Quarterbacks win championships

[Wundrbread33]

1 hour ago, CRA said:

 

I mean, his OL didn't just fail him.  They got comically thin because of injury.  And Mahomes was still a magician that game too.   He would perform some miracle and then folks would drop the ball.   It was a complete implosion all around him. 

That’s what I’m saying. Perhaps text is a bad way to talk. 
 

Football is too much of a team game for “quarterbacks win championships” to be anything but a simple and annoying thing to just say.

[outlaw4]

1 hour ago, CRA said:

It's not easy.  I don't think people are acting like it is easy.....they want the Panthers to start swinging. 

this whole, grab and a reject and hope one falls into your lap approach doesn't suit a lot of people.  We passed the last time a high prospect QB fell in our laps on top of that.  So even when you get that rare solar eclipse, we haven't taken advantage of it.  

Nothing can be done about past decisions. All we can do is take our shots going forward. Just that the potential swings this offseason are not great and extremely expensive either from a cap standpoint or draft picks. Again, the one advantage we haven't had before is a staff more capable of drafting a guy that - years later - people will say was a steal because we were able to identify that QB who just needed to be fully developed and we were able to do it. If I had to bet money, this is what we will do and worst case, we try again next year with a much better roster to where we can afford to give up a lot more.

[Bear Hands]

26 minutes ago, SCO96 said:

Outside of JC Horn, Brian Burns, and possibly the surprise player of the year Frankie Luvu (100+ tackles, 7 sacks, and 1 INT) what big pieces would you say are in place?

Brown was arguably the most improved player on the team and became the true anchor of the defense. Horn & Jackson are both here long term.  Chinn is in tact.  Luvu is in place.  Woods is still here.  Burns likely to be re-signed.  We spent the entire 2020 draft on defense and min 3 guys in the last 2.  

Seems like the type of picks we'd be mortgaging for a QB that could be spent on defense aren't historically amounting to much by the standards of those wanting to keep picking defense.

31 minutes ago, SCO96 said:

That's a big "IF". Bryce probably weighs less than most of us on this board and could get broken in half in the NFL. CJ Stroud comes from a OHIO STATE program that has NEVER produced a good pro QB the last 65 years. Yet, people feel that we need to mortgage our draft capital b/c these two "might be the guy"  We can likely find a competent QB just as good as either at #9. It' like some are saying Frank Reich, McCown, and whoever we hire at OC can't win next year if we don't get Stroud or Young. A lot of us just don't see it that way. 

Ah, there it is.  But, yes, that's the whole point. People think they could be the guy.  And if the staff does, you're the one needing to do some reconciling here with that predisposition (OSU omen and the Young-size concern). 

No one knows for sure, you either take the risk or just risk being stuck in an even worse spot next year with even less impactful pick placement.  Both risks, one has clear, tangental reward with a QB and future.  The other is just putting it off yet again, with the hope of a shinier one the following year.       

So if we don't, I agree, I'm actually confident this growing staff can win some with another guy--who is not at all our future.  It's not Heinicke, Jimmy G, Darnold, none of them are our realistically our future. 

So we're settling (again) with a stopgap, but better defense, you're potentially in an even worse spot, picking 16-22ish next year stuck in a Tannehill-hellscape scenario, we're stepping into even worse sh*t than this year, the year before, and the year before that.  

Not to mention, Maye and/or Ewers aren't even sure things to declare. And I don't even want to start on the potential 24' class yet.  That's a whole other thing to unravel in itself with the assumptions being made about it.  

[beckersteen]

Last night was decided by a defensive TD and a great punt return. 

[Jay Roosevelt]

I have no interest in Carr or Lamar. DRAFT A QB!!!

[AggieLean]

4 hours ago, joemac said:

If we do get Carr there is no way in hell that we draft a QB at 9.  I could see a LB, DE or even WR in that scenario. 

Carr would throw a fit if the new team he goes to drafts a QB early. He is going to go to a team that is willing to fully commit to him. All this, let’s sign Carr then draft a QB isn’t realistic at all. 

[Jay Roosevelt]

I love how some folks are so worried about "mortgaging the future" by giving up draft capital to trade up for a QB but don't seem to realize that without a QB no amount of draft capital means a damn thing. A team full of drafted Pro Bowlers without a QB IS a waste of draft capital because without one the team has no future.

It's entirely possible trading up for a QB could backfire on us, but that's the way it goes. We have to at least TRY to get our guy. What's the alternative? Trotting out other team's table scraps year after year?

Outside of getting insanely lucky and hitting on a Jalen Hurts outside of round 1 that's what we're going to be stuck with if we don't at least take our shot at finding a franchise QB.

