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The franchise guy Carolina Panthers Deep Dive


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11 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

stats and logical fallacies are fun to make up

what stats? i said “i’d say”. even during Cams MVP season you had several posters here say they don’t trust him to keep it going or that his showboating was gonna doom him in the playoffs. There are just a lot of negative Panthers fans in existence

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23 minutes ago, CRA said:

Sanders played last season with his personal stat line in mind.  And did his OL no favors even if you want to call them trash.    And I think you can legitimately question his DNA as a leader present day. 

Penix and Nix both played big boy college football....and won.  Sanders won 4 games at Colorado and is on 6 game losing stretch. 

LOL......Colorado was a team that won 1 WHOLE game the year prior and brought in a new coach with a bunch of transfers the next year. Anybody could clearly see they overachieved last year just winning 4 games, the expectations were just mixed in with the Deion hype. That team wasnt ready to compete for real. Also that offensive line was one of the worst in college easily so what the hell are you talking about shaduer did them no favors? Please spare me with all this....that team was a work in progress and Deion said that himself. The other QBs already had complete teams built around them to compete....this is clear context.

Edited by CPF4LIFE
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13 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Go back and read. I said I'm not completely writing him off. But yeah, at this point I'd honestly be borderline shocked if he works out. 

You're the one who acted like a condescending douche while failing at reading comprehension. Don't get butthurt about it. Ice up son.

“99% sure” isn’t completely writing him off? splitting hairs don’t you think? sounds more like you’re being passive aggressive, and keeping that one little percent around just in case, so you don’t have to say you were wrong. speaking of icing up, son…

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

how’s that? amidoinitrite?

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2 minutes ago, Mother Grabber said:

“99% sure” isn’t completely writing him off? splitting hairs don’t you think? sounds more like you’re being passive aggressive, and keeping that one little percent around just in case, so you don’t have to say you were wrong. speaking of icing up, son…

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

how’s that? amidoinitrite?

I don't know if you're being intentionally dense or if it just comes naturally but wow. 

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9 minutes ago, CPF4LIFE said:

LOL......Colorado was a team that won 1 WHOLE game the year prior and brought in a new coach with a bunch of transfers the next year. Anybody could clearly see they overachieved last year just winning 4 games, the expectations were just mixed in with the Deion hype. That team wasnt ready to compete for real. Also that offensive line was one of the worst in college easily so what the hell are you talking about shaduer did them no favors? Please spare me with all this....that team was a work in progress and Deion said that himself. The other QBs already had complete teams built around them to compete....this is clear context.

Shadeur probably struggled pre and post snap which made his OL look worse. 

Edited by ECHornet
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17 minutes ago, CPF4LIFE said:

Colorado was a team that won 1 WHOLE game the year prior and brought in a new coach with a bunch of transfers the next year. Anybody could clearly see they overachieved last year just winning 4 games, the expectations were just mixed in with the Deion hype. That team wasnt ready to compete for real clear. Also that offensive line was one of the worst in college easily so what the hell are you talking about shaduer did them no favors? Please spare me with all this....that team was a work in progress and Deion said that himself. The other guys already had complete teams built around them.

and they won just a whole 4 games this year.  with a completely overhauled roster in a pay to play world......with what some are pimping as a game changing QB.   

they didn't overachieve. 

I think they are poorly coached.   I think they have poor leadership....and both showed down the stretch. 

Deion is a great marketer.  Always has been. 

What am I talking about with the QB who did them no favors?  He plays with his completion % and TD/INT ratio in mind.  He avoids throws and opts for completions and he flat out opts to take sacks.  Hard to debate that.  All those sacks aren't on the OL.   They weren't great.  Call them bad.  But plenty of big name QBs saw more pressure or comparable pressure...... and took less sacks. 

But team Sanders is about team Sanders and Shaduer going into the NFL.   Not Colorado.   

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39 minutes ago, Coheed said:

Lmao just because someone disagrees with you doesn’t mean theres a personal vendetta bro

Lol..its not about you disagreeing with me. Im just stating all those things you said will be irrelevant in the  draft process especially for teams that really need a QB. Cam had baggage, Caleb williams had baggage...once teams sit these guys down and get to know them they will formulate their own opinions as long as the production is there on the field Somebody will draft him if they really need a QB. Therefore your personal opinion of how good a teammate he is and how he flaunts himself doesnt matter. lol

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2 minutes ago, CRA said:

and they won just a whole 4 games this year.  with a completely overhauled roster in a pay to play world......with what some are pimping as a game changing QB.   

they didn't overachieve. 

I think they are poorly coached.   I think they have poor leadership....and both showed down the stretch. 

Deion is a great marketer.  Always has been. 

What am I talking about with the QB who did them no favors?  He plays with his completion % and TD/INT ration in mind.  Hard to debate that.  All those sacks aren't on the OL.   They weren't great.  But team Sanders is about team Sanders and Shaduer going into the NFL.   Not Colorado.   

And let me guess, you talked to all his teammates coaches and found this out from them? Lol...like i just told the other guy that sounds like a real personal opinion of dislike.  The same dislike that team got all year from everybody else. Not gonna have nothing to do with a NFL team drafting shaduer long as he plays well.

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17 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

I don't know if you're being intentionally dense or if it just comes naturally but wow. 

thinking 99% and 100% are essentially the same thing is being dense?

