Jump to content
  • Welcome!

    Register and log in easily with Twitter or Google accounts!

    Or simply create a new Huddle account. 

    Members receive fewer ads , access our dark theme, and the ability to join the discussion!

     

Giants thought they would have to give up more in trade for Brian Burns


WarPanthers89
 Share

Recommended Posts

This team drafts poorly and attempts to fix it by overcompensating in free agency.

we broke down the defense to spend a fug ton of money to fix a qb we traded up for who wasn’t even the right pick.

 

this site is so consistent. I bet if I go to the hornets thread I’ll see folks saying we should trade bridges because of this draft pick 

  • Beer 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, Navy_football said:

I don't get why a lot can't see this. I think the defense is better without him and his one splash play every 2-3 games. Consistent pressure on the QB is vastly more impactful than the occassional super sack. Being able to set the edge is crucial to stopping the run. Off tackle runs are your back breaker, big runs. 

That’s why passing on 2 1st and 1 2nd for him was maybe the dumbest thing in NFL history. 

  • Beer 2
  • Flames 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Call Me James said:

I’m sorry. Is this the same team over paying every journeyman qb.

the same team that kept cmc on the books.

the same team who continues to extend Thomas.

It sounds good, but I’ve realized yall miss the point.

we aren’t overpaying too many players: because every single one of the players we’ve complained about have gone elsewhere and find success.

 

we just suck at team building because yall would rather feel better in your f150

You are literally naming players we overpaid but aren't premium players(minus CMC, that's just a non-premium position).

We suck at team building because we hire moron after moron in the front office and/or as head coach.

That's how you end up turning down a haul for Burns that could have changed our fortunes completely. 

But, that would require them not to be idiots. The CMC haul was probably the best RB haul you will see in a long time but the idiots in charge immediately squandered the draft capital gained.

Most of the players we have had go elsewhere and find success, had success here too. The far greater pool is players that weren't successful here, a portion of the idiots here still believe are just being held back by some situation here but then they go elsewhere and stink. More fodder for the very obvious, which is that we have some of the worst talent evaluators in the NFL.

  • Flames 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Shotgun said:

That’s why passing on 2 1st and 1 2nd for him was maybe the dumbest thing in NFL history. 

It was definitely the dumbest move/non-move in Panthers team history.

The only thing that makes it sting less is that we would have fuged up all those picks anyway, so would it have actually mattered?

  • Pie 2
  • Beer 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah it would have mattered because we would probably be at around 50% on the picks and we’d have the ones we traded so we are 50% on them, and DJ Moore on that contract. Net gain of some kind of better. 

Changing that could have changed the direction prior to the 2023 draft. Maybe we trade those picks for a vet QB. No way to say what would have ensued. I do recognize the black cat factor and probability that something wrong will happen at regular intervals. 

 

  • Pie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Shotgun said:

That’s why passing on 2 1st and 1 2nd for him was maybe the dumbest thing in NFL history. 

That's a long history and I'm sure there are worse things but yeah, this was up there in the 'airballed a slam dunk' category. Just pure stupidity.

  • Pie 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, strato said:

Yeah it would have mattered because we would probably be at around 50% on the picks and we’d have the ones we traded so we are 50% on them, and DJ Moore on that contract. Net gain of some kind of better. 

Changing that could have changed the direction prior to the 2023 draft. Maybe we trade those picks for a vet QB. No way to say what would have ensued. I do recognize the black cat factor and probability that something wrong will happen at regular intervals. 

 

They have been no where close to 50% on the picks since 2019. They are lucky to hit on 1 pick per draft. Most of that trade capital would have been wasted by poor picks or projects that can't develop with so little tallent around them.

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

58 minutes ago, Waldo said:

They have been no where close to 50% on the picks since 2019. They are lucky to hit on 1 pick per draft. Most of that trade capital would have been wasted by poor picks or projects that can't develop with so little tallent around them.

 

 

These are higher picks, easier to find starters, and I am gonna hold that the coaching was failing players. How many coaches and OCs have there been? So maybe things are a bit different with a unified staff. We will get to see how they (staff) do with the ‘failures’ that are not too far gone. 


Horn we know, it is injuries and it wasn’t predictable (like people may feel about the new RB).

Icky looked really bad last year, yep he sure did. But not as horrible the first year. So we will see. 

Good lord I agree on Young being a huge mistake but they may be able to coach him up and scheme things to where he is maybe 50% of what was hoped for. 

