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Bryce defenders, please give me a reason why you're still hopeful


TN05
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3 minutes ago, Cullenator said:

People a lot smarter about football and talent evaluation than I am (or than the collective mind of the Huddle)

If every NFL executive and NFL scout were infallible and all knowing light-years beyond the average fan then half of the teams in the league wouldn't be changing GM's and scouts on a frequent basis.

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14 minutes ago, Ricky Spanish said:

It's his rookie year, he throws guys open and with anticipation often, he's tough for such a little fella, and he isn't the only thing that looks bad about our offense considering the line can't block, the running game is non-existent, the WRs can't get open and the scheme we are running is doing nothing to account for all of the above mentioned issues.

I'd have more confidence in Bryce's future if we cleaned house and hired a young up and coming offensive mind (like Ben Johnson from Det or someone similar) and fired Fitt, but if we keep this staff and that FO together after this season then I will have zero expectations that things will get better.

I’m thinking he throws receivers open because he doesn’t have the velocity to do anything else.  I fear his deep routes (if we can see some) will only work with perfect timing.  It’s great he is able to throw with anticipation, but when that isn’t an option you’re fuged.

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24 minutes ago, Ricky Spanish said:

It's his rookie year, he throws guys open and with anticipation often, he's tough for such a little fella, and he isn't the only thing that looks bad about our offense considering the line can't block, the running game is non-existent, the WRs can't get open and the scheme we are running is doing nothing to account for all of the above mentioned issues.

I'd have more confidence in Bryce's future if we cleaned house and hired a young up and coming offensive mind (like Ben Johnson from Det or someone similar) and fired Fitt, but if we keep this staff and that FO together after this season then I will have zero expectations that things will get better.

No up and coming OC / HC is hitching their wagon to Young.

Edited by OldhamA
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Hopeful in terms of what? 

I'm hopeful that he can still be a starting QB in this league - I believe you can win with him in the Russell Wilson sense, with a dominant D and powerful run game. 

I'm no longer hopeful that he can be worth what we paid. That he can be elite. I'm no longer hopeful that we got the best QB in this draft. 

With better (not great, just better) weapons, Bryce would look a lot better. You don't have to fix the line, just give him a Jamaar Chase, heck give him a Higgins, and we'd all feel better about him, but I'm no longer hopeful that he can be an elite, MVP caliber type. 

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I‘m not a believer but if you’re paying me to make a case for him:

1. He has no real run game threat to take pressure off and open up the defense

2. His receivers lack speed, skill or both and are easy to cover and defend thus giving him little opportunity to make big plays

3. His head coach lacks creativity and the ability to create an effective game plan

4. We have the worst GM in the league by a fairly large margin and a roster that missing depth or actual NFL starters at key positions.

5. Until today he’s been fairly accurate and managed to not actually lose the game while also not doing enough to win it.

6. He’s a rookie.

That’s all I got. The list of negatives is longer.

Edited by BIGH2001
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19 minutes ago, Cullenator said:

People a lot smarter about football and talent evaluation than I am (or than the collective mind of the Huddle) havent given up on him yet so Im following their lead

Where are these smart talent evaluators?

Surely you don't mean in Charlotte? Need I remind you how bad our recent Drafts have been?

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24 minutes ago, Ricky Spanish said:

It's his rookie year, he throws guys open and with anticipation often, he's tough for such a little fella, and he isn't the only thing that looks bad about our offense considering the line can't block, the running game is non-existent, the WRs can't get open and the scheme we are running is doing nothing to account for all of the above mentioned issues.

I'd have more confidence in Bryce's future if we cleaned house and hired a young up and coming offensive mind (like Ben Johnson from Det or someone similar) and fired Fitt, but if we keep this staff and that FO together after this season then I will have zero expectations that things will get better.

 

This is the only serious take (I stopped reading the thread because it's that good). 

 

If you don't think this, you're hurt over not having the shiny rookie QB of this draft in Stroud (I am too but sheesh people) or you are too drunk to be reasonable tonight. 

We're in the suck as a team. Nobody is going to see a well reasoned response as to why we have hope in a rookie who is struggling currently. All I can say is Tua. That's what we have to hope for out of Bryce. To track the way Tua did, let his game feel and decision making lead him where his physical tools lack. But to do that....we need weapons like Tua has.

Fitt is our issue. Until he is gone this team is in the gutter.

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10 minutes ago, WelshPanther said:

Tua. That’s all I’ve got at this point. Bryce is playing on what maybe the worst constructed roster ever put together (especially given the IR issues). Maybe he would be decent on a reasonable team with good coaching.

Still has a noodle arm though

I think Tua holds that offence back. 

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really tough seeing CJ Stroud out there setting NFL records without an all star staff and win now FA adds. 470 yards and 5 TDs today.   CJ might not be consistent yet but the rookie 100000% shows he has special to him.  
 

Bryce was always a high floor low ceiling option. Turns out his floor wasn’t as high as we thought 

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5 minutes ago, emhoward said:

Hopeful in terms of what? 

I'm hopeful that he can still be a starting QB in this league - I believe you can win with him in the Russell Wilson sense, with a dominant D and powerful run game. 

I'm no longer hopeful that he can be worth what we paid. That he can be elite. I'm no longer hopeful that we got the best QB in this draft. 

With better (not great, just better) weapons, Bryce would look a lot better. You don't have to fix the line, just give him a Jamaar Chase, heck give him a Higgins, and we'd all feel better about him, but I'm no longer hopeful that he can be an elite, MVP caliber type. 

