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Looking at the QB class from a different perspective: Character


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8 hours ago, blueandblackattack said:

Wanted to riff off of @hepcat post but didn't want to derail it. I'll say upfront I don't have a horse in this race, I think any of the top 4 would fit. Realistically it'll probably be down to Fields or Lance even if we do trade up.

Ever since he beat Clemson and showed that toughness, I've wanted Justin Fields. But right now I'm leaning more towards Trey Lance. Here's why. Early yesterday I started doing my own video research, but from a different angle. Sometimes you can tell a lot about someone by what they project out to the world. How they walk, and especially how they talk.

So instead of highlight reels, I started watching their press conferences and interviews.

Take a look at these Justin Fields press conferences:

Slouching, disinterest, defensive, and trying to answer with the bare minimum of effort. But okay, sure, it was a loss.

After winning the Sugar Bowl:

A little more open, but still looks and talks like he's uncomfortable in the spotlight. No eye contact(even if its a vid conference), Doesn't smile, just stands like a statue. When asked football questions, just going with generic platitudes without going any deeper.

 

When I see these press conferences, you know who he reminds me of? Cam. Before you say it, this is not me hating on Cam, I appreciated everything he did for us, and that magical 2015 season. But at the end of the day, the teams emotional swings don't just come from the coaches, moreso it comes from player leadership, aka the quarterback. Cam ran very hot and cold with his emotions, and our team echoed that in our play. When he stopped trying in a game, they stopped trying. When he's feeling good, they're playing harder.

 

Now take a look at a Patrick Mahomes press conference from college:

Right off the bat he comes off as comfortable in his own skin, confident, eye contact, is able to talk in complete sentences and at length about football while pivoting to anecdotes without being prompted. Even keeled that seems like someone you can rely on when things get tough.

 

What about someone Fitts helped draft:

Even keeled, able to communicate clearly, comfortable in his own skin.

You can look up more, but their attitude and presence is consistent.

Bottom line: they sound and act like pro's before they've even been in the NFL.

 

Now look at Trey Lance (at the 8:00 mark):

Even keeled, comfortable in his own skin, communicates clearly and able to riff off anecdotes and details without being prompted.

 

Looks familiar yet? He looks and sounds pro ready. Like the kindof leader that will stay even keeled when the games on the line and things arent going your way. Like someone the team will be able to feed off that energy and be able to fight back without letting the lows get too low, like we used to do.

 

So for me, I think a year behind Teddy, like Alex Smith and Mahomes, or Matt Flynn and Wilson, and this guy could be something. He seems ready upstairs.

And based on Fields press conferences, I'm not sure he's that guy, or can become that guy. Being a QB is more than just statistics, it's about being a pro, win or lose.

Anyway, just my 2 cents and just thought it was interesting to share.

Russell Wilson didn’t sit at all behind Flynn. Other then that I agree with your post and thanks for putting the time into this. 

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35 minutes ago, Newbie said:

Russell Wilson didn’t sit at all behind Flynn. Other then that I agree with your post and thanks for putting the time into this. 

True, I just meant as an example that they all were meant to sit and learn behind these other quarterbacks. They signed Matt Flynn for a huge contract because they thought he was gonna be the starter, who knew Russell would be who he was?

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Matt Rhule has made clear that the Panthers are going to be looking at players' character when it comes to every position.

I'd imagine even more so at quarterback given the leadership that position entails.

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1 hour ago, blueandblackattack said:

That's fair, I meant more in terms of showing signs of leadership and confidence was what I was focusing on. Definitely not character.

And to be fair, I did say in the beginning that I had no horse in this race and would be happy with any of the top 4. Only saying that after watching their press conferences, I'm now leaning more towards Trey Lance. Who's to say Fields isn't the guy, but it's just my impression right now.

Even watching Fields on the sidelines, in the "huddle", I just thought he was more stoic or introverted. But now idk, there is something to be said about charisma and being able to rally the troops when the game is on the line at halftime, and to me he doesn't give me that impression.

One thing that is important is non verbal signals. No matter what you say, if you have an appearance of being disinterested just through your mannerisms and non verbal actions, it carries weight. 

That's one of the things that I had a hard time with about the way Cam was dressed in his pressers most of the time. It was hard to listen to what he said because the rest of his appearance was so loud.

I could really care less about what he wore on a daily basis and if he held the locker room. When other guys are on the outside looking in, and are making decisions about whether or not to possibly come to this team, stuff like how you handle yourself at a presser can play a role. 

