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Black&BlueBubba

By Black&BlueBubba,
in Carolina Panthers

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

Posted
Posted

I actually did get an interesting insight from a video that was linked to this clip.

One analyst (I think it was Marcellus Wiley) pointed out that 2019 will only  see the end of the Ron Rivera version of Cam Newton.

That kind of intrigued me.

What does the Matt Nagy version, or the Vic Fangio version, or the Mike Vrabel version, or even the Adam Gase version of Cam Newton look like?

Which coach out there with a need for a quarterback has the best chance of maximizing Newton's skill set?

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onmyown Grand Master

onmyown

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, GoPanthers123 said:

Yeah comparing how good Cam “was” to how good Allen “will be” is totally legit to begin with, there is a bunch of tough games coming up.  We will find out soon.

There’s only one real question...is cam willing to play without an extension?

its really all that matters and it’s worth 19 mil to find out if he can come back.

Allen isn’t the future and he won’t be taking the Panther to the playoffs this year. Just my opinion and I’ll be glad to eat crow if I’m wrong.

If can wants a new deal before you know he can play a full season you trade him and draft a qb.

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, onmyown said:

There’s only one real question...is cam willing to play without an extension?

its really all that matters and it’s worth 19 mil to find out if he can come back.

Allen isn’t the future and he won’t be taking the Panther to the playoffs this year. Just my opinion and I’ll be glad to eat crow if I’m wrong.

If can wants a new deal before you know he can play a full season you trade him and draft a qb.

General belief on that first question is it's doubtful.

And honestly, given his age and that his next contract is likely his last one, it's not an unusual mindset at all.

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j2sgam Collaborator

j2sgam

Posted
Posted

I mean, I want Cam back wearing a Panthers jersey.. don’t know how it’s going to play out, but there definitely value at keeping him at $19M, but would QB1 play under his last contractual season, given that he hasn’t been able to play for teh better part of the last 2 seasons?

 

like onmyown said, that’s the real question..... I’m gonna sit back, enjoy every moment I can and see what happens....

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ellis Proficient

ellis

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

I actually did get an interesting insight from a video that was linked to this clip.

One analyst (I think it was Marcellus Wiley) pointed out that 2019 will only  see the end of the Ron Rivera version of Cam Newton.

That kind of intrigued me.

What does the Matt Nagy version, or the Vic Fangio version, or the Mike Vrabel version, or even the Adam Gase version of Cam Newton look like?

Which coach out there with a need for a quarterback has the best chance of maximizing Newton's skill set?

I’ve always wondered about that, however coaches would approach utilization piece. 
 

All we’ve known is Ron’s different flavors of the Coryell. There really has been very little schematic change over the years. Child’s version felt the most energetic, but it also felt like it was snorting Adderall it would crash any moment. Shula, as you’ve mentioned, did the Budd Ryan deal. Norv gets a lot of credit, but if McCaffrey wasn’t in the mix, I’m not so sure how great cam’s progress would look. How much has been made of cams increased efficiency, a big part of that has been short passes. His people was in effective last season, because he was hurt. 2017, it’s still wasn’t that great. 2016, he was knocked around like a ragdoll. So you’re going for years back in time to find the last season but he was consistently hitting the sweet spot on the deep ball. I don’t give a crap about cam’s completion percentage, to be honest. I care about moving the chains and his ability to hit the deep ball when called upon. Otherwise, they’re  utilizing him like Kyle Allen. It doesn’t take a generational talent to throw 5 yard passes to McCaffrey. It does take talent to do everything else he does well. 

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GoPanthers123 Newbie

GoPanthers123

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, onmyown said:

There’s only one real question...is cam willing to play without an extension?

its really all that matters and it’s worth 19 mil to find out if he can come back.

Allen isn’t the future and he won’t be taking the Panther to the playoffs this year. Just my opinion and I’ll be glad to eat crow if I’m wrong.

If can wants a new deal before you know he can play a full season you trade him and draft a qb.

Can you please articulate why Allen isn’t the future?  

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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7 hours ago, ellis said:

I’ve always wondered about that, however coaches would approach utilization piece. 
 

All we’ve known is Ron’s different flavors of the Coryell. There really has been very little schematic change over the years. Child’s version felt the most energetic, but it also felt like it was snorting Adderall it would crash any moment. Shula, as you’ve mentioned, did the Budd Ryan deal. Norv gets a lot of credit, but if McCaffrey wasn’t in the mix, I’m not so sure how great cam’s progress would look. How much has been made of cams increased efficiency, a big part of that has been short passes. His people was in effective last season, because he was hurt. 2017, it’s still wasn’t that great. 2016, he was knocked around like a ragdoll. So you’re going for years back in time to find the last season but he was consistently hitting the sweet spot on the deep ball. I don’t give a crap about cam’s completion percentage, to be honest. I care about moving the chains and his ability to hit the deep ball when called upon. Otherwise, they’re  utilizing him like Kyle Allen. It doesn’t take a generational talent to throw 5 yard passes to McCaffrey. It does take talent to do everything else he does well. 

I'm pretty sure all of the teams that have been mentioned as possibilities so far run WCOs except Tennessee which I think runs an Erhardt-Perkins.

WCO is all timing and rhythm. General speculation in the past has been Newton's skill set didn't fit that system but it's hard to conclusively say that when you haven't seen him run one (unless you're DeAngelo Williams).

Tennessee's system is probably the closest to ours. Erhardt-Perkins is a lot like Coryell but is said to have simpler  terminology. My question would be whether Vrabel would be willing to turn a big play quarterback loose or if he'd stay conservative like he did this past Sunday.

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Untouchable Collaborator

Untouchable

Posted
Posted
10 hours ago, ellis said:

All we’ve known is Ron’s different flavors of the Coryell. There really has been very little schematic change over the years. Child’s version felt the most energetic, but it also felt like it was snorting Adderall it would crash any moment. Shula, as you’ve mentioned, did the Budd Ryan deal. Norv gets a lot of credit, but if McCaffrey wasn’t in the mix, I’m not so sure how great cam’s progress would look. How much has been made of cams increased efficiency, a big part of that has been short passes. His people was in effective last season, because he was hurt. 2017, it’s still wasn’t that great. 2016, he was knocked around like a ragdoll. So you’re going for years back in time to find the last season but he was consistently hitting the sweet spot on the deep ball. I don’t give a crap about cam’s completion percentage, to be honest. I care about moving the chains and his ability to hit the deep ball when called upon. Otherwise, they’re  utilizing him like Kyle Allen. It doesn’t take a generational talent to throw 5 yard passes to McCaffrey. It does take talent to do everything else he does well. 

As you alluded to you can't replace talent.  The deep ball essentially left with Ted Ginn.  The breakdown of the interior OL after 2015 was another factor.  Just like the introduction of McCaffery had been a boon to his increased efficiency.

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mc52beast Grand Master

mc52beast

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Posted

I don’t understand how people who are supposed to have a vast knowledge of football can say one way or the other who should be our qb next year.

We haven’t seen what Cam looks like at 100%
 

We don’t know enough about Allen to say whether he can be a starter in the NFL

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