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Outside opinions on the Panthers draft plans

Mr. Scot

By Mr. Scot,
in Carolina Panthers

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joemac Grand Master

joemac

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Sgt Schultz said:

I remember that game well.  It was like Shanahan decided to leave him out there until the ambulance came and got him. 

While I am not for owners meddling, even I would have called down to the sidelines at some point and told Shanahan to either get RG3 off the field or I was coming down immediately to get him off the field.

If I remember right, it was the age-old excuse "he didn't tell me he was too hurt to continue."

Which is ridiculous, as anybody who has ever been a good athlete at any sort of high level knows they will almost never tell their coach they are too hurt to play.  I remember playing baseball with my left arm damn near about to fall off, and I was like "Nah, im good coach". 

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LinvilleGorge Grand Master

LinvilleGorge

Posted
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26 minutes ago, Sgt Schultz said:

I remember that game well.  It was like Shanahan decided to leave him out there until the ambulance came and got him. 

While I am not for owners meddling, even I would have called down to the sidelines at some point and told Shanahan to either get RG3 off the field or I was coming down immediately to get him off the field.

If I remember right, it was the age-old excuse "he didn't tell me he was too hurt to continue."

Yeah, I honestly didn't much care for RG3 but that was hard to watch. I legit felt bad for him.

 

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chbright Veteran

chbright

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2 hours ago, LinvilleGorge said:

Who knows how RG3 may have ended up had Shanahan not left him out there on one leg to get his knee obliterated.

That was malpractice. Like no way shanahan should ever get another job. That BS forever tarnished his Denver runs. RG3 with a line and letting him heal likely is in the top 4 QB I'm the league talk today...... Damn you shanahan for wasting such a talent.makes Ron and co look like geniuses with Cam.

 

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

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3 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

At this point I've seen Willis compared to a dozen or more pro quarterbacks, and to a man they were all infinitely more successful against a higher level of competition than anything Willis saw.

Basically people just project whoever they want to see him as (regardless of whether there's any real validity to it).

Josh Allen was not. I know they aren’t similar, but his stats were worse at Wyoming…

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, mrcompletely11 said:

I wish people would understand that Allen Is nowhere close to the norm in the nfl.   So much had to go right for him to get where he is.  

When we talk about “raw” prospects with huge upside, his name is going to come up. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that. He is THE definition of a QB who had all the tools physically and was groomed into success. Do we have the tools/staff to do that with Willis? I doubt it, but that is what teams are going for when they see him. It’s a copycat league. Most franchises are confident in their staff’s ability, some confident to a fault…

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, ForJimmy said:

When we talk about “raw” prospects with huge upside, his name is going to come up. I don’t know why you can’t grasp that. He is THE definition of a QB who had all the tools physically and was groomed into success. Do we have the tools/staff to do that with Willis? I doubt it, but that is what teams are going for when they see him. It’s a copycat league. Most franchises are confident in their staff’s ability, some confident to a fault…

Quoting the wise old sage, Benny Hill...

They thought that it could not be done
Some even said they knew it
But he faced what they said could not be done...
And he couldn't bloody do it

The Panthers had success with and undersized, overaged linebacker in Sam Mills. But as much respect as I have for Sam, that's not a path I'd recommend pursuing again.

I've seen a lot of teams tell themselves that they could do a certain thing because they've seen someone else do it, and more often than not they're wrong.

It's always great when somebody does achieve something difficult or unusual, but there's generally a reason why it's looked at that way.

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    • LinvilleGorge
      2027: Sharing my thoughts on the cap without a lotta research

      By LinvilleGorge · Posted

      No. Physical tools alone aren't enough. There are plenty of examples of draft busts to support that. Aost all of them had the physical tools and that wasn't enough. But Bryce is a perfect example of the opposite. Absolutely elite intangibles aren't enough either. If you simply don't have the physical abilities all the football intelligence and work ethic in the world won't be enough to overcome it. Just look to the sidelines every Sunday. We call those people "coaches".
    • SmokinwithWilly
      2027: Sharing my thoughts on the cap without a lotta research

      By SmokinwithWilly · Posted

      As much as I despise Billy B, his philosophy on QBs is how I would approach things if I were a GM. You always keep looking for your next starter.  He has Bledsoe, who got injured and his backup ended up being the GOAT. Even while he had that going, he kept getting his next guy and developing them. When Brady got hurt, Cassel stepped in and went 11-5 and they missed the wild card by dumb luck. Who knows how far they would have gone if they had gotten in. Jimmy Gs career started in NE. There were others, but he always kept looking.  You can't be afraid to keep looking for your next starter, but it looks like we're afraid to look for more than a marginal one. If you're going to offer a $25m contract with incentives, that screams marginal QB. It also screams you're just a transition until we find our guy. After a 10 or 11 win season, he's not accepting that offer. And then you're in a Daniel Jones situation. Do you pay for a year of success and pray it wasn't a one year wonder?  To this point, Bryce has really produced nothing, yet for whatever reason, our FO has not even sniffed at the idea that we need a real QB room with real QBs. Dalton was never starter potential, Plummer was a joke. KP certainly isn't, neither is Grier.  Our approach to the QB room needs to be one of strength not fear. Bring in guys who can compete or who you think can compete. This is THE elite position, in an elite sport, paid premium salary, where production matters. Either you produce or you can lose your job. It's not mean, it's just the reality of the position.  And I'm really just tired of our candy ass approach to it. 
    • LinvilleGorge
      2027: Sharing my thoughts on the cap without a lotta research

      By LinvilleGorge · Posted

      If you plug Bryce onto the Pro Bowl roster you might have a chance to compete for a SB. If he's surrounded by top tier talent with a top tier defense on the other side, a field flipping punter, and a kicker good from 60+ you might have a chance. But that means you basically have to recreate Saban's Bama in the NFL and that's impossible... and Bryce couldn't win a championship in that environment either. What the Panthers didn't realize when they got so obsessed with his "PG mentality" was that what they were looking st was a "barely checks the box PG". The basketball equivalent of Bryce would be an undersized PG with marginal athleticism who can make the basic plays but adds nothing to the team in terms of elevating the overall team. Not a great shooter, not a great defender, not a great driver. Just a guy who can basically get you into the offense and be a matador on defense. Basically a placeholder while you look to upgrade the PG position. 
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