Coach asked about Coker!!

[SmokinwithWilly]

2 hours ago, Waldo said:

XL was always fools gold. Give me hands and hunger over upside and overdraft every day at WR. The trade just made it comical in my eyes.

Whatever, Coker saved them last year and they need to lean on him again this year. XL has shown jackall to earn a starting spot at this point. Hell, maybe it would light a fire under his butt to improve if, when really, Coker takes his reps and jumps him on the depth chart this year. 

1st thing we need to look for in a WR is can he catch the freaking ball. This is a basic fundamental we seem obsessed to ignore. We're not in position to take guys with upside over guys with fundamental football skills. Maybe once we've had a winning season or 3 in a row, we can afford those risks. 

[Proudiddy]

7 hours ago, 45catfan said:

This is why you stay away from drafting 1-year wonders in the first round. 

The fact that XL put up solid numbers as a rookie despite his drop/focus issues and the fact that he came in as a pretty raw/weak route runner is a positive though.  It shows he can do damage when he does get the ball.  This is why i still have hope for him...  A lot of people were comp'ing him to DK when we drafted him, but I think he is more like a bigger, faster Deebo.  You just have to get the ball in his hands and let him do damage...  That being said, absolutely, as a pure wide receiver, Coker without a doubt is the better receiver.  But, XL is a unique, intriguing piece.  He came in this year and has improved his route running tremendously, and from what I've read, seems to have less issue with drops, so if he is locked in with that stuff, best case scenario is both Coker and XL eat this year and then we still have Tet, Renfrow, and JHJ bringing different elements of their own.  It's really gonna be on Canales and Bryce.

I say all that to say, in summary, Coker is the better WR as of now and honestly, might remain so, but XL is a weapon in his own right - his numbers from his rookie season indicate he isn't just some washout or bust.

[Waldo]

7 hours ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

1st thing we need to look for in a WR is can he catch the freaking ball. This is a basic fundamental we seem obsessed to ignore. We're not in position to take guys with upside over guys with fundamental football skills. Maybe once we've had a winning season or 3 in a row, we can afford those risks. 

Hands on a WR? That's crazy. Next you will tell me the ability to get separation is better than size...

[Sir Big Spurr]

11 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Oh good grief. Stop it. I get it if you're a Gamecocks fan but notice how you're on an island here? There are undoubtedly plenty of Gamecocks fans here but they ain't walking the plank with you on this one.

Gamecock fan here and I hated the pick. Dude was non existent the first 4 years of college. I hope he gets it together and reaches his full potential, but if he gets left behind, so be it. 

[CRA]

I still feel the XL hate is way over the top. 

People are acting like he just put up the WR version of Bryce's rookie year. 

Did he have a high drop %? Sure.  That needs to be fixed.  But literally every rookie in his class that plays on the outside did too last year.  And XL landed in one of the worst passing Os in the NFL with questionable QB play.  It was also said by many here when we drafted him that if we stayed the BY route.....it wasn't really going be an ideal setup for XL given BY style and what XL was. 

I do think XL setups up to highlight peak huddling.  As in, all it takes is one good game this weekend and  the board will swing the other way on him.  I do think he has the highest homerun potential on this O.  

 

[Camp Fodder]

17 hours ago, 45catfan said:

This is why you stay away from drafting 1-year wonders in the first round. 

Yep Ladd and Tet would be a nice 1-2 combo

[Camp Fodder]

16 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Oh give me a break. Plenty of first round NFL WRs played with trash QBs. Look at T-Mac. I'm sure Coker had a John Elway throwing to him at fuging Holy Cross. LOL

Exactly. That’s probably why he wasn’t drafted

[kungfoodude]

9 minutes ago, CRA said:

I still feel the XL hate is way over the top. 

People are acting like he just put up the WR version of Bryce's rookie year. 

Did he have a high drop %? Sure.  That needs to be fixed.  But literally every rookie in his class that plays on the outside did too last year.  And XL landed in one of the worst passing Os in the NFL with questionable QB play.  It was also said by many here when we drafted him that if we stayed the BY route.....it wasn't really going be an ideal setup for XL given BY style and what XL was. 

I do think XL setups up to highlight peak huddling.  As in, all it takes is one good game this weekend and  the board will swing the other way on him.  I do think he has the highest homerun potential on this O.  

 

This is the same song and dance we kept hearing for TMJ and Mingo and....

Look, we are in the golden era of passing offenses. Rookie WR's are showing out more than ever before. Struggling mightily, like XL did, isn't a great sign. 

So, I don't think the criticisms are out of bounds at all. You also have to factor in the INSANE levels of PTSD almost all Panthers fans have about drafted WR's. 

I will say this, if XL doesn't show some real, genuine progress this season(barring a lot of injury issues)....I would argue the story has basically been written on him as a Panther. I know that sounds crazy but it's not common(anymore) for a WR to struggle for a couple of seasons and then figure it out. 

