PFF ranks the 2025 starting QBs

[tukafan21]

3 hours ago, Seltzer said:

Below average? Seriously?? That is wild AF

My man we ain't watching the same game...

And I'm hard-pressed to believe you're watching the same film coaches are either if that is the take you honestly believe...

I've been to almost every home game at BOA over the past 20 years... I've seen a lot of bad QB play over the past 7 years.

Anybody that wasn't truly impressed by what Bryce did what the cast-offs he had to work with at the end of last year is delusional. His top 3 weapons were a 34 undrafted guy, a 7th round journeyman, and an UDFA rookie... seriously, what are we doing here??!!

Some of these takes are beyond outlandish...

You admitted yourself you're comparing Bryce to a guy you didn't even watch but are cherry picking stats for...

So go back to your eyeballs and make it simple... how much NFL football have you watched my man??

Bc to me and my eyeball test, Bryce blew it out of the effing water down the stretch.

What QBs are you watching playing so much better than him that you feel confident in saying "below average?"

If you watched that and came away with anything else, we ain't watching the same thing...

But beyond the eyeball test, every advanced metric in the book backs it up also... so again, what are you seeing that no one else is??

You think just anybody is going out there and dueling with Mahomes & Hurts with an almost comical inferior supporting cast and doing that?

Whatever, to each their own, but it is wild to pull for a team where so many people feel compelled to crap on your QB after he just pulled maybe the greatest in-season turn around in league history and was playing by any eyeball test (for anyone that has watched an appreciable amount of NFL football) or even the advanced metrics for that matter.

 

Do you even know what the term "below average" means?

Because I'm genuinely not sure if you do.

There are 32 QB's in the league, which means to be playing "above average" he'd have to be the 15th best QB at the league, and even then, that's in essence the "average NFL QB" still.

Even going by these rankings, which have him 20th, that by itself is the definition of "below average", and that's before you consider there are multiple QB's ranked below him in this list that I'd 100% trade him for in a heartbeat.

Again, no matter what you think the eye test tells you, he's made 28 starts and has a grand total of FOUR games over 247 yards.  Drake Maye has made 10 starts, all with a significantly worse group of pass catchers than Bryce has had, and he already has 3 games over that number himself.

I don't need to see or know anything else beyond that to determine he is a below average QB in this league so far and I don't know how anyone can honestly argue against that.  If he was a Lamar Jackson type putting up 75+ yards rushing on a consistent basis, then you can look at those passing yards differently, but that's not the case here.

Could he still improve and get to average or better?  Of course.

But you're trying to extrapolate a few throws/drives/moments from a handful of games and trying to say that makes him even an average, if not above average, QB in this league.  Which is just nonsense when the players you're comparing him to have played at that level for full seasons or their entire careers.

[tukafan21]

2 hours ago, CRA said:

I think in all honestly, the final 2 games are carrying most of the weight in a lot of Bryce talk IMO.   

During the window where he "blew it out of the water" window......were a lot of games where he was not above average.  AZ is largely one of those stat sheet games.   Where the stat sheet reflects QB play that didn't exist in the game.  That game was all Chuba.  Meh vs Dallas.  Meh vs Philly.  Meh vs Giants.  Probably average vs Tampa, Den, Saints. 

Bryce made HUGE strides vs what he was.  We should be happy.   But when you start comparing him to the rest of the league.....people I think are going too far.  His best aspect in reality.....is his scrambling.  And that's probably not a great thing give his size. 

Exactly

He's played two seasons and started 28 games.

He's well beyond the point of being able to point to 2 or 3 games and being able to say, "THAT is the QB he is and will be in the future"

Of course he can get there, but anyone trying to use just those couple of games to rank his place amongst the games QB's today and their full career's worth of playing at that level, is just asinine.

Mahomes, Allen, Lamar, Burrow, Hurts, Herbert, Daniels, Stafford, Goff, Geno, Purdy, Baker, Love, Dak, Tua, Kyler, Lawrence

That's 17 QB's right there that have played better over their careers than Bryce has played at his best.  And I'm not saying they're all studs or guys I'd want to be our QB moving forward, Tua for example I wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole, but his body of work is a million times better than Bryce's has been.

