Joe Person: Taylor Moton not likely to return next year, Curtis Samuel might also leave

[LinvilleGorge]

Just now, Basbear said:

I agree, just disagree that Miller or Burris are Jags/bad. How many times do you watch the games? BTW if they had a league wide draft with all players in the pool, Justin Hebert would go #2 at this time.  

They're bad. I've watched every game. Herbert would go #2 among all players in the NFL? LOL! No. Not sure what the point of that was anyway.

[SetfreexX]

16 minutes ago, stbugs said:

Incorrect on Norwell. Norwell’s last year was when Hurney took over during the summer (Gettleman did the FA/draft periods). Hurney absolutely was the GM during the year when we could have resigned Norwell before the season started. Just like Moton this year,  Norwell then had a great season (1st team All Pro) and got too expensive to resign.

Turner got extended by Gettleman, and he paid Kalil, the exit of Norwell is on DG. Hurnwy came in 2017 after all of that. That whole off-season, free agency, and draft period was done and set up by DG. 

[Basbear]

9 minutes ago, LinvilleGorge said:

They're bad. I've watched every game. Herbert would go #2 among all players in the NFL? LOL! No. Not sure what the point of that was anyway.

We just disagree.

 

Herbert was a different topic, hes been insanely great. Id pick him 2 overall, hes that impressive. 

[beo]

Who knew that signing a journeyman QB to 20 million when we already had a high end backup/bottom 25 starter on the roster in Allen was a bad idea? Or better yet, just keeping Cam for the last year of his deal so we wouldn't be locked into a contract that we can barely afford for a bad starting QB while simultaneously still having a low-end starter? 

It's like a comedy at this point, how does a team diving head first into a rebuild still have no cap space? Yes I know it's all dead cap and it's fuging pathetic.  It near takes talent to botch it this badly. Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in a while, and that's how Hurney found Rhule. We need to cut the cancer from this organization while we still can or at the very least demote that cancer to a lower role.  They're getting harder and harder to support with each passing day.

[stbugs]

36 minutes ago, SetfreexX said:

Turner got extended by Gettleman, and he paid Kalil, the exit of Norwell is on DG. Hurnwy came in 2017 after all of that. That whole off-season, free agency, and draft period was done and set up by DG. 

Norwell hadn’t started his last year, in which he became an all-pro, when Hurney was rehired. We have no clue if Gettleman would have resigned him or not. With how much money we through around in 2018-2020 and Ryan retiring, Turner getting traded and Matt getting released, we easily could have afforded Norwell. We haven’t even had discussions with Moton, our best OL the past couple years, so I’m not going to assume we didn’t ignore the Norwell situation until he had too good of a final year.

Hurney had no problem extending Olsen for 2 years and $17M right after letting Norwell go.

[MasterAwesome]

43 minutes ago, RoaringRiot said:

Obtaining subscribers by tricking them with clickbait titles is a terrible business model and one I know The Athletic doesn't use

To be honest I don't even know how we got on the subject of clickbait titles...that was never a part of my initial argument nor I think was anyone else really discussing that, but I still roped myself into discussing it for whatever reason, so my bad for that. 

The relevant discussion was supposed to be regarding whether Person writes any speculative pieces for The Athletic and whether this could have been one of those, which I didn't think was a contentious question; and that is exactly the picture that is painted in the article from the OP.

Whatever, I'm getting pretty bored of this topic anyways.  I feel like there are way more useful insights to gain from any inside sources than these niche cases of "Are we going to re-sign X player".  Like for example, the macro-level overarching question of who is actually running the show when it comes to roster management - Hurney? Rhule? Tepper? Shared input?  Obviously we're not entitled to your particular insider info or anything, so I'm not actually foolishly asking that you find this out for us, I'm just saying I find those types of questions to be way more interesting and pertinent.  But hell, if we're concerned about an individual extension this offseason, Hurney's is really the most impactful one that we should be discussing.

[mrcompletely11]

3 minutes ago, MasterAwesome said:

To be honest I don't even know how we got on the subject of clickbait titles...that was never a part of my initial argument nor I think was anyone else really discussing that, but I still roped myself into discussing it for whatever reason, so my bad for that. 

The relevant discussion was supposed to be regarding whether Person writes any speculative pieces for The Athletic and whether this could have been one of those, which I didn't think was a contentious question; and that is exactly the picture that is painted in the article from the OP.

