being realistic about his tools.