Greg Cosell talks QBs (you'll have to hit the link & listen to the podcast)

[top dawg]

I wish that I could embed the radio podcast, but I can't. That being said, Greg Cosell is always worth a listen. I think he talks the jargon of evaluators (and mirrors some of the points @Vergesays). FWIW, I'll give you an idea (in my words). Traits are not everything as to what constitutes a QB who will make the transition from college to the pros successfully, but they are highly important. "Secondary reaction ability" is nearly a necessity in today's franchise QB.

Here are some admittedly selective "cliff notes". [Basically, listen to the interview!]

 

Lawrence should develop into a quality NFL QB. Joe Burrow is obviously not as strong, but was slightly more advanced coming out last year than Lawrence this year. 

Zach Wilson is clear number 2. Has great pocket efficiency and is a good distributor. Good feel for the passing game. Has that legit "playmaking movement dimension"

Justin Fields "scares me a little bit" in the words of a QB coach he talked with. Issues with "recognition, with vision and elimination and isolation from the pocket...He needs things to be clean and defined to be consistently successful..."

Lance has a "...strong live arm, excellent athleticism. There's a "twitch and explosiveness" to his game passing and running. "He's got a lot of traits!"

Mac Jones was a good executioner and distributor in his offense. He's a "bad athlete" and has "almost no ability to play outside structure whatsoever..."

Kyle Trask "is a backup!" 

 

Start at 9:08

https://www.radio.com/podcasts/ross-tucker-football-podcast-nfl-podcast-20962/greg-cosell-top-6-college-quarterbacks-357315296

 

Edited February 24, 2021 by top dawg

[MHS831]

That sounds about right.  Here is what I heard:

1, Trevor

2 Wilson

3. Lance

4 Fields  (do not want)

x that's it.

Edited February 24, 2021 by MHS831

[top dawg]

Yeah, I'm thinking let someone else reach for the guys who can't play off script. 

[Mage]

The more I watch Justin Fields, the more I like him.  Oddly enough... he reminds me a lot of Deshaun Watson coming out of Clemson.  I'd say the same concerns I have about Fields, I had about Watson, in that the biggest thing for them was just learning how to go through progressions better and some of the technical aspects of the position.  Fields' footwork is a little inconsistent too, don't remember Watson's much in college but Fields has a tendency of not keeping his footwork precise as he goes through the throw.

However, he's a playmaker and he's aggressive.  My two favorite traits about him.  While he's similar to Watson in the sense that he can let pressure get to him too much and how he deals with pressure will need to be improved (poor pocket awareness), he does a very good job for the most part looking downfield and keeping the pass play alive with his legs before deciding to take off and run.  

I still like Wilson more.  Slightly worse playmaker but a better passer.  But I'd love if we ended up with either of the 2 after a trade-up.  

[Aussie Tank]

12 minutes ago, Mage said:

The more I watch Justin Fields, the more I like him.  Oddly enough... he reminds me a lot of Deshaun Watson coming out of Clemson.  I'd say the same concerns I have about Fields, I had about Watson, in that the biggest thing for them was just learning how to go through progressions better and some of the technical aspects of the position.  Fields' footwork is a little inconsistent too, don't remember Watson's much in college but Fields has a tendency of not keeping his footwork precise as he goes through the throw.

However, he's a playmaker and he's aggressive.  My two favorite traits about him.  While he's similar to Watson in the sense that he can let pressure get to him too much and how he deals with pressure will need to be improved (poor pocket awareness), he does a very good job for the most part looking downfield and keeping the pass play alive with his legs before deciding to take off and run.  

I still like Wilson more.  Slightly worse playmaker but a better passer.  But I'd love if we ended up with either of the 2 after a trade-up.  

This pre draft souring is the exact same as what happened to Watson as well 

[TheSpecialJuan]

Great post, thanks 

[top dawg]

11 minutes ago, Mage said:

The more I watch Justin Fields, the more I like him.  Oddly enough... he reminds me a lot of Deshaun Watson coming out of Clemson.  I'd say the same concerns I have about Fields, I had about Watson, in that the biggest thing for them was just learning how to go through progressions better and some of the technical aspects of the position.  Fields' footwork is a little inconsistent too, don't remember Watson's much in college but Fields has a tendency of not keeping his footwork precise as he goes through the throw.

However, he's a playmaker and he's aggressive.  My two favorite traits about him.  While he's similar to Watson in the sense that he can let pressure get to him too much and how he deals with pressure will need to be improved (poor pocket awareness), he does a very good job for the most part looking downfield and keeping the pass play alive with his legs before deciding to take off and run.  

I still like Wilson more.  Slightly worse playmaker but a better passer.  But I'd love if we ended up with either of the 2 after a trade-up.  

