The Underperformers: WR Corps

[kungfoodude]

6 hours ago, top dawg said:

Catch percentage is probably as nebulous a receiving statistic as there is. 

Moreover, remember that Samuel has had some injuries, our receiving corps has had bad luck with injuries that caused us to use Samuel as a WR1, and Cam has had some injuries, so has Samuel ever really been in that great of a situation? He's only now played 32 games, and even less games as a receiver effectively in the flow of the game. I think your have to look at all that when trying to evaluate his true effectiveness or lack thereof.

It may not be the be all and end all of stats but there is a definitive difference between elite receivers and average receivers for the most part 

[cardiackat88.]

What would it take to talk Smitty into being the WRs coach?

[Mr. Scot]

1 hour ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Allen is a very good short to intermediate thrower, he just absolutely lacks a deep ball.

Shouldn't Samuel be able to take a short pass and make something of it?

He's considered to be the speediest of the group but Moore does that better (granted, more so last year than this one).

[top dawg]

51 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

It may not be the be all and end all of stats but there is a definitive different between elite receivers and average receivers for the most part 

Nah, man. The definitive difference is QB play. Brees is known for historical accuracy, and that's a big reason why Michael Thomas has an 82% catch rate. Julio Jones has a 64% catch rate this season. There's a lot of other things going on with catch rate, and that's why many RBs and TEs rank higher on the list than most receivers. 

[raz]

if you've got a cam that can run and a D that has to account for that at all times these guys make sense.  in a more traditional offense they're not very good, not at what they need to be good at.  its just all a bad fit

[raz]

35 minutes ago, cardiackat88. said:

What would it take to talk Smitty into being the WRs coach?

the 2 we're discussing would have quit already and probably have been assaulted. 

[LinvilleGorge]

1 hour ago, Mr. Scot said:

Shouldn't Samuel be able to take a short pass and make something of it?

He's considered to be the speediest of the group but Moore does that better (granted, more so last year than this one).

Moore runs like a RB once he has the ball. Samuel runs like a speedy WR. 

[Mr. Scot]

Just now, LinvilleGorge said:

Moore runs like a RB once he has the ball. Samuel runs like a speedy WR. 

I remember the disparity being pretty stark last year. Moore always seemed to be better on gadget plays than running actual pass routes.

[kungfoodude]

1 hour ago, top dawg said:

Nah, man. The definitive difference is QB play. Brees is known for historical accuracy, and that's a big reason why Michael Thomas has an 82% catch rate. Julio Jones has a 64% catch rate this season. There's a lot of other things going on with catch rate, and that's why many RBs and TEs rank higher on the list than most receivers. 

Agree to disagree. Nothing about Samuel has shown me he is in the same discussion as Thomas or Jones. He's a complimentary receiver at best. Certainly has never been a game changer in three years.

[WOW!!]

I said early .. Making a trade package for Devante parker wasn't a bad idea when Miami was giving away their young talent.. 

Now ppl see what I was thinking.. 

Moore is best in the slot.. And Samuels needs to be in the Ginn role.. Match them with a bigger number 1 type WR and this is a solid crew..

We still will need a QB with a bigger arm thoe..

[1of10Charnatives]

2 hours ago, raz said:

the 2 we're discussing would have quit already and probably have been assaulted. 

I love love love me some Smitty, but no one can say for sure this statement isn't true, or wouldn't be. I think he's a more mature person than he was when he was a young player, but he's still got that fire. 

[top dawg]

2 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

Agree to disagree. Nothing about Samuel has shown me he is in the same discussion as Thomas or Jones. He's a complimentary receiver at best. Certainly has never been a game changer in three years.

Never even said he was in that discussion. I was directly addressing your comment, and illustrating that even "elite" receivers have marked gaps between catch percentages. There are too many variables at play to put any real importance to catch percentage as a standard or any kind of litmus test as to who is a bad, good or great receiver.m, and I stand by the opinion that it starts with the competency of the QB.

[Icege]

On 11/20/2019 at 8:14 AM, Jeremy Igo said:

Curtis Samuel for all the hype he got in the offseason need to get much more aggressive. 

 

When Greg spoke about doing more than running around looking cool, I suspect it may be Samuel. 

I took that as a shot against Donte originally, but then expanded that to include just the young guys in general. Olsen seems like the type where if he was calling out a specific player, while he wouldn't name them there likely wouldn't be much confusion on who he was referring to.

Either way, Kyle Allen's deep ball is notoriously suspect and Curtis Samuel is supposed to be our deep threat. Kinda hard to run around and look cool when your guy can't even get you the ball unless it's on a screen, a shallow crossing route, or a reverse sweep

[Mr. Scot]

2 minutes ago, Icege said:

I took that as a shot against Donte originally, but then expanded that to include just the young guys in general. Olsen seems like the type where if he was calling out a specific player, while he wouldn't name them there likely wouldn't be much confusion on who he was referring to.

Either way, Kyle Allen's deep ball is notoriously suspect and Curtis Samuel is supposed to be our deep threat. Kinda hard to run around and look cool when your guy can't even get you the ball unless it's on a screen, a shallow crossing route, or a reverse sweep

Jackson is definitely more of a hot dogger / big talker than Samuel is.

As the Samuel, mentioned it earlier. Super speed guys are supposed to be the ones that can take a short pass and turn it into a big gain.

Are we seeing Samuel do that?