LOL

i will admit i did make a big mistake by actually reading comments in a thread again. i’ll go back to just watching camp videos and twatter updates, and stay away from the anti-bryce venom that spews over every thread.

Edited by Mother Grabber
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48 minutes ago, CPF4LIFE said:

And let me guess, you talked to all his teammates coaches and found this out from them? Lol...like i just told the other guy that sounds like a real personal opinion of dislike.  The same dislike that team got all year from everybody else. Not gonna have nothing to do with a NFL team drafting shaduer long as he plays well.

 I mean, I was on record as team Sanders at the start of his college football venture.   

But Sanders has basically pulled the curtain back on himself IMO.    Deion is the only one influencing me.  

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17 minutes ago, Mother Grabber said:

thinking 99% and 100% are essentially the same thing is being dense?

LOL

i will admit i did make a big mistake by actually reading comments in a thread again. i’ll go back to just watching camp videos and twatter updates, and stay away from the anti-bryce venom that spews over every thread.

Yes, it is because they're not. One is an absolute. One isn't. The logic here isn't very complex. Nobody cares if you leave. Do or don't. The threats as if anyone cares is just pathetic.

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15 minutes ago, CPF4LIFE said:

Lol..it’s not about you disagreeing with me. Im just stating all those things you said will be irrelevant in the  draft process especially for teams that really need a QB. Cam had baggage, Caleb williams had baggage...once teams sit these guys down and get to know them they will formulate their own opinions as long as the production is there on the field Somebody will draft him if they really need a QB. Therefore your personal opinion of how good a teammate he is and how he flaunts himself doesnt matter. lol

Teams won’t care about what former and current team mates have to say about him?  That’s news to me. 
 

yeah Cam had baggage but dude was always ride or die for the team and also had generational talent, which Sanders hasn’t shown

 

caleb hasn’t even taken a snap yet so in your words that’s “irrelevant”. 

 

I’d be more willing to give sanders a pass/benefit of the doubt if he showed that he was by far *that* dude - but he hasn’t, and the fact that he acts like he has is a huge red flag for me.  

 

 

 

 

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He's routinely a great watch.  Good content. 

  • I like his optimism on Chubba in our scheme, allows us to bring in Brooks at an optimal pace relative to his recovery (who we got obviously to be our new guy, could become the focal point of this offense)
  • The two news OGs will have no issue playing our offense coming from familiar schemes, one in Hunt being league top, is going to be huge for our running game more than anything.  I also liked him maintaining some optimism with Icky.  
  • Seeing his page and commentary on our defense really puts in perspective how much turnover we have.  It should feel like a much different team (hopefully better) especially that front-7.  Jewell is going to be better than people expect, he was super unheralded for Denver and is just a smart closer who played against the Chiefs routinely well.    
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  • Topics

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    • Just because all draft picks are a gamble doesn't mean you don't have a better chance at hitting on a better player the higher you're drafting. It would literally be like someone saying, I'll give you 1 or 2 free spins on a slot machine, and you say you'll take the 1 because you're not likely to win anything anyways with 1 or 2, so why bother? The Cowboys desperately wanted T-Mac, but because they were 4 picks behind us, they weren't able to get him.  If you told Cowboys fans that had they lost 2 more games last year in a lost season, that it would get them the player they wanted so badly, would they in retrospect go back and lose those games to get their guy? 95% of them would take that trade off in a heartbeat, and the others who wouldn't are the fans who would rather enjoy an extra win or two in a poo season to then set themselves up to be better for the next decade. I also think the fans who argue against this thinking, get too caught up in the "well that means you're going to be rooting against us late in the season even if we still have a shot at the playoffs." Which isn't true, it's saying if you're telling me right now we'd make the playoffs but lose in the first round, that I'd rather end up 8-9 or 9-8 and just miss the playoffs because in our opinion, the benefits that come along with that outweigh the benefit of the players getting 1 game of playoff experience.
    • In relation to tanking. I think you can count on one hand the number of people here who actually want us to lose football games. When accounting for it across the fanbase it amounts to maybe 2% of the entire Panthers fanbase. But you engage with some internet trolls and think haters are coming out of the woodwork and hey look at that it's all a conspiracy that leads to Bryce Young haters. Do you hear yourself sir? If it sounds ridiculous that's because it is. I mean at this point do you see Bryce haters in your dreams? As far as the culture of this franchise goes we seem to be doing better in that department via what we are building right now and with the people we have in place. But we also shouldn't just make assumptions just yet either. The rubber still needs to meet the road. And going back to previous seasons I think we can acknowledge although tanking obviously isn't a thing there were some times where we thought our culture was improving but really it wasn't. Yes I'm looking directly at some of those wins under Wilks. If the culture had truly changed we would not have lost to the Steelers who have been mediocre for years at home the way we did and they were starting Mitch Trubisky ffs. We did not change our culture for the better and we won games that ultimately meant nothing. It was just a brief mirage. We've done this for years now. The harsh truth of the matter is the Panthers have not had a winning season or been to the playoffs in going on 8 years but in those years they've been trying to convince themselves they aren't poo but in the process all they've done throughout most of that time period is squander better draft position and we were still the worst team in the league for our troubles. At the end of the day we should be able to just be adults and reconcile with that. And no that isn't being "pro tank" or any other boogeyman term it's simply recognizing reality.
    • He's an asset in a game manager role. But as soon as you have to ask him to go out there and try to make plays and not just take what the defense is giving him... well, Darnolding happens.
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