[SmokinwithWilly]

6 minutes ago, Jay Roosevelt said:

I love how some folks are so worried about "mortgaging the future" by giving up draft capital to trade up for a QB but don't seem to realize that without a QB no amount of draft capital means a damn thing. A team full of drafted Pro Bowlers without a QB IS a waste of draft capital because without one the team has no future.

It's entirely possible trading up for a QB could backfire on us, but that's the way it goes. We have to at least TRY to get our guy. What's the alternative? Trotting out other team's table scraps year after year?

Outside of getting insanely lucky and hitting on a Jalen Hurts outside of round 1 that's what we're going to be stuck with if we don't at least take our shot at finding a franchise QB.

I don't mind taking a shot. I minded when we had Ron and Captain DumbAss as HC, neither of whom had any idea about running an offense or how to use a QB. I'm a little less worried now that we have some offensive grown ups in the building.

[rayzor]

3 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

I don't mind taking a shot. I minded when we had Ron and Captain DumbAss as HC, neither of whom had any idea about running an offense or how to use a QB. I'm a little less worried now that we have some offensive grown ups in the building.

We've got guys whose judgement I trust. I'm just along for the ride now. Whatever they decide, I've got faith they know what they're doing. 

I'd like for them to draft one of my three favorites, Young, Stroud, or AR, but if the draft Levis or pick up someone like Carr....I can deal with it. We could trade for Lamar (which is kind of unnecessary, imo) and I'd be ok with that. 

[SmokinwithWilly]

Just now, rayzor said:

We've got guys whose judgement I trust. I'm just along for the ride now. Whatever they decide, I've got faith they know what they're doing. 

I'd like for them to draft one of my three favorites, Young, Stroud, or AR, but if the draft Levis or pick up someone like Carr....I can deal with it. We could trade for Lamar (which is kind of unnecessary, imo) and I'd be ok with that. 

I have confidence we now have the ability to develop a QB. Cam was a very good QB for us, but his development didn't really progress much here. Watching Mahomes, it makes me wonder what Cam could have become under a guy like Reid. Having the ability to recognize, understand, and develop a QB is just as important as the talent level IMO. 

[Wundrbread33]

19 minutes ago, Jay Roosevelt said:

I love how some folks are so worried about "mortgaging the future" by giving up draft capital to trade up for a QB but don't seem to realize that without a QB no amount of draft capital means a damn thing. A team full of drafted Pro Bowlers without a QB IS a waste of draft capital because without one the team has no future.

It's entirely possible trading up for a QB could backfire on us, but that's the way it goes. We have to at least TRY to get our guy. What's the alternative? Trotting out other team's table scraps year after year?

Outside of getting insanely lucky and hitting on a Jalen Hurts outside of round 1 that's what we're going to be stuck with if we don't at least take our shot at finding a franchise QB.

Meanwhile, the hated Sam Darnold was 4-2 as a starter this year because it’s a team sport. 
 

I’d love a Mahomes on the team, but there’s many ways to make a football omelet. 
 

Keep adding talent. Make the team better. And if a QB you love is there at 5-8, then you can trade up and not get bent over while doing so. 

[SCO96]

3 minutes ago, SmokinwithWilly said:

I have confidence we now have the ability to develop a QB. Cam was a very good QB for us, but his development didn't really progress much here. Watching Mahomes, it makes me wonder what Cam could have become under a guy like Reid. Having the ability to recognize, understand, and develop a QB is just as important as the talent level IMO. 

Coaching really MATTERS in the NFL. Nick Foles didn't beat Tom Brady in a Super Bowl because he was a better QB. He beat him because his coach, Doug Pederson, outcoached Bill Belichick on Super Bowl Sunday.

Last night Pat Mahomes threw 2 TD's in the red-zone to wide open targets who just walked in for the TD. . Plays were designed and called at the right time to make that happen. That's a sign great coaching.

I expect to see that type of creativity with Frank Reich next season. I believe he can take a 1st round QB drafted outside the top 5, or a high 2nd rounder, and develop him into a legit starter.

[Growl]

the eagles scored more points than any super bowl loser ever has and you’ve still got people who are like “defense changed the game! Look at that one play! I want a STUD LINEBACKER!” 
 

The game isn’t structured to reward defensive teams or teams that chew clock and pound rocks or whatever other blasé cliche you’re holding onto so tightly 

there’s one path to sustained success

lots of passing, big name free agent acquisitions, blockbuster trades

those are the teams playing in the super bowl.

 

[heel31ok]

19 hours ago, Sean Payton's Vicodin said:

Accept it, or live in the past coping.

Lol...football isnt life 

Ray Lewis and crew won a championship

So I beg to Dilfer.