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Jeremy Fowler on Panthers QB search

TheSpecialJuan
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Wundrbread33 Grand Master

Wundrbread33

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

That is all you want from your 1st round QB? Fine? QBs like Marino, Newton, and Rivers are great to watch, but they don't lead a team to a championship.

I don't want a QB who wins best in show. I want a QB who wins the race. Brady over Marino. Wilson over Newton. Brees over Vick. Flacco over Rivers. Foles over Bradford.

Successful franchise QBs win a SB in 2 to 5 years after they are drafted. Successful vet QBs win a SB with a new team in 1 to 3 years. 1 year and 10 year QBs with a team winning a SB are the outliers.

All 3 of them turned out to be worth a QB you could get with a 3rd round pick and the franchise rode them into oblivion for more than 5 seasons. Makes it easier to move on from a failed QB pick. I just wish they didn't waste 2 picks on Corral.

Oof

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

Coastal Carolina? Lol. I'd hitch the team to Sam Hartman as a shot in the dark before that, and Hartman is not at the top of my 2023 list.

Okay in fairness that was a different poster my mistake. Though it is easy to get mixed up considering it's you and one other guy who are this livid about the Corral selection. If we selected him in the top 10 I could understand the rage but we are in no man's land here hoping anything sticks we just had to watch a season of Darnold playing quarterback and no good to great veteran quarterbacks want to play here by choice. This is what you get when you think you can walk in and toss aside an MVP quarterback on a whim without a real plan and just start winning games. The NFL gave Tepper and Rhule a thick slice of humble pie.

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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6 hours ago, Pakmeng said:

I'm guessing you looked T some headlines on fan sites and Mike Florio.

When an economist did an actual study he found different.

You aren't going to like this but it was found that wonderlic is a stronger indicator of success than draft position.

 

The study: https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00036846.2017.1412081?journalCode=raec20

 

The artical explaining by same guy:

https://www.businessinsider.com/wonderlic-test-can-predict-long-term-success-for-nfl-quarterbacks-2020-4#:~:text=In other words%2C if two,more success in the NFL.

 

The artical was 2020 and the economists said no analysis existed so your claim of study after study can't be true. Florios opinion isn't a study.

 

There were about a half dozen analyses of this done in the mid 2000's to mid-2010's all of which showed either no correlation. 

I read those fuging things more than a decade ago because of a similar argument where I had the same(incorrect) opinion that you are holding now at that time.

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Luciu5 Veteran

Luciu5

Posted
Posted (edited)
35 minutes ago, CPantherKing said:

I just wish they didn't waste 2 picks on Corral.

Who gives a fug about the 32nd pick in the 4th round? Seriously. It's so late it's nearly nothing and easily recouped in a number of different ways....small trade back, comp pick, trade, etc.

Edited by Luciu5
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frankw Grand Master

frankw

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Posted
On 4/16/2022 at 10:29 AM, CPantherKing said:

Desmond Ridder, Aqeel Glass, and Jack Coan.

These are the QBs with the production that consistently transfer from college to NFL playoff success.

Now I understand why you're so upset😬

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

Posted
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1 hour ago, kungfoodude said:

https://www.vox.com/2014/5/8/5694518/why-the-nfls-wonderlic-aptitude-test-is-totally-worthless

There are some more studies since then but this links a few of the original ones.

 

https://www.businessinsider.com/wonderlic-test-can-predict-long-term-success-for-nfl-quarterbacks-2020-4

To quantify NFL success, we considered several measures, including — but not limited to — career passing yards, wins, and games started in the NFL. Of all the variables included in our regression models, only two were significantly and consistently associated with a quarterback's NFL success: whether he was a Heisman Trophy finalist and his Wonderlic score. 

That's concerning for Corral.

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bythenbrs Grand Master

bythenbrs

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4 hours ago, Davidson Deac II said:

Guess it depends on the definition of intelligence.  Most good quarterbacks couldn't explain string theory, but they can analyze defensive coverage patterns.  I suppose that is a type of intelligence.  

Bingo!  In the work world, you measure intelligence relative to the ability to execute the requirements of the position.  

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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2 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

https://www.businessinsider.com/wonderlic-test-can-predict-long-term-success-for-nfl-quarterbacks-2020-4

To quantify NFL success, we considered several measures, including — but not limited to — career passing yards, wins, and games started in the NFL. Of all the variables included in our regression models, only two were significantly and consistently associated with a quarterback's NFL success: whether he was a Heisman Trophy finalist and his Wonderlic score. 

That's concerning for Corral.

That is a pretty barebones article in which the paper is behind a paywall. I will see if I can get some more information about the methodology because he really doesn’t dig into what they found other than that sentence. 

Not saying they might not be onto something but I at least like to view the source material first. Especially since he literally doesn't discuss much of what they actually did or the results.

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kungfoodude Grand Master

kungfoodude

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Posted
5 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Totally wrong...

Plenty of athletic endeavors require intelligence to succeed. Heck, professional quarterback is considered by some to be the hardest position there is to play in sports because of the mental requirements.

You probably can't easily be a complete idiot and play football at a very high level but just the simple concept of intelligence isn't always easy to quantify. So, conversely, while "smarter" guys might be able to pick up concepts more quickly(in theory) designing a test probably isn't going to be as effective as just simply interviewing a guy, watching some film and/or having him break down plays and schemes. 

That's the most effective way you are gonna be able to tell if a guy is on the Luke Keuchly end of the scale or the Sam Darnold end of the scale.

And even if you excel at that, you still need to be able to put that into action effectively. 

Hence why something as football irrelevant as the Wonderlic isn't going to reveal much. Not to mention plenty of players have stated they don't take it seriously or even care about it. So given that alone, you aren't going to be able to effectively use it a tool if people aren't actually trying to take the test.

 

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