These second round receivers, we have had crap QB play and that does not help them. The multiple OCs and HCs certainly doasn’t. I am just saying the players could have talent but the coaches we had were failing them and the QBs we had were failing them. Where was any continuity for these young players? That poo is very important. (and we know the don’t All pan out regardless of anything else)

I have been a hard pessimist the last 6 years, and think they earned every bit of fail that came to them (and trickled down to us) , at the same time if you can’t think there could have been other possible outcomes with different people involved, you have out pessimisted me. That is a chore, congratulations. 

Edited by strato
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Also, on the OL, and in regards to missing maybe on Icky,  it has become very difficult to project college tackles in the NFL because college has changed so much the last however many years. 

I think what they did with the guards is what should happen with the tackles, we find guys that have proven adaptability to the pro game and just pay them. Draft them much lower, take your D line beasts and skill players up top. 

Edited by strato
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Shotgun said:

That’s why passing on 2 1st and 1 2nd for him was maybe the dumbest thing in NFL history. 

It was dumb to turn that down from the teams perspective.  But Fitterer doesn’t survive to see either of those 1sts even with Burns on the roster.  I doubt if he trades him Teppers like let this guy cook for another couple years lol.

He didn’t do it because he knew it wasn’t in his best interest as general manager.  That’s kind of the unfortunate reality a lot of the time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since I’ve been paying attention to Panthers football (started inn2092 season), they have NEVER been able to develop talent. They either draft HOF’ers/fringe HOF’ers, or people that are out of the nfl in 3 years. Rarely in between. FAs 99% of the time come to Charlotte to grab a check and retire. Good FAs: Greg, Norwell, Proehl and Luvu. I’m sure there’s more, but the list is short. 

2003 was lightning in a freaking bottle. Jake that year was a really good qb, and the absolute perfect pairing with a developing Smitty, but that season doesn’t happen without 89, Peppers and Morgan. Same with 2005. 

2015. Men among men…

Seasons that we don’t draft a HOFer on both sides of the ball, are either duds or barely .500, we’ll get em next year. Marty at least knew a blue chip player when he saw one. It’s been the only hope we’ve had for a good season for 20 years. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

24 minutes ago, PNW_PantherMan said:

It was dumb to turn that down from the teams perspective.  But Fitterer doesn’t survive to see either of those 1sts even with Burns on the roster.  I doubt if he trades him Teppers like let this guy cook for another couple years lol.

He didn’t do it because he knew it wasn’t in his best interest as general manager.  That’s kind of the unfortunate reality a lot of the time.

Now do morgan. 

  • Pie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, PNW_PantherMan said:

It was dumb to turn that down from the teams perspective.  But Fitterer doesn’t survive to see either of those 1sts even with Burns on the roster.  I doubt if he trades him Teppers like let this guy cook for another couple years lol.

He didn’t do it because he knew it wasn’t in his best interest as general manager.  That’s kind of the unfortunate reality a lot of the time.

This is the reason future picks are valued less by GMs than current picks. Two future 1st with one 2 plus years away don’t hold the kind of value that 2 current 1st round picks do. It was still a bad trade to reject, but it looks worse as the years approach where the picks actually are/ would have been.