It's also not including any of the other QB's drafted in 2023/2024 other than Daniels.

So again, say you believe in Bryce, say you think he's going to prove he can and should be our QB of the future, that's all fair and totally fine.

But nobody can say he's been an above average QB in his career thus far, it's just an asinine notion.

[Seltzer]

1 hour ago, tukafan21 said:

Exactly

He's played two seasons and started 28 games.

He's well beyond the point of being able to point to 2 or 3 games and being able to say, "THAT is the QB he is and will be in the future"

Of course he can get there, but anyone trying to use just those couple of games to rank his place amongst the games QB's today and their full career's worth of playing at that level, is just asinine.

Mahomes, Allen, Lamar, Burrow, Hurts, Herbert, Daniels, Stafford, Goff, Geno, Purdy, Baker, Love, Dak, Tua, Kyler, Lawrence

That's 17 QB's right there that have played better over their careers than Bryce has played at his best.  And I'm not saying they're all studs or guys I'd want to be our QB moving forward, Tua for example I wouldn't touch with a 10 foot pole, but his body of work is a million times better than Bryce's has been.

It's also not including any of the other QB's drafted in 2023/2024 other than Daniels.

So again, say you believe in Bryce, say you think he's going to prove he can and should be our QB of the future, that's all fair and totally fine.

But nobody can say he's been an above average QB in his career thus far, it's just an asinine notion.

Dude you're all over the place.

Bryce definitely played better than average down the stretch last year. That's what I said. I dont think it's controversial, and I think it's true based both on stats and by actually watching him play.

He was the 6th rated passer by PFF during the last 8 weeks. In no world is that below average

You trying to twist this into something else is a you thing. 

Have a great night

 

[tukafan21]

35 minutes ago, Seltzer said:

Dude you're all over the place.

Bryce definitely played better than average down the stretch last year. That's what I said. I dont think it's controversial, and I think it's true based both on stats and by actually watching him play.

He was the 6th rated passer by PFF during the last 8 weeks. In no world is that below average

You trying to twist this into something else is a you thing. 

Have a great night

 

Yea, I don't really care what PPF ratings you're trying to talk about, if you think Bryce was the 6th best QB over the final 8 weeks of the season last year, then you're out of your freaking mind.  

You're probably the guy who goes to a strip club and thinks the stripper is in love with you.

The 6th best QB in the league doesn't throw for more than 251 yards only twice in that 8 week span and not even real 300 yards once, just nonsense to think otherwise, drops or WR play aside, it's just crazy talk.

Edited 5 hours ago by tukafan21

[woahfraze]

1 hour ago, tukafan21 said:

Yea, I don't really care what PPF ratings you're trying to talk about, if you think Bryce was the 6th best QB over the final 8 weeks of the season last year, then you're out of your freaking mind.  

You're probably the guy who goes to a strip club and thinks the stripper is in love with you.

The 6th best QB in the league doesn't throw for more than 251 yards only twice in that 8 week span and not even real 300 yards once, just nonsense to think otherwise, drops or WR play aside, it's just crazy talk.

Why are you so fixated on yards? Even if yards were a good judge of QB play, his low yardage totals in some of those games were partly a function of drops (looking at you Xavier Leggette…). 

I’m not advocating that Bryce was elite for the last half of last year, but the eye test certainly supported high level QB play for large stretches. He made a lot of high difficulty, put it on the money/drop in the bucket throws. He converted on 3rd and 4th down, kept drives moving, and put the team in position to win games. And it’s not on him that the defense blew it late after he led game tying drives, Leggette dropped a game winning TD, or Chuba fumbled the ball in OT. We could have finished the season close to .500 with wins against 3 playoff teams including KC and Philly during that stretch largely due to Bryce’s play. 
 

Has he sustained this level of play long enough to deserve an higher ranking? No. But for judging based in that stretch alone, he would. But whether he can perform more consistently at that level or build on that, and thus earns a higher ranking, remains to be seen. 

[csx]

4 hours ago, tukafan21 said:

Do you even know what the term "below average" means?

Because I'm genuinely not sure if you do.

There are 32 QB's in the league, which means to be playing "above average" he'd have to be the 15th best QB at the league, and even then, that's in essence the "average NFL QB" still.

