Jimmy Horn Jr injured during practice

[shaqattaq]

13 hours ago, frankw said:

washed up receivers like Thielen

[frankw]

Just now, shaqattaq said:

I'm glad we can discuss this rationally. And to be abundantly clear this conversation is strictly about the production on the field. On a personal level I think Thielen is a great guy and a great teammate.

Anywho. Just out of boredom I figured this would be an interesting subject to visit. See above for a comparison to other past WR's in his age group.

I think he has above average hands and is a really good route runner but speed and YAC are not even on the radar in any capacity let's just be realistic. I just don't see a reality where he's more than a 3rd option on any other teams depth chart. And compared to some of the HOF names mentioned in the thread above who continued producing at a high level age 32 and beyond even in his best years over 11 seasons he's only reached 1k or more yards in a season three times. And one of those was with us in 2023 in what we all generally agree was a top to bottom failure of a season where we clearly force fed him the ball and our passing offense finished 30 out of 32 teams.

[shaqattaq]

15 hours ago, ECHornet said:

We don’t need him this year. Put him on IR for the year and let him study behind Theilen and Renfrow. Next year, he may have a legit shot at playing time. 

Making him DTR would keep him safe from PS poachers for the first part of the season, right? That makes our WR corps: AT, XL, JC, TMac, (locks) and Renfrow & Moore (probably) and open George and Hudson for competition for a potential WR6/WR7 spot.

[shaqattaq]

5 minutes ago, frankw said:

I'm glad we can discuss this rationally. And to be abundantly clear this conversation is strictly about the production on the field. On a personal level I think Thielen is a great guy and a great teammate.

Anywho. Just out of boredom I figured this would be an interesting subject to visit. See above for a comparison to other past WR's in his age group.

I think he has above average hands and is a really good route runner but speed and YAC are not even on the radar in any capacity let's just be realistic. I just don't see a reality where he's more than a 3rd option on any other teams depth chart. And compared to some of the HOF names mentioned in the thread above who continued producing at a high level age 32 and beyond even in his best years over 11 seasons he's only reached 1k or more yards in a season three times. And one of those was with us in 2023 in what we all generally agree was a top to bottom failure of a season where we clearly force fed him the ball and our passing offense finished 30 out of 32 teams.

He is not a superstar anymore (if he ever was is a matter of opinion), BUT he is constantly open and catches anything that gets near him!! Definitely still above average even at his age. My only complaint was with the term "washed up".

Who the Hell knows what we are getting with Renfrow at this point, and Moore is a career-long average guy who admittedly played pretty danged good down the stretch last year. All 3 of these guys will be 30 this year, and only AT has put up good numbers in recent years. The other 2 are bubble guys IMO.

[lightsout]

18 hours ago, Basbear said:

It always triggers me about hamstring issues and WRs. 

I blame the NFL career leader in hamstring issues- Devin funchess

Memo to all players coming to NC- welcome to humidity!! in order to be a professional NFL player you must hydrate before you enter the hellscape. Grapes, fruits, pure H20, sport Pedialyte the night before and you should be able to avoid the nasty hamstring issues.

 

 

Something everybody who played high school football in NC under any coach worth a damn learned in June: hydration begins 24 hours before you go to practice. If you're not pissing clear the night before practice, you failed. If you don't wake up to two glasses of water, you've failed. If you don't drink water before practice, you've failed. If you don't drink water between reps, you've failed. If you don't drink water during planned water breaks, you've failed. 

This is very easy to do. You're gonna be running behind connex boxes and trees and bleachers mid practice sometimes and that is far more acceptable than cramping or stroking out and going to the hospital.

[BrianS]

Theilen, at this point in his career, should be that guy who comes in on third and eight and gets you nine yards every time.  That kind of player has insane value in the league and it's well within what he is still capable of.

[ECHornet]

13 hours ago, frankw said:

I'm genuinely not trying to be abrasive here but I think it is really important not to overstate Adam Thielen's significance to this offense and I get the sense some people are in a bit of a bubble in terms of their perception of his value because they are wearing Panthers shades. And that's fine mind you because it's June. But we should be realistic about some things here. He was the oldest active WR in the league last year and he will be 35 when preseason rolls around this year. We have some nice youth on the roster. We aren't likely to compete for playoffs this year barring a very nice surprise. Either way. Let's develop the young talent. It isn't about this season it's about the next several.

I’m not saying you’re wrong on what would be best for building up our young core, but I doubt Theilen returns if he wasn’t going to be an important part of our passing attack. He would’ve retired if he was going to be WR4 or less imo. 

Edited Wednesday at 04:16 PM by ECHornet

[jb2288]

47 minutes ago, BrianS said:

Theilen, at this point in his career, should be that guy who comes in on third and eight and gets you nine yards every time.  That kind of player has insane value in the league and it's well within what he is still capable of.

4th down game is on the line, Theilen is invaluable. I definitely don't think that is considered washed up. Toby Keith said it best, May not be good as I once was, but I'm as good once

[CRA]

35 minutes ago, jb2288 said:

4th down game is on the line, Theilen is invaluable. I definitely don't think that is considered washed up. Toby Keith said it best, May not be good as I once was, but I'm as good once

He should be 2003 Ricky Prohel.  

[frankw]

32 minutes ago, ECHornet said:

I’m not saying you’re wrong on what would be best for building up our young core, but I doubt Theilen returns if he wasn’t going to be an important part of our passing attack. He would’ve retired if he was going to be WR4 or less imo. 

I don't disagree for this season but my POV is that the coaches know he is on borrowed time and has at absolute most another season left in him after this. And while I am speculating I have to imagine that with the clear and orchestrated emphasis on getting younger across the roster the goal as the season progresses is to have the core of TMac XL Coker and one of our young TE's finish the season as the primary options on critical downs and in the red zone. That's not even mentioning the backfield and the pass catching ability there.

We can simultaneously like Adam Thielen and also remain keenly aware he is very much temporary and here moreso to guide our young receivers and pass the torch. Same with Renfro. And if we are serious about actually competing for playoffs it's going to take those younger receivers stepping into key roles for it to happen.

[frankw]

2 minutes ago, CRA said:

He should be 2003 Ricky Prohel.  

27 receptions 389 yards.

That checks out.

[CRA]

2 hours ago, shaqattaq said:

He is not a superstar anymore (if he ever was is a matter of opinion), BUT he is constantly open and catches anything that gets near him!! Definitely still above average even at his age. My only complaint was with the term "washed up".

Who the Hell knows what we are getting with Renfrow at this point, and Moore is a career-long average guy who admittedly played pretty danged good down the stretch last year. All 3 of these guys will be 30 this year, and only AT has put up good numbers in recent years. The other 2 are bubble guys IMO.

AT is a below average starter at this point with above average targets in an offense.  
 

[SOJA]

hamstring injuries suck so much

[jfra78]

It's in the best interest of all Panthers fans that AT is 4th or 5th in receptions.