Burns vs Bosa

[WhoKnows]

6 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Do the per game math and the gap is pretty wide.

Plus he left off QB hits which is dramatically different. Burns in more games has 77 and Bosa has 106 in less. That’s getting to the QB way more consistently. There also is no stat for run defense.

Saying Bosa is better is not a slight on Burns. The biggest difference IMHO is that in the limited times where I’ve watched Bosa, I’ve seen him control a game with pressure and run stops. I’m still waiting to see that from Burns. Heck, in 2015, I remember seeing Short take over games where he just blew up the OL and caused issues even without getting stats. That’s what we need from Burns at the price we are going to pay. 

[Wundrbread33]

I don’t know enough about the 49ers roster, but how would you grade Bosa’s defensive line mates compared to what Burns has had?

[ThaGamezOva]

21 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

lol

 

you seriously must never watch other teams if you think that

Exactly 

[Smithers]

6 minutes ago, Wundrbread33 said:

I don’t know enough about the 49ers roster, but how would you grade Bosa’s defensive line mates compared to what Burns has had?

Bosa hasn’t had much help, similar to Burns.  That’s one of the big reasons they went after Hargrave 

[KSpan]

It's about more than just sacks and tackles though - total impact comes into play. When was the last time that Burns made a citical play at a critical time? A recent example from Bosa:

"Bosa registered pressures on three straight dropbacks inside the 49ers' own five-yard line, capped off with this sack of Andy Dalton on 4th & goal that effectively iced this game for the 49ers and secured their only shutout of the season. Bosa uses a scissor swipe to beat the left tackle and win the edge, bringing down Dalton and any hopes the Saints had of pulling off a miraculous comeback in this game"

https://www.ninersnation.com/2023/1/10/23547791/49ers-bosa-2022-sacks

I just don't recall seeing Burns make splash plays at game-turning moments.

[NAS]

22 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Do the per game math and the gap is pretty wide.

Sacks is the only big gap which I acknowledged but you also have to consider Bosa’s job is easier on the 49er defense that’s always been loaded with talent.

I would like to see a statistic on pressures per game if anyone has it. Sack’s aren’t everything.

Also there was this narrative that he is somehow weak against the run lol

Edited September 6, 2023 by NAS

[WhoKnows]

8 minutes ago, carpanfan96 said:

Burns has played 3019 snaps vs Bosa at 2432 snaps. That equates to a sack every .012 for Burns vs  .017 snaps for Bosa  

Math is off a little here. The numbers are close but it’s 0.0177 sacks per snap for Bosa and 0.0125 sacks per snap for Burns. The higher number is better and Bosa is better by 42%

A better way to look at it is number of snaps per sack like they do for HR hitters in ABs per HR. I think that’s what you were trying to say but used the opposite calculation. In this case the lower the number the better. Bosa is 1 sack per 56.5 snaps and Burns is 1 sack per 79.4 snaps.

[NAS]

1 minute ago, WhoKnows said:

Math is off a little here. The numbers are close but it’s 0.0177 sacks per snap for Bosa and 0.0125 sacks per snap for Burns. The higher number is better and Bosa is better by 42%

A better way to look at it is number of snaps per sack like they do for HR hitters in ABs per HR. I think that’s what you were trying to say but used the opposite calculation. In this case the lower the number the better. Bosa is 1 sack per 56.5 snaps and Burns is 1 sack per 79.4 snaps.

So what? How many times was Burns too explosive even for himself and would get to the QB but not get the sack because he would overshoot him.

Burns isn’t going to get Bosa money but to act like he shouldn’t sniff 28-30 is just nonsense.

I remembered when fans complained about Peppers not having more sacks then Jarred Allen. This feels kind of like us not appreciating what we have until we lose it. 

[carpanfan96]

7 minutes ago, NAS said:

Sacks is the only big gap which I acknowledged but you also have to consider Bosa’s job is easier on the 49er defense that’s always been loaded with talent.

I would like to see a statistic on pressures per game if anyone has it. Sack’s aren’t everything.

Also there was this narrative that he is somehow weak against the run lol

68 on 951 snaps vs 90 on 748 snaps for last season. 

[LinvilleGorge]

8 minutes ago, NAS said:

Sacks is the only big gap which I acknowledged but you also have to consider Bosa’s job is easier on the 49er defense that’s always been loaded with talent.

I would like to see a statistic on pressures per game if anyone has it. Sack’s aren’t everything.

Also there was this narrative that he is somehow weak against the run lol

Bosa has nearly the same number of solo tackles as Burns in nearly a full season less games.

TBH, Burns is weak against the run when you run at him. He's an excellent pursuit defender which is probably where most of his tackle numbers are coming from.

[WhoKnows]

1 minute ago, NAS said:

Sacks is the only gap which I acknowledged but you also have to consider Bosa’s job is easier on the 49er defense that’s always been loaded with talent.

I would like to see a statistic on pressures per game if anyone has it. Sack’s aren’t everything.

TFLs and QB hits were also bigger gaps when you do it per game. Bosa had 2.1 QB hits and 1.1 TFLs per game and Burns had 1.2 QB hits and 0.67 TFLs per game.

Bosa was also one of the top tier guys against the run and missed 0 run tackles in 2022. https://www.49ers.com/news/nick-bosa-lands-top-tier-pff-top-32-edge-rusher-2023-ota-training-camp#:~:text=Here's what PFF writer Trevor,as a run defender)."

Again, not a slight to Burns saying the DPOY last year was better than him. Some people in here get sensitive when our guys are critiqued but if Burns is getting $30M a year from us he needs to at a minimum be that guy who takes over games for us and is in the tier of elite guys. 

[mrcompletely11]

4 minutes ago, NAS said:

I remembered when fans complained about Peppers not having more sacks then Jarred Allen. This feels kind of like us not appreciating what we have until we lose it. 

revisionist history is one cheap ass argument

[WhoKnows]

4 minutes ago, NAS said:

So what? How many times was Burns too explosive even for himself and would get to the QB but not get the sack because he would overshoot him.

Burns isn’t going to get Bosa money but to act like he shouldn’t sniff 28-30 is just nonsense.

I remembered when fans complained about Peppers not having more sacks then Jarred Allen. This feels kind of like us not appreciating what we have until we lose it. 

Relax, saying the DPOY was better than Burns is a fact. I’m sure he will get that money. That’s our fault for turning down that huge trade and waiting until a monster deal was signed.

Also, lol at disrespecting Jared Allen. We got him at the end of his career. Allen abused Jordan Gross in one game. He had 7 straight years with at least 11.5 sacks. Honestly, Allen coupe have made the HOF over Ware. They had almost identical totals over 12 seasons. Peppers was also in the same area stats wise but played 5 more years than Ware and Allen. Allen and Ware had more sacks per year but all three were really good. I’d say Allen and Peppers (and Ware) are closer than Burns and Bosa.

[CRA]

45 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Do the per game math and the gap is pretty wide.

This. 

And being a liability in the run game also doesn’t make the chart 

the gap between the two isn’t small.  And the difference in guaranteed money shouldn’t be small either