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Panthers Training Camp - Monday

Zod

By Zod,
in Carolina Panthers

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Jared Patterson said:

Thats not true. They don't want to go to teams that are ran poorly. Khan and Baalke are as bad as it gets. If you have a young QB to build around and a nice city like Charlotte you can get players on decent salaries. Stafford and Russ wanted nothing to do w Matt Rhule and based on reports coming out of Cleveland players did not like playing with Mayfield, so we def cant get anyone between Mayfield and Rhule. 

In summary Baker is terrible (because no one wanted him), but he is going to play too good and ruin our draft position.  We also can't extend him to a contract (even though he sucks) because our cap is terrible.  Our model should have been the "Tank for Trevor" one the Jags did and you would have also spent "triple" the amount of money they did on FAs, but they overspent in your opinion and are over the cap next year.  

-Got it.  Makes complete sense. 

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RJK Grand Master

RJK

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, TrevorLaurenceTime22 said:

Lol I'm not close to as bad as some here... I'm cautiously optimistic about this season. 

This year will be telling. Roster looks decent. The NFC is weak overall. 8-9/9-8 prob gets a wildcard spot. If they don’t make the playoffs it’ll be because they were ravaged by injuries or Rhule proved himself to be inept.

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TrevorLaurenceTime22 Grand Master

TrevorLaurenceTime22

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17 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

Cap space???  Whatever shall we do???  Cap is very fluid and pivoting the argument towards how we are handling our cap space vs how terrible Baker is, is a nice deflection.  

We are towards the top this year with rollover cap.  Next year looks terrible, but check out the Jags only one spot higher than us with a QB on the rookie scale.  You said you would have spent MORE money if you ran that team right???  Then in 2024 we are back in the upper middle of the salary cap.  I am curious how you are going to TRIPLE the amount of money for the Jags to build a team around Trevor when they have $7.5 million (less then we do) this year and are already over the cap next year??

https://overthecap.com/salary-cap-space

The Caps going up big time before then with the new TV deal.... although I will admit we blew a lot of cap space the last few years we could have used next season on an insane FA class.

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frankw Grand Master

frankw

Posted
Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Jared Patterson said:

If Baker was so good we wouldn't have been the only team interested/desperate enough to trade for him. Also- his old team literally begged and paid us to get rid of him. I know he is slightly better than Darnold and shouldn't be the starter, but he is no where near a franchise QB. 

He's here he's better than Darnold and yes that isn't really saying much but if he doesn't work out it's back to the draft probably. No sense rehashing these complaints not for how much he is making compared to Sam.

Edited by frankw
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Jackie Lee Grand Master

Jackie Lee

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12 minutes ago, ForJimmy said:

In summary Baker is terrible (because no one wanted him), but he is going to play too good and ruin our draft position.  We also can't extend him to a contract (even though he sucks) because our cap is terrible.  Our model should have been the "Tank for Trevor" one the Jags did and you would have also spent "triple" the amount of money they did on FAs, but they overspent in your opinion and are over the cap next year.  

-Got it.  Makes complete sense. 

It is super dumb that we're over the cap next year considering how young our roster is and the guys getting paid big bucks. That aside Watsons cap hit is like $9M this year through allocating a ton of his salary to bonus money. If Baker is their guy his cap hit could be $5-7M next year. We definitely can't afford the $30M franchise tag so that kinda sucks in making it an all or nothing decision

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ForJimmy Grand Master

ForJimmy

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Jackie Lee said:

It is super dumb that we're over the cap next year considering how young our roster is and the guys getting paid big bucks. That aside Watsons cap hit is like $9M this year through allocating a ton of his salary to bonus money. If Baker is their guy his cap hit could be $5-7M next year. We definitely can't afford the $30M franchise tag so that kinda sucks in making it an all or nothing decision

We have never been good at salary cap management unfortunately….

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TrevorLaurenceTime22 Grand Master

TrevorLaurenceTime22

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29 minutes ago, frankw said:

He's here he's better than Darnold and yes that isn't really saying much but if he doesn't work out it's back to the draft probably. No sense rehashing these complaints not for how much he is making compared to Sam.

Baker is at least a starting quality QB in the NFL.... Darnold isn't even a mid level back up.

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TrevorLaurenceTime22 Grand Master

TrevorLaurenceTime22

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11 minutes ago, CarolinaRideorDie said:

Intangibles in a QB matter. There is a reason why Mayfield was drafted #1 overall over Darnold. You just see teammates gravitate towards Mayfield way more than Darnold has ever did in his 2 years here. Darnold has the physical tools be play QB but he doesn't have the leadership for what the position commands. 

He also can't look off his reads and generally goes to his first.... Baker gets through his and comes back.... His mistakes come from playing aggressively I'll take that over passive and staring down WRs.

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Steelo Senpai Collaborator

Steelo Senpai

Posted
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3 hours ago, ForJimmy said:

I mean he is complaining about him getting a screen passed batted down...  I be he is an OSU fan that cried a single tear when Baker planted that flag on his teams' logo at midfield.  

Hey now. Some of us OSU fans have to swallow their pride and root for their new QB 1 to succeed 😅😅

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Jared Patterson Mentor

Jared Patterson

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Mr. Scot said:

Wouldn't call you dumb, but I would tell you I think you're wrong.

Mayfield has actually been nothing but a model citizen so far. And while it's true nobody wanted him at his prior cap figure (including us) you'd likely have seen several teams make an offer had he been outright released.

(and keep in mind, I say all this as someone who was not a fan of trading for him)

Just tired of this regime trying to do the same thing every year with reclamation projects at QB and thinking something will change... I really hope Corral can be the guy. Besides the QB position and the coach; I think we are a very young and talented team. 

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Mr. Scot Grand Master

Mr. Scot

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Jared Patterson said:

Just tired of this regime trying to do the same thing every year with reclamation projects at QB and thinking something will change... I really hope Corral can be the guy. Besides the QB position and the coach; I think we are a very young and talented team. 

I get it, but Baker is objectively the best QB we've had in a while.

Heck, even if he doesn't work out, it's just a one year deal for minimal money.

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Jared Patterson Mentor

Jared Patterson

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18 minutes ago, stbugs said:

I agree but I think the Baker love has transcended now because a) he’s not Darnold and b) people hate Rhule so much that they actually think he’s trying to sabotage Baker to ensure Sam starts. The second one is comical too because Rhule is on the hot seat and Sam can do nothing for that.

I know Baker is better than Sam thus should start and I know in a much maligned NFC with an extra WC that we could sneak into the playoffs. I also think that Baker isn’t a guy who can win us the SB and I also know we are paper thin where a couple key injuries or a rash of middling injuries could put us in contention for the top pick. We aren’t a deep and stocked team with an elite QB yet.

Agreed. And I trust your cap knowledge. Is the spotrac 2023 data accounting our rollover money from this year? Why are we in such a bad cap position next year w/o a QB?

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