Good Ownership

[Mr. Scot]

4 minutes ago, Paa Langfart said:

So 3 cheating scandals and 1 underage sex trade hooker equals elite ownership skills?

I would also add that having probably the goat coach of all time and one of the best qb's of all time probably has a lot more to do with the pats success than massage parlor kraft.

Do Panther fans really have much standing to talk about ownership scandals?

Regardless, talking about what kind of people they are is a whole other discussion. I'm strictly looking at how successful they are as team owners.

[cookinbrak]

A lot of people are confusing good owners with good qbs and coaches.

[Move the Panthers to Raleigh]

8 hours ago, TheCasillas said:

Good ownership = super bowl in the modern nfl and perennial contenders

elite ownership = multiple super bowls and perennial division winners 

 

elite:

Patriots

ravens

saints

steelers

seahawks 

 

Idk. Saints and Seahawks only have one Super Bowl each. Is that elite?

[Panther Believer]

16 hours ago, DaveThePanther2008 said:

That's not accurate.  They were the Cleveland Browns and moved to Baltimore.  Art Modell moved them. 

They've been amazing since they left Cleveland.  Maybe Cleveland is just cursed. 

Haha you learn something new everyday, thanks for that. I wasn't born until 99' so can't even act like I was there for either parts lol. Still elite ownership though.

[SizzleBuzz]

8 hours ago, Paa Langfart said:

...and 1 underage sex trade hooker equals elite ownership skills?

Are you really holding this out to be a factual statement?

[Mr. Scot]

Not to argue with the choices that have been put forward here but I am kinda surprised there isn't more love for the Hunt family.

They've perennially been considered among the NFL's better owners and now seem to have brought the Chiefs back to the high standing they enjoyed many years ago.

[exactlyzack]

Why isn’t the Chiefs on here? They’ve been consistently good the last few years and just won the super bowl last year, and were in the AFC championship the year before. I get Reid and Mahomes are a big part of it, but what they’ve done to help out a team around him and the coaching staff is remarkable. If I were to pick a set of owners right now, I’d pick the Hunt family.

[SizzleBuzz]

10 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Not to argue with the choices that have been put forward here but I am kinda surprised there isn't more love for the Hunt family.

They've perennially been considered among the NFL's better owners and now seem to have brought the Chiefs back to the high standing they enjoyed many years ago.

2000-2019 = 20 seasons...

Franchise 1:  Made playoffs 9-years -> 13 total playoff games -> 5-8 playoff record -> 1 Super Bowl appearance -> 1 Lombardi Trophy.

Franchise 2:  Made playoffs 8-years -> 16 total playoffs games -> 10-6 playoff record -> 3 Super Bowl appearances -> 2 Lombardi Trophies.

Which ownership group would folks rather be affiliated with?

EDIT:  Varking, in this post what was it that you found to be off-base or offensive?

 

[1of10Charnatives]

On 11/11/2020 at 3:25 PM, Mr. Scot said:

So here's a question I've been pondering...

How many teams in the NFL can rightly be said to have good ownership?

Elite ownership is limited to two teams, the Patriots and the Steelers. Some might argue for the Packers, but that's a sidebar all its own given their structure.

I'm interested in what teams beyond the big two people would credit with having really good leadership and guidance at the top.

Also feel free to name the worst of the worst (goodness knows there's plenty of contenders).

And finally, although the most obvious grade for him is "incomplete" right now, where do you put David Tepper in this hierarchy?

Patriots ownership being elite is questionable. Kraft hired exactly two head coaches and got lucky enough that the second one has been with him ever since, owing partially to stumbling into a fluke GOAT qb in Brady. Did Bellicheck turn out to be a great hire? undoubtably, but it's not like Kraft ever had to make a decision to stick with him through thick and thin.  I think it's entirely possible Kraft merely got unbelievably lucky early and has simply ridden that luck for 20 years now, deserving credit only for not screwing up an obvious good thing.

If the Patriots continue to dominate and win post Brady and eventually post Bellicheck, then sure, but right now the evidence points pretty strongly towards Bellicheck being merely human without Brady, which doesn't make Kraft look like some kind of a genius for hiring him, just a guy who got lucky and didn't screw it up once he did.

The Steelers have proven to be a solid, well run organization over a long period of time that encompasses multiple head coaches and GM's without simply riding one great coaching hire who in turn rode one fluke all time great qb. 

