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Top 5 things to watch against Buffalo

Jeremy Igo

By Jeremy Igo,
in Carolina Panthers

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gtanaka Explorer

gtanaka

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Posted

He seems the whipping boy for every offensive problem while the players like Cam get a pass because people recognize he didn't have a great supporting cast. What is funnier still is that everyone commends Cam for all his accomplishments without mentioning that Shuls took him from a guy who knew very little and has improved him every year.

I agree cam has improved every year but hes gone down statistically just about every year. Some of that has to come from the OC. With Chud or offense was top 5 Cam's rookie year.

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pantherclaw Grand Master

pantherclaw

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If it were only that black and white. 

Execution falls under preparedness. 

Preparedness is a joint effort between coaches and players. 

If you don't think an amazing coach can increase the quality of execution of his players, you haven't watched much football. 

Thank you for pointing out what I've known for most of.my life.  

Coaching matters. I never said it doesn't.  I am also confident that if Gettleman felt any of our coaches weren't preparing and coaching up our players enough, he'd do more than suggest a change.

You know as well as I do, that when there is poor execution,  the mass response is directed to the OC.  He can't  hold the players hands, and make them execute better when it's game day.  

Let me be clear, that Shula isn't a favorite of mine.  I just know he also gets more blame than he deserves, and you are one of the ring leaders of that wagon.

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UpstatePanther Newbie

UpstatePanther

Posted
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He seems the whipping boy for every offensive problem while the players like Cam get a pass because people recognize he didn't have a great supporting cast. What is funnier still is that everyone commends Cam for all his accomplishments without mentioning that Shuls took him from a guy who knew very little and has improved him every year.

i saw this in another thread and thought you might want to take it into consideration. Jeremy is talking about the Saints, but the same application can be made for Mike Shula.

It is tricky. I assume zero game planning went on with the Saints. Especially on teams lacking in physical talent such as the Saints defense, game planning is everything. Superior coaching can make up for so many flaws. (not saying the Saints have superior defensive coaching, obviously they do not, just an example)

 

you see, the Panthers do have physical talent on offense. a hell of alot of it. yes, the OL is not perfect. and yes, execution can be a problem. but that doesnt mean that Shula isnt still a problem. it doesnt even mean that Shula isnt the main problem. you see, if the man was worth his salt as a coach, he would be able to coach the execution issues out of his players and scheme around poor offensive line play. we have yet to see him do that after a few seasons on the job.

unless we are all proven wrong and our offense is no-where near as talented as we all think it is, Shula is the sole target for blame this season if our offense sputters. His head needs to be the one to roll if we fail to move the ball this year. blame execution all you want, but "superior coaching can make up for so many flaws"

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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Look p55, you're an intelligent, and informed poster here.

I've already stated that some of the Shula hate is unwarranted. But you're not going to be able to sit there, and act as if he is literally public enemy #1 in our fan base, while at the same time pretending like literally every fan has been behind our quarterback 100% all this time. It just isn't true.

Cam Newton is our franchise quarterback. Now, you are welcome to join the rest of us whenever you are ready.

Cam gets his unfair amount of criticism as well but you have to admit that there are a lot more folks who give Cam a pass then give Shula one.  Honestly, I hate having to defend the guy all the time given I dont think he is that great, but I feel that he gets a lot of unfair criticism stemming back from what happened a decade ago.  

As for Newton you obviously dont remember that I was one of the first posters to advocate drafting him and defended him from the unfair criticism he received.  I have his jersey and proudly wear it to many games.  Truth is it took many of you time to join me.  The same with Kuechly and this year with Funchess.  I have been on the bandwagon of these guys from day 1.

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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i saw this in another thread and thought you might want to take it into consideration. Jeremy is talking about the Saints, but the same application can be made for Mike Shula.

you see, the Panthers do have physical talent on offense. a hell of alot of it. yes, the OL is not perfect. and yes, execution can be a problem. but that doesnt mean that Shula isnt still a problem. it doesnt even mean that Shula isnt the main problem. you see, if the man was worth his salt as a coach, he would be able to coach the execution issues out of his players and scheme around poor offensive line play. we have yet to see him do that after a few seasons on the job.

unless we are all proven wrong and our offense is no-where near as talented as we all think it is, Shula is the sole target for blame this season if our offense sputters. His head needs to be the one to roll if we fail to move the ball this year. blame execution all you want, but "superior coaching can make up for so many flaws"

And how long have we had the physical talent?  The general consensus across the league last year was that we had the poorest offensive talent in the league.  Frankly this year there are those who still who question our offensive talent.  Many of the guys we are expecting to be major contributors this year are rookies or very young.

 

Given what he has had to work with, he has done a very good job in my opinion.  You can be the best chef in the world but if you get handed a pile of crap it is probably still going to taste like crap.

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panthers55 Grand Master

panthers55

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I agree cam has improved every year but hes gone down statistically just about every year. Some of that has to come from the OC. With Chud or offense was top 5 Cam's rookie year.

Stats dont always equate to wins.  Many of Chud's yards and points where scored when we were behind and in losing efforts with clearly the best talent we have had on offense in the past 4 years.  He was more out for himself and the numbers than he was for the team and for wins.

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SmokinwithWilly Grand Master

SmokinwithWilly

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Personally, what frustrates me the most about Shula is when it seems he gives up if there is more than 3 yards left on 3rd down. 3rd and 14, delayed handout up the the gut, bubble screen, quick slant for 4. Hell, we might as well punt on 3rd down. At least that's how it feels to me. I have very little confidence in his ability to sustain a drive. Maybe that's fair, maybe not, but damn it sure feels that way too often for my liking.

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Rags Mentor

Rags

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Poor creativity - More creative than all but one previous Panther OC (Chud). I don't want Chud back, thanks anyways.

Wow this is stupid.

Yes, Shula is much better than our old OCs. But what does that say about our organization?

Choosing between Shula and someone like Jeff Davidson is like choosing between having the flu and a terminal illness. You can survive with one but you'd much rather not have it.

Yes, some of it falls on the players. But year in and year out Shulas playcalling is mind bogglingly bad. Shulas inability to play call to our strengths or mask our weaknesses has been seen and criticized. He has improved as an OC. A lot. But he's still below average.

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