He is not a franchise QB.....period

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    • In before: "XL sucks, there is no hope." "As long as we have Bryce, none of this matters." My response: "It's X, not XL...we're not discussing apparel sizes, or we'd have to consider XS."  
    • Alain Pierre provides some food for thought on Last Word On Sports regarding Xavier Legette, and his article, though specifically on X, kind of puts me in the mind of QBs being overdrafted and put into situations that they're not prepared for, some ultimately failing due to drafting missteps by front offices who don't necessarily view prospective players within the contextual importance that situations demand.  At this point, Legette looks like a failure in reference to expectations, of not only what a consistently productive NFL receiver looks like, but a first round pick (which he obviously should never have been). But the story on X isn't necessarily completely over. Damn. I seem to be experiencing deja vu...It wasn't X's fault that he was overdrafted, that was a choice by an FO that obviously downplayed actual realized skill vs outstanding measurables and upside. Sure, the FO was impressed by X's one-year feats during his senior season at South Carolina, but it was the NFL god, RAS (a.k.a. Raw Athletic Score), that had Dave Canales's and Dan Morgan's jaws dropping in amazement at the sight of X running around in underwear at the Combine...   "At 6-foot-3 and over 220 pounds, Legette brought rare athletic upside to the position. His breakout season at South Carolina showed flashes of dominance that NFL teams dream of. Projecting forward, many scouts compared his physical profile to D.K. Metcalf, and the Panthers clearly believed they could develop him into a true wide receiver 1 over time. The issue was never his talent. The issue was the timeline. Just a few picks later, the Chargers selected Ladd McConkey, a receiver who may have lacked Xavier Legette’s physical ceiling but entered the league far more technically refined. McConkey immediately showed advanced route discipline, leverage awareness, good pacing, and separation ability.  Bryce Young’s game has always depended on timing and anticipation. His best football at Alabama came with receivers capable of winning through precision rather than pure athleticism. Jameson Williams and John Metchie III were excellent route runners and were able to get drafted in 2022. McConkey naturally fit that style of play. Legette, meanwhile, needed significant development in the exact areas where Bryce Young needed help. The Panthers drafted traits when Bryce Young needed reliability."   Yes, the FO was guilty. The good thing is that the execs appear to be improving. Some of that may be attributed to the hiring of Eric Eager (who was hired right after the Xavier Legette draft). Eager seems to have helped the Panthers FO fine-tune their analytical progress, and, at least on paper, they acquired players with a lot of value during the last draft in regards to actually (what I'll refer to as) "underdrafting" talent relative to their position with value already built in.  Look at Chris Brazzell: He may be more of the quintessential project receiver who was arguably more or less just as raw as Legette was when he was drafted, and with a relatively high RAS as well. The notable difference is value, as Brazzell was a round three pick and Legette was a first rounder.    "Unlike the Xavier Legette situation, Carolina’s environment for Brazzell is completely different. "The Panthers are not asking a raw receiver prospect to stabilize this offense for Bryce Young. "Brazzell enters a much healthier developmental situation with far less pressure. With Tetairoa McMillan established as the primary target and Jalen Coker continuing to settle as the number 2 option...Xavier Legette, Metchie III, and Jimmy Horn Jr. are also still in this rotation, fighting for reps. "It gives Carolina something they failed to give Legette when they drafted him: A developmental runway. "Xavier Legette entered the league with expectations attached to a first-round pick and an offense desperate for answers. Brazzell enters a room where he can spend a year working on his route running, learning the playbook, and earning snaps gradually rather than being asked to become part of Bryce Young’s solution immediately. "And truthfully, Brazzell needs that time coming out of college. Despite his elite physical tools, many evaluators have several concerns about his overall polish as a receiver. "His route tree at Tennessee was viewed as fairly limited due to the type of offense that they run. The receivers are expected to run a lot of choice routes, which are dictated by the placement of the defenders. It doesn’t require technical route-running and an understanding of the playbook needed at the NFL level...   "Context changes significantly when expectations change. "The Panthers are not depending on Brazzell to save the offense. They can allow him to develop slowly, expand his route tree, improve his technical refinement, and learn behind a much more stable receiver room... "Traits become much easier to bet on when patience is built into the plan."   It's all about understanding your situation. I don't agree that it's an inherently difficult choice like the author is suggesting in the following excerpt. At the very least, I think that it should be easier as long as all parties involved stay levelheaded and true to their process.    "That is what makes these draft decisions so difficult. "Every front office believes it can find the next Metcalf, Owens, or Marshall. Sometimes they do. More often, they are betting on a development path that may take years to complete. "The challenge is understanding what your offense needs right now. "If a team has patience, stability, and a quarterback capable of carrying the offense while a receiver develops, betting on traits can make sense. But if a young quarterback needs immediate help, there is a strong argument for prioritizing the receiver who already knows how to separate, create throwing , and earn trust from day one. "That’s why the Xavier Legette-Ladd McConkey debate remains so fascinating. "It was never really a discussion about talent. It was a discussion about timing."   For me, Ladd McConkey was talented enough in his own right, that the gap--the upside--was never as big as people are suggesting between not only McConkey and Legette, but McConkey and other receivers drafted in the first round during that draft. The technique divide between Ladd and X was pretty stark though, as was the roughly 35 pounds, but the speed was identical, the maybe 1½ height difference isn't huge (6' and 6'1"), and it may surprise some that Ladd's RAS (9.34) was also enough to put him in the top 10 percent of receivers since 1987. There is an argument that he would've been a better pick for Bryce and the Panthers, regardless of timeline and talent. But, I still appreciate the thesis (if you will) of the article, as it still provides some hope--perhaps a glimmer at this point, that X's RAS may finally translate to the NFL given more time, but, perhaps more importantly, it explains how Dan Morgan and company are showing improvement, even if it appears somewhat understated. My hope is that continued improvement is palpable by this time next year. https://lastwordonsports.com/nfl/2026/05/30/xavier-legette-draft-lessons/#google_vignette        
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