I think you have to say the Ravens are a well run organization that keeps their roster stocked with talent, coached by excellent staffs. I think the Seahawks deserve to be mentioned as well and perhaps KC.  KC didn't notch that Super Bowl win til this year but they have always been competitive year in and year out for as long as I can remember.

I think in the NFL there are more organizations that are flaming dumpster fires than there are consistently well run teams.

Browns

Cowboys

Jaguars

Jets

Tampa Bay

For a long time the Bills, but that seems to have changed in recent years. Go Panthers north.

Tepper's hire of Rhule and his obvious desire to pattern the franchise after the kind of stability seen in the Steelers means he has a chance to become this, but the jury is still out. So far things look good.

[4Corners]

Bob Kraft is great NFL owner. He the best. Very youthful and vigorous. He also very good tipper. 
 

signed,

that massage parlor in Florida 

[tiger7_88]

No answer to your question except as to your organizations current owner and the answer is:

"No."

But I do have to say as well that he is a PERFECT owner for your organization, so there is that.  I'm sure all you rebel yellers and F-150s will support your fake owner and his wife's fake, plastic tits to your shallow graves.

Shallow being the key word.

[SizzleBuzz]

10 minutes ago, tiger7_88 said:

No answer to your question except as to your organizations current owner and the answer is:

"No."

But I do have to say as well that he is a PERFECT owner for your organization, so there is that.  I'm sure all you rebel yellers and F-150s will support your fake owner and his wife's fake, plastic tits to your shallow graves.

Shallow being the key word.

Are you referencing Tepper here?

[Iron Saint]

11 hours ago, tiger7_88 said:

and his wife's fake, plastic tits

Hey, if I can squeeze ‘em then they’re real enough for me.

[Sgt Schultz]

15 hours ago, 1of10Charnatives said:

Patriots ownership being elite is questionable. Kraft hired exactly two head coaches and got lucky enough that the second one has been with him ever since, owing partially to stumbling into a fluke GOAT qb in Brady. Did Bellicheck turn out to be a great hire? undoubtably, but it's not like Kraft ever had to make a decision to stick with him through thick and thin.  I think it's entirely possible Kraft merely got unbelievably lucky early and has simply ridden that luck for 20 years now, deserving credit only for not screwing up an obvious good thing.

If the Patriots continue to dominate and win post Brady and eventually post Bellicheck, then sure, but right now the evidence points pretty strongly towards Bellicheck being merely human without Brady, which doesn't make Kraft look like some kind of a genius for hiring him, just a guy who got lucky and didn't screw it up once he did.

I've been wondering since this thread started whether the jury is still out on Kraft in terms of elite. 

To his credit, he did nothing to sabotage his own organization's success.  I can't say the same about Jerry Jones, who did sabotage the Cowboys early success, has not been able to get anybody to recreate anything close to it since, and in fact, the one time they appeared to be on a path that might lead to sustained success, he terminated that relationship, too.  Daniel Snyder would do the same if he had the opportunity.  So that is a plus for Kraft: he did not become his own worst enemy.

On the back side of that, did he ever have the opportunity?  The Pats down years over the last 20 have all been years most teams would eagerly accept.  The worst was in 2002 (season after their first Super Bowl), and that was a paltry 9-7.  Belichick was untouchable at that point.  Again, Jones would have found a way to eff that up, but that's why he is Jones.  Nobody in their right mind would have.

Now for the doubt in my mind.  There have been plenty of reports about a 2017 struggle between Brady, Belichick, and Kraft.  The result of that was Garoppolo was traded (he would have been a FA in 2018).  If the reports are true, and there have been all sorts of grumbling that support them, Kraft intervened on behalf of Brady.  Ultimately, he didn't get what he wanted, either (Brady to retire a Pat).  Nobody did.  Yeah, they won one more Super Bowl, but that was not exactly an offensive showcase.

If Kraft did that, the current situation is on him.  That does not mean he is not a good owner, but it puts a dent in the "elite" status.  When a player can sidestep the coach or GM and appeal to the owner to get what they want, especially when that coach or GM is not an unproven buffoon like Chip Kelly, that is a problem.  It sets a dangerous precedent, even when the player is Tom Brady.

They are still sweeping up those ashes, I think.