Even going by these rankings, which have him 20th, that by itself is the definition of "below average", and that's before you consider there are multiple QB's ranked below him in this list that I'd 100% trade him for in a heartbeat.

Again, no matter what you think the eye test tells you, he's made 28 starts and has a grand total of FOUR games over 247 yards.  Drake Maye has made 10 starts, all with a significantly worse group of pass catchers than Bryce has had, and he already has 3 games over that number himself.

I don't need to see or know anything else beyond that to determine he is a below average QB in this league so far and I don't know how anyone can honestly argue against that.  If he was a Lamar Jackson type putting up 75+ yards rushing on a consistent basis, then you can look at those passing yards differently, but that's not the case here.

Could he still improve and get to average or better?  Of course.

But you're trying to extrapolate a few throws/drives/moments from a handful of games and trying to say that makes him even an average, if not above average, QB in this league.  Which is just nonsense when the players you're comparing him to have played at that level for full seasons or their entire careers.

Did you do the math? His final 10 games extrapolated to a season puts him at 16 in yards and 10 in tds. (One behind Mahomes)

These numbers are identical to Jayden Daniels. Is he not above average?

These stats are easy to find and its simple math

 

Edited 2 hours ago by csx

[frankw]

"Well you see if you remove this terrible game that terrible game this other terrible game and then focus on these games you'll see he's actually one of the better QB's in the league and he's actually as good as Jayden Daniels".

My god this place is delusional. I love it.

[Seltzer]

2 hours ago, woahfraze said:

Why are you so fixated on yards? Even if yards were a good judge of QB play, his low yardage totals in some of those games were partly a function of drops (looking at you Xavier Leggette…). 

I’m not advocating that Bryce was elite for the last half of last year, but the eye test certainly supported high level QB play for large stretches. He made a lot of high difficulty, put it on the money/drop in the bucket throws. He converted on 3rd and 4th down, kept drives moving, and put the team in position to win games. And it’s not on him that the defense blew it late after he led game tying drives, Leggette dropped a game winning TD, or Chuba fumbled the ball in OT. We could have finished the season close to .500 with wins against 3 playoff teams including KC and Philly during that stretch largely due to Bryce’s play. 
 

Has he sustained this level of play long enough to deserve an higher ranking? No. But for judging based in that stretch alone, he would. But whether he can perform more consistently at that level or build on that, and thus earns a higher ranking, remains to be seen. 

100%.

And these same people will claim you have an agenda.

You can't have it every way.

We had the lowest rated defense in the league last year. Statistically the worst ever. By PFF grades (for whatever that's worth- but they are readily accepted, used, and conveyed by most "reputable" sources), the defense was the worst ever.

Not only that, PFF rated our receiving corp the worst in football last season.

The absolute worst... out of 32 teams.

Which is why regardless of the lip service Canales and Morgan paid to the current guys, they knew it would be criminal not to give Bryce more help.

People fixating on team stats and not taking these things into context are stupid, plain and simple, and I'm for one thankful they're not running this team (or probably anything for that matter bc they obviously can't discern reality.

Again, going back to the eyeball test these Narrative Nancies seem to hate so much, did they not see the windows Bryce was putting balls into? Have the generally not watched much NFL?

Please, please show me the film where all these NFL QBs are making throws like this to this point Bryce was "below average" down the stretch compared to them.

Bryce made more wow throws in that 3 game stretch of the Bucs, Chiefs, and Eagles than every other QB combined in all the years since since Cam got hurt

I genuinely am baffled by people that can watch throws like that and act like it's nothing.

I guarantee you Steve Spagnola, Todd Bowles, and and Vic Fangio didn't think it was nothing after watching the little guy torch them with players those teams would be embarrassed to trot out at the skill position players.

The national media spent all year making excuses for Mahomes not having elite weapons when he had multiple 1st & 2nd round talents at the skill positions along with future HoFers in Kelce and Hopkins.

Bryce wasn't throwing for 300 yards every week with David Moore and Adam Theilen in spite of jaw dropping throws and you want to say the guy played below average.

For those people, again, we ain't watching the same sport.

And the name calling doesn't change that...

The vitriol and projection... it's off the effing charts with these people.