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Verge's Draft General thread 2021

Verge

By Verge,
in Carolina Panthers

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Verge Veteran

Verge

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1 hour ago, panthers55 said:

Plus Simms thinks Jones is better than Tua and he has been right over the last several drafts.

 

https://www.essentiallysports.com/nfl-news-popular-analyst-claims-alabama-mac-jones-is-a-better-nfl-prospect-as-compared-to-miami-dolphins-tua-tagovailoa/

The same Phil Simms that called Drew Lock, Dwayne Haskins, and Ryan Finley first rounders that he had much higher grades on than guys like Daniel Jones? Simms has been right and he has been wrong, it happens. He had Mitch T ahead of Watson and Mahomes, etc etc. We make mistakes, it's cool, every evaluator does, in that same breath I had Mitch ahead of Mahomes too, this is not a perfect art. 

I do however think it is completely bananas to put Mac Jones ahead of Tua if I'm being totally honest. You are banking on a guy with none of the physical attributes that everyone else has, that didn't show the things that anyone else did. He was productive in a stacked offense, that's great, but is that going to translate? Probably not. 

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Bama Panther Mentor

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12 minutes ago, Verge said:

 that didn't show the things that anyone else did. 

This is the statement that crushes any credibility on this though. Jones has shown tremendous ball placement, a great deep ball, tremendous anticipation, the ability to read a defense and quickly determine where to go with the ball, and even the ability to keep plays alive with his feet by sliding in the pocket when needed. These are things that one could argue some of the other top guys haven’t shown, at least consistently. 
The only thing Jones hasn’t shown is the ability to be a threat running the ball. QBs who are not a threat to run the ball can end up being greatly successful in the NFL. Not saying Jones will, but he could. 

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Verge

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16 minutes ago, Bama Panther said:

This is the statement that crushes any credibility on this though. Jones has shown tremendous ball placement, a great deep ball, tremendous anticipation, the ability to read a defense and quickly determine where to go with the ball, and even the ability to keep plays alive with his feet by sliding in the pocket when needed. These are things that one could argue some of the other top guys haven’t shown, at least consistently. 
The only thing Jones hasn’t shown is the ability to be a threat running the ball. QBs who are not a threat to run the ball can end up being greatly successful in the NFL. Not saying Jones will, but he could. 

I should clarify, the physical things that pop off tape. He did not show THOSE things. As I said, the production is there certainly. 

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SCPantherFan90 Rookie

SCPantherFan90

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@verge Woah! Wasn't expecting the Full Monty, but I appreciate the insight into your observations. 

Controversial prospects are the most fun, and Jones's difficulty to evaluate fascinates the heck out of me. I see valid points from people who love him and hate him. Really interested to see how everything plays out for him. 

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Basbear Grand Master

Basbear

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22 hours ago, Catsfan69 said:

A girl I doubt who is big time into all sports asked me what about Tua last year (for the Panthers)

I was slightly higher on him than Jones. But I told her he has bust all over him. His upside is very low end starter.

She asked why. I said no cannon.  All his recievers are wide ass open.

There's Alabama open and NFL open and the two aren't even in the same solar system. 

Tua is a good guy. I just think guys without am arm are outliers. 

 Could he prove me wrong? Sure but I think I have more equity in that bet.

If you dont like Tua, you will not like Jones either. I see both sides, but lean to Jones being a late second.

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OldhamA Grand Master

OldhamA

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14 hours ago, Verge said:

The same Phil Simms that called Drew Lock, Dwayne Haskins, and Ryan Finley first rounders that he had much higher grades on than guys like Daniel Jones? Simms has been right and he has been wrong, it happens. He had Mitch T ahead of Watson and Mahomes, etc etc. We make mistakes, it's cool, every evaluator does, in that same breath I had Mitch ahead of Mahomes too, this is not a perfect art. 

I do however think it is completely bananas to put Mac Jones ahead of Tua if I'm being totally honest. You are banking on a guy with none of the physical attributes that everyone else has, that didn't show the things that anyone else did. He was productive in a stacked offense, that's great, but is that going to translate? Probably not. 

Chris Simms. 

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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22 hours ago, Verge said:

The same Phil Simms that called Drew Lock, Dwayne Haskins, and Ryan Finley first rounders that he had much higher grades on than guys like Daniel Jones? Simms has been right and he has been wrong, it happens. He had Mitch T ahead of Watson and Mahomes, etc etc. We make mistakes, it's cool, every evaluator does, in that same breath I had Mitch ahead of Mahomes too, this is not a perfect art. 

I do however think it is completely bananas to put Mac Jones ahead of Tua if I'm being totally honest. You are banking on a guy with none of the physical attributes that everyone else has, that didn't show the things that anyone else did. He was productive in a stacked offense, that's great, but is that going to translate? Probably not. 

It wasn't Phil Simms, it was Chris Simms. You know that has been right every year for the most part.

It is fine though. Just like when I said Brown was going to be a great pick last year and was so excited when we got Chinn, I can wait for things to shake out. 

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

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2 hours ago, panthers55 said:

It wasn't Phil Simms, it was Chris Simms. You know that has been right every year for the most part.

It is fine though. Just like when I said Brown was going to be a great pick last year and was so excited when we got Chinn, I can wait for things to shake out. 

Who are you wanting at QB for us? Just curious...

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