Whatever, I'm getting pretty bored of this topic anyways.  I feel like there are way more useful insights to gain from any inside sources than these niche cases of "Are we going to re-sign X player".  Like for example, the macro-level overarching question of who is actually running the show when it comes to roster management - Hurney? Rhule? Tepper? Shared input?  Obviously we're not entitled to your particular insider info or anything, so I'm not actually foolishly asking that you find this out for us, I'm just saying I find those types of questions to be way more interesting and pertinent.  But hell, if we're concerned about an individual extension this offseason, Hurney's is really the most impactful one that we should be discussing.

It comes down to this.  Do you think he is just pulling things from thin air or is there something behind it?

[MHS831]

25 minutes ago, mrcompletely11 said:

It comes down to this.  Do you think he is just pulling things from thin air or is there something behind it?

No it does not---eliminate "pulling things from thin air"--that is your statement and it is biased and inaccurate--nobody else's opinion.  There is something behind it---but there is reason to question what is behind it and what it means.

Is the evidence that he is using substantial or circumstantial?  THAT is what it comes down to---no thin air. 

 

[MasterAwesome]

1 hour ago, mrcompletely11 said:

It comes down to this.  Do you think he is just pulling things from thin air or is there something behind it?

Click on the article in the OP and actually read the Panthers section. Based on how they summarize Person’s article, it sounds very much like speculation. For example, he notes that there haven’t been contract talks yet and that Moton is looking for $15 million or more per year or whatever...let’s say those are indeed actual facts. It’s still speculation to take those facts and then leap to stating “I don’t think the Panthers will sign him to an extension”. The article keeps saying “Person thinks” ...they go on to say Person thinks we may not extend Samuel either because another team might offer him more money. Like, okay...lol that just sounds like a boring post any random Huddler could have made.
 

Nothing in that article screams “insider info” to me...that’s all the same kind of stuff I’ve read on here by randos for years. You could say maybe that $15 million per year demand was “insider info” , but is it?? That seems kinda low and conflicts with other reports I’ve read...I’d consider that a damn steal if we sign him to a $15 mil per year contract.

[vorbis]

3 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Person's roster analysis gave a percentage of likelihood to return for each of next year's free agents.

Simplifying the results, it broke down kind of like this:

PROBABLY BACK

TE Chris Manhertz
LS JJ Jansen
DE Efe Obada
T Trent Scott
K Joey Slye

MAYBE BACK

RB Mike Davis
G John Miller
G Chris Reed
CB Rasul Douglas
WR Keith Kirkwood
WR Brandon Zylstra

PROBABLY NOT

T Taylor Moton
WR Curtis Samuel
FB Alex Armah
CB Corn Elder

MOST LIKELY GONE

T Russell Okung
WR Pharoh Cooper
G Michael Schofield
C Tyler Larsen
LB Tahir Whitehead
LB Adarius Taylor
LB Julian Stanford
DT Kawann Short
DE Stephen Weatherly

ok my understanding from previous speculation was that they would re-sign Okung and let Moton walk. this list has Okung as most likely gone. if they let both walk, there's at least a logic to it. continue the rebuild path, stock up on comp picks, and grow the team with rookie contracts. not the way I'd go personally, but at least I can see a through-line of actual thought.

[Pejorative Miscreant]

1 hour ago, mrcompletely11 said:

It comes down to this.  Do you think he is just pulling things from thin air or is there something behind it?

He’s doing math based on an assumed cap and probably doesn’t see it fitting.  No question Moton being resigned is good for the OL but it’s about the cash and the long term payment plan that results.  

[Camp Fodder]

23 hours ago, TreadmillTrackstar said:

He was definitely one I was hoping we could have somehow found a way to hang on to. Looked like he was developing more and more each year. Something makes me think he still hasn't leaked yet and if he keeps up the work he will look even better a year or two down the road.

We could have if we didn’t sign Shaq

[Jared Patterson]

Question: It seems all mock drafts and sources have us loving this QB class and taking a QB. So why would we get rid of our best OLineman?

That is what bad franchises do and get their QB's killed and mentally screwed. 

[Jared Patterson]

18 minutes ago, vorbis said:

ok my understanding from previous speculation was that they would re-sign Okung and let Moton walk. this list has Okung as most likely gone. if they let both walk, there's at least a logic to it. continue the rebuild path, stock up on comp picks, and grow the team with rookie contracts. not the way I'd go personally, but at least I can see a through-line of actual thought.

Id be terrified though to not have a tackle, especially if we indeed draft a QB.