[Camp Fodder]

16 hours ago, CRA said:

I'm really not invested in the ST game but the broadcast crew seemed to think that was a major issue in Carolina to figure out.  Sure sounded they thought the coverage teams were really a place to earn a spot.  I think Hunter just be the PR guy at least to open up the season.  I don't like rookies opening up the year trying to figure the NFL speed/return game out.    

and sadly, that might be where Moore has an annoying edge. I do think he runs on those coverage teams.    

If we need to keep 7 WRs to cover special teams do be it. 

[Gapanthersfan]

In Mario Kart terms, Coker has the red shell in his possession. I’ve been saying and saying it, Dan and Canales are committed to winning, whomever gives the team the best chance to do so. Coker will be WR2 by game 5 if not sooner.

I 100% believe the Eagles game was THE event where Dan decided that XL could not be depended on to make ‘that catch’ unless something drastic changed in his game. 3!! Drops on the final drive. 3. 

I don’t hate the guy. I do like him, but the floor on a guy who can’t come down with the ball reliably is not worth it. I would not be surprised if he becomes trade bait at some point. 

[Navy_football]

Yeah, I like XL. If for no other reason than he's from Mullins, SC. But they have to stop over drafting raw athletes at skill positions. It's a SKILL position for a reason. Some people do it without effort or thought, but most athletes can't effectively track and hand catch a football while running full speed with defenders all around them. Natural receivers can. I think it's a skill that can be improved, but it's one of those "either you have it or you don't" things. He can get better but he'll probably never be great at it. Adjust expectations and roles or move on. Stop asking him to do stuff he can't just because you over drafted him. And you have better options like Coker. IMHO, XL would be better as a gadget player right now. A la Deebo.

[CRA]

15 minutes ago, kungfoodude said:

This is the same song and dance we kept hearing for TMJ and Mingo and....

Look, we are in the golden era of passing offenses. Rookie WR's are showing out more than ever before. Struggling mightily, like XL did, isn't a great sign. 

So, I don't think the criticisms are out of bounds at all. You also have to factor in the INSANE levels of PTSD almost all Panthers fans have about drafted WR's. 

I will say this, if XL doesn't show some real, genuine progress this season(barring a lot of injury issues)....I would argue the story has basically been written on him as a Panther. I know that sounds crazy but it's not common(anymore) for a WR to struggle for a couple of seasons and then figure it out. 

TMJ and Mingo combined for 0 zero TDs there rookie year. 

XL got into the endzone 4 times.   

And again, people are distorting his situation with what games of BY they choose to remember and erase from their memory.   XL in large part played with really bad QB play on the season.   Like league bottom QB play on the year. 

Coleman, Worthy, Mitchell etc. all had pretty comparable rookie years and were in better better spots.  Ladd plays slot (easiest life with a very good young PB QB)

Does he need to show growth? 100000%.  I just think the collective huddle is going way to hard on him and probably is way to high on Coker present day. 

[kungfoodude]

9 minutes ago, CRA said:

TMJ and Mingo combined for 0 zero TDs there rookie year. 

XL got into the endzone 4 times.   

And again, people are distorting his situation with what games of BY they choose to remember and erase from their memory.   XL in large part played with really bad QB play on the season.   Like league bottom QB play on the year. 

Coleman, Worthy, Mitchell etc. all had pretty comparable rookie years and were in better better spots.  Ladd plays slot (easiest life with a very good young PB QB)

Does he need to show growth? 100000%.  I just think the collective huddle is going way to hard on him and probably is way to high on Coker present day. 

TMJ isn't a good rookie year comparison simply because he literally got a third of the targets. Tough to even make a meaningful extrapolation in that scenario.

Mingo is a very good comp because their opportunities were very, very similar.

Mingo Rookie Year

15 G/14 GS: 85 Targets, 43 Rec., 418 Yds(9.7 Yds/Rec), 0 TD, 32.9% Success Rate, 50.9% Catch%, 155 Yds YAC, 3.6 YAC/Rec, 4 Drops, 4.7% Drop Rate

XL Rookie Year

16 G/13 GS: 84 Targets, 49 Rec., 497 Yds(10.1 Yds/Rec), 4 TD, 44% Success Rate, 58.3% Catch%, 112 YAC, 2.3 YAC/Rec, 7 Drops, 8.3% Drop Rate

Also, this was Bryce Young as a rookie(horrible) versus supposedly the far better version of Bryce Young.

So Mingo performed slightly worse in some regards and slightly better in others, with slightly worse QB play(Panthers QB Rating 2023: 75.2, Panthers QB Rating 2024: 82.0).

 

Now, I am not saying that XL is as big of a bust as Mingo but he is so far trending that directions, which is not good and shouldn't be downplayed. This is all very familiar.

[ForJimmy]

47 minutes ago, Camp Fodder said:

Yep Ladd and Tet would be a nice 1-2 combo

Ladd only had one year of good college production (2022).