panthers offense 30 of 32 in yards per play

[fanpanther]

15 minutes ago, CRA said:

It's the most important and impactful position and it's not close.  And on top of being bad, Young makes the O boring.  PJ Walker bad would lead to more convos.  Because the play would be more entertaining and there would be zero concern the horrific nature of the QB spot could extend beyond this year (and that is why the convo stays on Bryce because the threat remains).

i agree with this part of the young issue is the o is sooo boring with him at qb.  panthers have been bad forever but its hit close to clausen level of boringness with young.  

[amcoolio]

22 minutes ago, CRA said:

It's the most important and impactful position and it's not close.  And on top of being bad, Young makes the O boring.  PJ Walker bad would lead to more convos.  Because the play would be more entertaining and there would be zero concern the horrific nature of the QB spot could extend beyond this year (and that is why the convo stays on Bryce because the threat remains).

This is why people are tired of these posts.

Bryce has been bad no doubt, and he has to play better or we will be looking for a new QB after the season. But the same 5 posters in every thread suggesting that PJ Walker or Sam Howell or Aiden O'Connell would be winning more games is asinine and borders on delusion. None of those players are better than Dalton and he was AWFUL last year. 

There are about 10-11 serviceable QB's in the world - Allen, Lamar, Herbert, Mahomes, Stafford, Goff, Dak, Baker, Love, Daniels, Hurts (and only because he is playing on a stacked team, Hurts would be bad here), Daniel Jones (who I think is a mirage and will Darnold back to earth), and we don't have one. It is what it is. 

Replacing the 29th best QB with someone in the 30's or 50's isn't changing a damn thing on this team.

Both Bryce and Canales are to blame. The offense cannot be this bad with this much invested in it. Even with Bryce not throwing downfield, Canales has to scheme better and be more creative. We have a talented running game yet everything we've ran so far is very vanilla.

[Tr3ach]

33 minutes ago, CRA said:

It's the most important and impactful position and it's not close.  And on top of being bad, Young makes the O boring.  PJ Walker bad would lead to more convos.  Because the play would be more entertaining and there would be zero concern the horrific nature of the QB spot could extend beyond this year (and that is why the convo stays on Bryce because the threat remains).

Listen,  I get it.  You think Bryce is bad.  I might think hes bad too,  but we know your opinions, its crazy to push them on every single post regardless of what its about.   I think Bryce is probably bad too, but I would still like to talk about the team and positives and negatives about all aspects of the team.  The worst thing is you guys freak out and get loudest any time we win or Bryce has any kind of decent game.  That's when you have to make sure everyone hears your opinion the loudest. 

[CRA]

4 minutes ago, amcoolio said:

This is why people are tired of these posts.

Bryce has been bad no doubt, and he has to play better or we will be looking for a new QB after the season. But the same 5 posters in every thread suggesting that PJ Walker or Sam Howell or Aiden O'Connell would be winning more games is asinine and borders on delusion. None of those players are better than Dalton and he was AWFUL last year. 

There are about 10-11 serviceable QB's in the world - Allen, Lamar, Herbert, Mahomes, Stafford, Goff, Dak, Baker, Love, Daniels, Hurts (and only because he is playing on a stacked team, Hurts would be bad here), Daniel Jones (who I think is a mirage and will Darnold back to earth), and we don't have one. It is what it is. 

Replacing the 29th best QB with someone in the 30's or 50's isn't changing a damn thing on this team.

Both Bryce and Canales are to blame. The offense cannot be this bad with this much invested in it. Even with Bryce not throwing downfield, Canales has to scheme better and be more creative. We have a talented running game yet everything we've ran so far is very vanilla.

Yeah, but you projecting things not said.  I didn't say PJ Walker would win more games. I specifically said he would be bad. But PJ Walker's bad is just a far more entertaining version of bad and most importantly.......the threat of PJ Walker ruining the next season wouldn't be on the table (which it is for Bryce). 

We hired Canales and we all should of known what he was.  He told us.  If you are wanting some creativity and great scheme you are barking up the wrong tree.  You need a QB that can play within what the O asks. 