  • Pie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share


  • PMH4OWPW7JD2TDGWZKTOYL2T3E.jpg

  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Exactly what I was going to say. Brady seems to be taking a page out of Olsen's playbook, which is probably a good thing. They'll probably get around to giving Brady an Emmy one day, and he should thank Olsen for giving him the blueprint for success.
    • In before: "XL sucks, there is no hope." "As long as we have Bryce, none of this matters." My response: "It's X, not XL...we're not discussing apparel sizes, or we'd have to consider XS."  
    • Alain Pierre provides some food for thought on Last Word On Sports regarding Xavier Legette, and his article, though specifically on X, kind of puts me in the mind of QBs being overdrafted and put into situations that they're not prepared for, some ultimately failing due to drafting missteps by front offices who don't necessarily view prospective players within the contextual importance that situations demand.  At this point, Legette looks like a failure in reference to expectations, of not only what a consistently productive NFL receiver looks like, but a first round pick (which he obviously should never have been). But the story on X isn't necessarily completely over. Damn. I seem to be experiencing deja vu...It wasn't X's fault that he was overdrafted, that was a choice by an FO that obviously downplayed actual realized skill vs outstanding measurables and upside. Sure, the FO was impressed by X's one-year feats during his senior season at South Carolina, but it was the NFL god, RAS (a.k.a. Raw Athletic Score), that had Dave Canales's and Dan Morgan's jaws dropping in amazement at the sight of X running around in underwear at the Combine...   "At 6-foot-3 and over 220 pounds, Legette brought rare athletic upside to the position. His breakout season at South Carolina showed flashes of dominance that NFL teams dream of. Projecting forward, many scouts compared his physical profile to D.K. Metcalf, and the Panthers clearly believed they could develop him into a true wide receiver 1 over time. The issue was never his talent. The issue was the timeline. Just a few picks later, the Chargers selected Ladd McConkey, a receiver who may have lacked Xavier Legette’s physical ceiling but entered the league far more technically refined. McConkey immediately showed advanced route discipline, leverage awareness, good pacing, and separation ability.  Bryce Young’s game has always depended on timing and anticipation. His best football at Alabama came with receivers capable of winning through precision rather than pure athleticism. Jameson Williams and John Metchie III were excellent route runners and were able to get drafted in 2022. McConkey naturally fit that style of play. Legette, meanwhile, needed significant development in the exact areas where Bryce Young needed help. The Panthers drafted traits when Bryce Young needed reliability."   Yes, the FO was guilty. The good thing is that the execs appear to be improving. Some of that may be attributed to the hiring of Eric Eager (who was hired right after the Xavier Legette draft). Eager seems to have helped the Panthers FO fine-tune their analytical progress, and, at least on paper, they acquired players with a lot of value during the last draft in regards to actually (what I'll refer to as) "underdrafting" talent relative to their position with value already built in.  Look at Chris Brazzell: He may be more of the quintessential project receiver who was arguably more or less just as raw as Legette was when he was drafted, and with a relatively high RAS as well. The notable difference is value, as Brazzell was a round three pick and Legette was a first rounder.    "Unlike the Xavier Legette situation, Carolina’s environment for Brazzell is completely different. "The Panthers are not asking a raw receiver prospect to stabilize this offense for Bryce Young. "Brazzell enters a much healthier developmental situation with far less pressure. With Tetairoa McMillan established as the primary target and Jalen Coker continuing to settle as the number 2 option...Xavier Legette, Metchie III, and Jimmy Horn Jr. are also still in this rotation, fighting for reps. "It gives Carolina something they failed to give Legette when they drafted him: A developmental runway. "Xavier Legette entered the league with expectations attached to a first-round pick and an offense desperate for answers. Brazzell enters a room where he can spend a year working on his route running, learning the playbook, and earning snaps gradually rather than being asked to become part of Bryce Young’s solution immediately. "And truthfully, Brazzell needs that time coming out of college. Despite his elite physical tools, many evaluators have several concerns about his overall polish as a receiver. "His route tree at Tennessee was viewed as fairly limited due to the type of offense that they run. The receivers are expected to run a lot of choice routes, which are dictated by the placement of the defenders. It doesn’t require technical route-running and an understanding of the playbook needed at the NFL level...   "Context changes significantly when expectations change. "The Panthers are not depending on Brazzell to save the offense. They can allow him to develop slowly, expand his route tree, improve his technical refinement, and learn behind a much more stable receiver room... "Traits become much easier to bet on when patience is built into the plan."   It's all about understanding your situation. I don't agree that it's an inherently difficult choice like the author is suggesting in the following excerpt. At the very least, I think that it should be easier as long as all parties involved stay levelheaded and true to their process.    "That is what makes these draft decisions so difficult. "Every front office believes it can find the next Metcalf, Owens, or Marshall. Sometimes they do. More often, they are betting on a development path that may take years to complete. "The challenge is understanding what your offense needs right now. "If a team has patience, stability, and a quarterback capable of carrying the offense while a receiver develops, betting on traits can make sense. But if a young quarterback needs immediate help, there is a strong argument for prioritizing the receiver who already knows how to separate, create throwing , and earn trust from day one. "That’s why the Xavier Legette-Ladd McConkey debate remains so fascinating. "It was never really a discussion about talent. It was a discussion about timing."   For me, Ladd McConkey was talented enough in his own right, that the gap--the upside--was never as big as people are suggesting between not only McConkey and Legette, but McConkey and other receivers drafted in the first round during that draft. The technique divide between Ladd and X was pretty stark though, as was the roughly 35 pounds, but the speed was identical, the maybe 1½ height difference isn't huge (6' and 6'1"), and it may surprise some that Ladd's RAS (9.34) was also enough to put him in the top 10 percent of receivers since 1987. There is an argument that he would've been a better pick for Bryce and the Panthers, regardless of timeline and talent. But, I still appreciate the thesis (if you will) of the article, as it still provides some hope--perhaps a glimmer at this point, that X's RAS may finally translate to the NFL given more time, but, perhaps more importantly, it explains how Dan Morgan and company are showing improvement, even if it appears somewhat understated. My hope is that continued improvement is palpable by this time next year. https://lastwordonsports.com/nfl/2026/05/30/xavier-legette-draft-lessons/#google_vignette        
×
×
  • Create New...