Fields is simply going to have to process things faster and be more decisive, especially as the pocket begins to break down. Other than just being the best athlete with the strongest arm in this class, the ability to be decisive while not making mistakes is one of the reasons that I like Lance more than Fields. 

[GoobyPls]

Seems like everyone has Wilson as the number 2, I was hoping the jets don’t take him so we could, but it looks like a forgone conclusion. 
 

Fields remind me of Dak with a stronger arm.

[Mr. Scot]

There was a comment about Fields in the draft forum attributed to a scout, something to the effect of they examined every play of his season and he only very rarely ever looked off his first read.

Valid? No idea, but to be fair that's the way a lot of college systems are set up these days.

[Mr. Scot]

29 minutes ago, GoobyPls said:

Seems like everyone has Wilson as the number 2, I was hoping the jets don’t take him so we could, but it looks like a forgone conclusion.

Wilson's skill set is phenomenal.

His frame and physical makeup scare the hell out of me.

[07579394]

Wow,it sounds like that Lance is another Josh Allen

[top dawg]

3 hours ago, 07579394 said:

Wow,it sounds like that Lance is another Josh Allen

He will need teaching, experience and a little time to develop, much like Allen. He's solidly built, but just a tad smaller. He has a real cannon like Allen. It's an interesting--if not apt--comparison. 

 

I don't know who it was (probably several), but someone was basically saing, "I don't know what people see in Lance", or something of that nature. Well, like Cosell, Bucky Brooks and others, they see the traits of a professional QB that look to translate well to the NFL. Evaluating a college player (and maybe a QB even more) is about projection. Do you see traits in this guy that will help him succeed in the NFL, notwithstanding what he did in the NCAA? I know that's kind of a complex concept that seems counterintuitive on the surface, but it's basically what Cosell was referring to when he said, "You have to evaluate a quarterback in a vacuum. You have to isolate his traits..." [Listen at 19:09]

Bucky Brooks said that Lance can fit any system. He basically said that he can be molded into whatever you want because he has all the traits and can make any throw.

[raleigh-panther]

7 hours ago, top dawg said:

I wish that I could embed the radio podcast, but I can't. That being said, Greg Cosell is always worth a listen. I think he talks the jargon of evaluators (and mirrors some of the points @Vergesays). FWIW, I'll give you an idea (in my words). Traits are not everything as to what constitutes a QB who will make the transition from college to the pros successfully, but they are highly important. "Secondary reaction ability" is nearly a necessity in today's franchise QB.

Here are some admittedly selective "cliff notes". [Basically, listen to the interview!]

 

Lawrence should develop into a quality NFL QB. Joe Burrow is obviously not as strong, but was slightly more advanced coming out last year than Lawrence this year. 

Zach Wilson is clear number 2. Has great pocket efficiency and is a good distributor. Good feel for the passing game. Has that legit "playmaking movement dimension"

Justin Fields "scares me a little bit" in the words of a QB coach he talked with. Issues with "recognition, with vision and elimination and isolation from the pocket...He needs things to be clean and defined to be consistently successful..."

Lance has a "...strong live arm, excellent athleticism. There's a "twitch and explosiveness" to his game passing and running. "He's got a lot of traits!"

Mac Jones was a good executioner and distributor in his offense. He's a "bad athlete" and has "almost no ability to play outside structure whatsoever..."

Kyle Trask "is a backup!" 

 

Start at 9:08

https://www.radio.com/podcasts/ross-tucker-football-podcast-nfl-podcast-20962/greg-cosell-top-6-college-quarterbacks-357315296

 

This was interesting 

I hate to say it but if the rumors of the Panthers  being love with Fields being true, that would be very concerning   Not surprising  just concerning given their previous love of Bridgewater 

i like Greg but before I see gospel is probably have to listen to what he said about the mahomes draft class 

or maybe that’s way they are trying to trade desperately for Watson as they don’t like this year and next years crop of QBs 

 

[top dawg]

16 minutes ago, raleigh-panther said:

This was interesting 

I hate to say it but if the rumors of the Panthers  being love with Fields being true, that would be very concerning   Not surprising  just concerning given their previous love of Bridgewater 

i like Greg but before I see gospel is probably have to listen to what he said about the mahomes draft class 

or maybe that’s way they are trying to trade desperately for Watson as they don’t like this year and next years crop of QBs 

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/news/greg-cosells-nfl-draft-breakdown-accomplished-deshaun-watson-has-areas-to-work-on-164552341.html?pt=4

 

I'm not saying his mouth is the gospel, but he knows what he's looking at and what to look for in film. I believe that he generally won't make a definitive statement as to a potential player's efficacy in the NFL because so much has to do with where they land and a team's system and expectations, but Cosell seems spot-on with his film breakdown (and that's why he's one of my favorites).