This whole notion that no one can do better  than Bryce but Pro Bowl level talent is just silly.   That's what people are tired.  Josh Allen would be 3-0 here.  Proof is in the pudding.  Take the INSANE difference between Cam and Jimmy with merely largely a TE upgrade. 

[electro's horse]

9 minutes ago, Tr3ach said:

I would still like to talk about the team and positives and negatives about all aspects of the team.

Make a thread about it. 

No one is going to talk about Bryce Young in a Mike Jackson thread.

[CPF4LIFE]

20 minutes ago, amcoolio said:

This is why people are tired of these posts.

Bryce has been bad no doubt, and he has to play better or we will be looking for a new QB after the season. But the same 5 posters in every thread suggesting that PJ Walker or Sam Howell or Aiden O'Connell would be winning more games is asinine and borders on delusion. None of those players are better than Dalton and he was AWFUL last year. 

There are about 10-11 serviceable QB's in the world - Allen, Lamar, Herbert, Mahomes, Stafford, Goff, Dak, Baker, Love, Daniels, Hurts (and only because he is playing on a stacked team, Hurts would be bad here), Daniel Jones (who I think is a mirage and will Darnold back to earth), and we don't have one. It is what it is. 

Replacing the 29th best QB with someone in the 30's or 50's isn't changing a damn thing on this team.

Both Bryce and Canales are to blame. The offense cannot be this bad with this much invested in it. Even with Bryce not throwing downfield, Canales has to scheme better and be more creative. We have a talented running game yet everything we've ran so far is very vanilla.

How much scheming do you think a playcaller can do with a limited QB? What do you think they can do thats gonna lead to 9-10 wins??

[Stuart Smith]

9 hours ago, Panthero said:

Noticed a lot of qbs statlines with less than 200yds passing. I dont really watch the games anymore, but those stats surprised me. Bryce with a stone cold 121 against the Falcons gave me a chuckle. Hell if you win, who cares i guess. 

Honestly, the number of “elite” quarterbacks in the NFL is diminishing each year. Father Time has caught up with some who are hanging on for a payday. 

[CRA]

45 minutes ago, Tr3ach said:

Listen,  I get it.  You think Bryce is bad.  I might think hes bad too,  but we know your opinions, its crazy to push them on every single post regardless of what its about.   I think Bryce is probably bad too, but I would still like to talk about the team and positives and negatives about all aspects of the team.  The worst thing is you guys freak out and get loudest any time we win or Bryce has any kind of decent game.  That's when you have to make sure everyone hears your opinion the loudest. 

this thread is about our yards per play.   So it by nature is going to be Bryce heavy talk given the ball is in his hands every snap and he is the main driver.  This ain't a Jaycee Horn thread being hijacked where Bryce is catching strays. 

if folks don't like hearing Bryce Young debates....go start a thread on our special teams, or defense or endzone color.  O threads are just flat out going to be Bryce Young talk. 

[frankw]

4 hours ago, Tr3ach said:

Doesn't it get tired just arguing the same point over and over no matter what's happening?  It was posted as a way to bash Bryce, someone says all the offenses that run very often are near the bottom.  Then it erupts in to the same people making comment after comment about how bad bryce is.  There is no conversation, there is no dialogue, there's no football talk that doesnt just devolve in to how bad Bryce is.  There are other conversations about the team that could be had.

Well at the end of the day people make a choice to open threads.