I've always been a believer that leadership is more about what you dont say than what you do. 

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2 hours ago, blueandblackattack said:

That's fair, I should've replaced Character with Leadership.

That still seems a bit dubious to me, though better. Again, being "on" for the camera or press can be a good thing, but it can also be deceptive. Plenty of athletes can turn it on for the public but they're assholes irl. I get what you're trying to do, but it's a hard thing to measure without being able to at least interview the prospects yourself. Good effort, though.

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9 hours ago, Pup McBarky said:

Not sure what interview performances have to do with character, tbh. Cam did some really bad interviews but he's a person of high character. Some people just aren't very comfortable in front of the camera or talking to people. One fairly successful NFL coach comes to mind. Lives in New England.

Perhaps not character but businesses do look for emotional intelligence, the ability to communicate effectively, poise under duress, etc., all things that can be revealed when watching a prospective employee speaking publicly.  They are valid 'tells' and part of the overall evaluation process.  Will not make up for a limp arm or lousy wonderlic test.

Edited by bythenbrs
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7 minutes ago, bythenbrs said:

Perhaps not character but businesses do look for emotional intelligence, the ability to communicate effectively, poise under duress, etc., all things that can be revealed when watching a prospective employee speaking publicly.  They are valid 'tells' and part of the overall evaluation process.  Will not make up for a limp arm or lousy wonderlic test.

Yeah, that's valid. 

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3 hours ago, JawnyBlaze said:

So the best thing to ever happen to this organization and only reason we had any success at all in the past ten years is what you choose to use as a negative example? 👀 I like a QB who can energize a team, this “even keeled” stuff is what you get with a Teddy.  Rogers, Brady, Favre, Manning, Brees, they all got fired up and emotional in games. Sure there are examples of good QBs who don’t, like Russell Wilson, but I’d rather have a leader like the previous examples. Not trying to poo on the OP too much, I just disagree. Don’t think interviews have anything to do with game performance. 

I've never understood this mindset. 

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8 hours ago, kungfoodude said:

I have never heard that. That would make sense if that were the case.

Watch him on QB1 and then his interviews from around the Heisman push last season with Chase Young. He came across as very shy and stuttered pretty frequently. You can tell it’s something he recognizes because he was a lot better with it this season when doing zoom interviews. 

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22 minutes ago, Varking said:

Watch him on QB1 and then his interviews from around the Heisman push last season with Chase Young. He came across as very shy and stuttered pretty frequently. You can tell it’s something he recognizes because he was a lot better with it this season when doing zoom interviews. 

Is he a confirmed to be a guy that grew up with a stutter?

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9. Carolina Panthers – Trey Lance, QB, North Dakota State

Lance is an unprecedented evaluation because of his meager experience with all 17 of his collegiate starts coming vs. FCS opponents. But his talent is too enticing for him to fall too far and his teammates call him the hardest worker in the program, something that will certainly appeal to Matt Rhule. 

https://theathletic.com/2287723/2020/12/28/nfl-mock-draft-top-10-update/

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8 hours ago, Zod said:

I was more defending Fields. Most people are not good at public speaking. To assume they lack character as a result probably isn't wise. 

It’s been the downfall of human kind since the dawn of man. It’s why cunning criminals get lesser sentences and on the flip side judges get their position, serial killers are able lure victims, it’s why an employer looks for a shitty working extrovert instead of a hardworking introvert, it’s why all politicians are essentially garbage but no one votes for the person they don’t like watching and hearing speak - and that’s not just politics.

Imagine there being a population of people who can do things much better but they lack this appeal/skills. It exists, it’s reality. It’s basically human stupidity to judge on such a meaningless detail and it’s sad - not that it’s not a skill, it is, that shouldn’t be overlooked. But it’s sad because it’s placed above ability.

I could go on and on but basically extroverts and seemingly open trusting people make lazy, stupid people feel good and they’ll always be the majority. 

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2 hours ago, bythenbrs said:

Perhaps not character but businesses do look for emotional intelligence, the ability to communicate effectively, poise under duress, etc., all things that can be revealed when watching a prospective employee speaking publicly.  They are valid 'tells' and part of the overall evaluation process.  Will not make up for a limp arm or lousy wonderlic test.

That’s social intelligence. There is a correlation between high social intelligence and low emotional intelligence. Not to say everyone is the same but there are plenty of examples and research on it. And no it can’t be revealed by public speaking.

Public speaking reveals how effective someone is at public speaking, little else.

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