Trade rumor...Curtis to Giants for Engram

[onmyown]

So the huddle has settled on trading Curtis for Engram instead of two first round picks?

[MHS831]

12 minutes ago, ncfan said:

I dont get this whole "TE isnt featured in Brady's system"

 

They do fit in it.  The ones that do point to the stats of Moss at LSU with his #s

 

Here is the deal.

LSU had:  Chase (projected top 5 this year and a once in every 5-10 years WR), Justin Jefferson (IMO is the leader for the ORY race this year), Terrace  Marshall Jr (projected high 2nd this year), Edwards Helaire.

 

 

Now imagine saying a guys system isnt "TE friendly" because in a guys one year as a OC,  where  he had

Patrick Mahomes at QB

CMC at RB

Michael Thomas, Nuke Hopkins, and Tyreek Hill at WR

 

But since Ian Thomas who also on that roster got less than 18% of the targets,  that means _____ OC isnt TE friendly.

He11 Sanjay and his whole 2TE etc etc etc. Would even call you crazy.

 

Brsdy's system is similar Sean Payton's, where they find a way to use the talent.  Ues the Saints haven't blown uo the box score with their TEs (part of that due to Michael Thomas taking 45% of the targets).  But at one point in time, they had a talent at TE, and they sure as heck knew how to use him when Jimmy Graham  when he was there

Yes, If you have a TE on the field, he is an eligible pass receiver.  if he is a pass catching threat, it changes the defensive level of aggression.  

Imagine an athletic, stud TE in our offense.  CB 1 on Robby, CB 2 on Moore, CB 3 on the slot,  SS on CMC and maybe a LB  on the TE.  So, you have a speed advantage or a size advantage.  OK, now, if you blitz, who do you send?   Most of the time, teams resort to dropping a DE and sending a LB, or stunting the DL. 

So if we have a TE that can't be covered easily with a LB, you have to play a S on him, especially in the red zone.  With Bridgewater's touch and accuracy, I see that as a huge advantage.   And against our bad middle offensive line, one less player to block is a plus.

 

[pantherclaw]

1 hour ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Based on what? N.O. has had lots of success featuring TEs. Brady wasn't the play caller at LSU and they had a lot of better weapons outside of TE. Same as us. We simply have a lot better weapons outside of our TEs. I'm not sure we can say that Brady's system doesn't feature the TE as much or if his system can simply adapt to the weapons it has available. I hope it's the latter.

Based on quotes from Brady.  

Also pay attention to the personnel groupings he prefers to use. 

[pantherclaw]

53 minutes ago, ncfan said:

I dont get this whole "TE isnt featured in Brady's system"

 

They do fit in it.  The ones that do point to the stats of Moss at LSU with his #s

 

Here is the deal.

LSU had:  Chase (projected top 5 this year and a once in every 5-10 years WR), Justin Jefferson (IMO is the leader for the ORY race this year), Terrace  Marshall Jr (projected high 2nd this year), Edwards Helaire.

 

 

Now imagine saying a guys system isnt "TE friendly" because in a guys one year as a OC,  where  he had

Patrick Mahomes at QB

CMC at RB

Michael Thomas, Nuke Hopkins, and Tyreek Hill at WR

 

But since Ian Thomas who also on that roster got less than 18% of the targets,  that means _____ OC isnt TE friendly.

He11 Sanjay and his whole 2TE etc etc etc. Would even call you crazy.

 

Brsdy's system is similar Sean Payton's, where they find a way to use the talent.  Ues the Saints haven't blown uo the box score with their TEs (part of that due to Michael Thomas taking 45% of the targets).  But at one point in time, they had a talent at TE, and they sure as heck knew how to use him when Jimmy Graham  when he was there

Never said it wasn't TE friendly.  You ran way to far with this. 

 

[Mister]

No wAy we see how important Samuel is

[ncfan]

9 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

Never said it wasn't TE friendly.  You ran way to far with this. 

 

Guess you should've worded it better.

 

Because "system doesn't feature TE as much"  99.99% of the time means "Not TE friendly system"

[LinvilleGorge]

10 minutes ago, pantherclaw said:

Based on quotes from Brady.  

Also pay attention to the personnel groupings he prefers to use. 

What quotes?

Here are the snap counts for Thomas and Manhertz by week this season:

 

Ian Thomas	44 66%	40 55%	35 69%	45 58%	42 65%	47 69%												253
Chris Manhertz	36 54%	36 49%	24 47%	59 77%	32 49%	33

 

We have a TE (or TEs) on the field a lot.

[t96]

1 hour ago, AU-panther said:

You are comparing DJ/Robby/Curtis to DJ/Robby/?

You have to factor in the TEs, better way to look at it would be:

DJ/Robby/Curtis/Thomas

or 

DJ/Robby/Roberts/Engram

 

Personally I like Curtis a lot, and I think he could actually be really productive if used properly, but as a WR3 how much are you really looking to replace?

He is on pace for what?  about 50 catches? What if we had a better TE, he might get 30 catches in a season?  Not really hard to replace that.

I actually thought there was a chance we would draft a WR this year for this very reason, most teams don't really have the luxury of paying 3 WRs, you almost always need to have one on a rookie deal.

Why would you factor in TEs? Upgrading to Engram from Thomas has no impact on our WR group. TEs aren't used in Brady's offense as pass catchers nearly as much as WR. Samuel has started every game except last game he was out and has played nearly 70% of snaps, not a whole lot less than Robby. Brady runs 3 WR sets so much that pass catching TE isn't really that important. #3 WR is definitely more important in his offense. Samuel shouldn't demand a whole lot, probably a shorter 1-2 year deal for pretty low money. What team would pay him much in FA or sign him long term? I can't see it. We have Moore on a rookie deal right now for 3 years and Robby's deal is an absolute bargain this year and next year. We should try to keep Samuel. If another team does decide to open their wallet for him for some reason, then fine let him go. But that seems pretty unlikely.

[pantherclaw]

23 minutes ago, ncfan said:

Guess you should've worded it better.

 

Because "system doesn't feature TE as much"  99.99% of the time means "Not TE friendly system"

I worded it just fine. 

You're the one that made it into something it isn't.

[pantherclaw]

23 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

What quotes?

Here are the snap counts for Thomas and Manhertz by week this season:

 

Ian Thomas	44 66%	40 55%	35 69%	45 58%	42 65%	47 69%												253
Chris Manhertz	36 54%	36 49%	24 47%	59 77%	32 49%	33

 

We have a TE (or TEs) on the field a lot.

Yes, we do.  Use them to block and for outlets. 

Less down the seems. 

[YoungPanthers89]

My cousin said we're trading for Mahomes

[SOJA]

This TE class is loaded, Curtis is so undervalued by this board it hurts. Keep Curtis, sign him to a team friendly deal and draft a TE next year 

[tijo]

Joe Brady doesn't use TEs. Why would we trade a weapon like Samuel for someone we won't use, or will be hurt?

He's one DJ Moore ankle away from being a key piece for us. Engram won't be a factor for us because of our offense. 

[TheCasillas]

1 minute ago, SOJA said:

This TE class is loaded, Curtis is so undervalued by this board it hurts. Keep Curtis, sign him to a team friendly deal and draft a TE next year 

why would he sign a team friendly deal? We have 1 and 2 on the roster, he could go somewhere else (in his head) and be a #1