Beyond that. I will acknowledge that these conversations are getting more and more contentious. But that is the result of a myriad of reasons. Just a few of which begin with the fact that a number of posters here who have spent literal years and some even before the draft shouting down any and all skepticism and criticism on his behalf. To the point that now instead of our starting QB being sold as a generational prospect in terms of processing diagnosing plays and protections and a keen ability to thrive when the play breaks down as he was before the draft. To basically just praising him any time he does anything any below average QB or fringe backup would be capable of. I mean it's to the point where it's basically like congratulating a child for small life milestones instead of an adult athlete who was billed as an elite talent with $39 million guaranteed. And now you have people once again griping that it's being talked about. Well let's be honest about that. Folks who have taken that stance have had their moment. They shouted down dissent all last spring and summer and tried to actually drive people off the huddle. Then we know how preseason and the beginning of the season played out. Then spring/summer for this year went largely the same in terms of folks being ultra defensive about him. Then we once again started out 0-2 after Bryce and the starters looked quite putrid against a team that is BTW 0-3 which I keep hearing so much about. That team made our starting offense look like a high school unit. So no I will not quiet down I will not stop discussing these issues. If someone doesn't like it well that's unfortunate but you folks have had your time to talk down to others and try to dictate conversation. It's year 3. We're going to talk about this and it will not end until the draft when we inevitably pick another QB. Then guess what? There's a whole new layer to the convo. My suggestion would be to take it or leave it and just buckle in. This is the Panthers for better or worse. We should all be used to it by now anyways.

[Proudiddy]

7 hours ago, electro's horse said:

Make a thread about it. 

No one is going to talk about Bryce Young in a Mike Jackson thread.

You dare me?

[Diehardpanth02]

16 hours ago, frankw said:

Also ironic that just yesterday there were a few people who said that expecting more completed passes beyond a measly 5 yards is basically akin to throwing into double coverage downfield and throwing bombs.

I think completion percentage is a bit of a overinflated stat for a qb too. People place to much stock into it. So many factors to consider with it : receivers, how many attempts are made deep, the defense etc all play a roll in it. When it’s considerably low 50% or less the QB accuracy can come into question. But I don’t think it’s necessarily one of the better percentages to put so much importance into for that position. General effectiveness is far more indicative of the QB you have. First downs, 3rd and 4th down conversions, points scored and clutch plays IMO is how you grade a QB. Always bothered the poo out of me how people downed Cam for his completion percentage and that’s what they used to disregard him as an all time great. Dude damn near averaged 3tds to 1 turnover a game and was an obvious difference maker for us.

Edited 15 hours ago by Diehardpanth02
Bryce’m n dice’m

[Jon Snow]

19 hours ago, electro's horse said:

Year 3 of this 

top paid offensive line in the nfl, two first round wrs, very good running back, whole different coaching staff

imagine having these arguments about Jimmy Clausen 

Its more than just a qb issue if that's what you are implying. Its been more than 3 years of this also. Its been a decade of this incompetence. 

[frankw]

10 hours ago, Diehardpanth02 said:

I think completion percentage is a bit of a overinflated stat for a qb too. People place to much stock into it. So many factors to consider with it : receivers, how many attempts are made deep, the defense etc all play a roll in it. When it’s considerably low 50% or less the QB accuracy can come into question. But I don’t think it’s necessarily one of the better percentages to put so much importance into for that position. General effectiveness is far more indicative of the QB you have. First downs, 3rd and 4th down conversions, points scored and clutch plays IMO is how you grade a QB. Always bothered the poo out of me how people downed Cam for his completion percentage and that’s what they used to disregard him as an all time great. Dude damn near averaged 3tds to 1 turnover a game and was an obvious difference maker for us.

To be clear I do not think Bryce Young is necessarily inaccurate in the sense that he can't hit the broad side of a barn the issue is his arm talent is so lacking and he needs perfect circumstances to make certain throws and those circumstances are very rare. The best and even some of the not so great QB's can deliver absolute dimes under pressure and off balance. That is physical talent. Bryce cannot do that and that is an advantage to any defense worth their salt unfortunately. He does not have any semblance of physical talent to separate him from other higher end starters. That was an unnecessary risk we took in trying to build our entire franchise around a guy like that. But we can't keep doubling and tripling down over it.

Edited 4 hours ago by frankw

[ImfromClayton]

Not sure evaluating per play averages after a very strange three game sample size is a great idea. It's like evaluate offensive baseballs stats after 28-29 games. Too early. 

Keeping in mind that we trailed for the entire cardinals game, and that falcons game, while I loved it, was never really contentious either, we have a very strange three game sample size for an NFL team.