Luke -- 1st ballot HoF?

[Stingray3030]

9 hours ago, lumbeecheraw75 said:

that's a interesting list . Some random I pulled

 

Drew Brees

QB

2026

38

1.9

 

Cam Newton

QB

2027

17

1.55

 

Torry Holt (5x Finalist)

WR

2015

24

2.18

Reggie Wayne (5x Finalist)

WR

2020

17

1.21

Steve Smith Sr.

WR

2022

18

1.13

 

 

Greg Olsen

TE

2026

9

0.64

Kris Jenkins

NT

2016

17

1.7

Thomas Davis

OLB

2026

8

0.5

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here's a grenade for the thread - Cam and TD aren't HOF'ers - Cam might get in, but he shouldn't - so many QB's haven't gotten in that should be over him (Boomer, Phil Simms, Cunningham, McNair).  But as much as I love TD he really doesn't have the resume to get in.

Edited February 15 by Stingray3030

[CRA]

3 minutes ago, Stingray3030 said:

Here's a grenade for the thread - Cam and TD aren't HOF'ers - Cam might get in, but he shouldn't - so many QB's haven't gotten in that should be over him (Boomer, Phil Simms, Cunningham, McNair).  But as much as I love TD he really doesn't have the resume to get in.

Cam IMO deserves it.  Unicorn/impact IMO would be why I put him over and in. 

Will he actually get in?  Very doubtful.  The media has never fairly told the story of Cam Newton.   And there is no argument for him getting in without it acknowledged. 

[Khyber53]

Luke will be a first ballot and Smitty will continue to wait until the football monarchs decide he has paid his penance. Sucks but it is true. Cam will probably make first ballot (putting Smitty yet another year behind).

Thomas Davis will get in, but not on his first ballot, maybe like third or fourth. He's an amazing story and such longevity (and considering the dire circumstances he fought through), but outside of Carolina his notoriety just isn't as big. And that's a shame.

Greg. Dang, we all love him but let's be honest, he didn't have a HoF career. As Cris Collinsworth once said, if there was a Hall of the Really Good, he'd be there on the first ballot. He will, however, live on as one hell of a commentator I hope. 

Other Hall of the Really Good players we've had could include Moose, Ryan Kalil and Jordan Gross, Longevity, great games, just not the big names nationwide that get them to the real Hall.

 

[Stingray3030]

2 minutes ago, CRA said:

Cam IMO deserves it.  Unicorn/impact IMO would be why I put him over and in. 

Will he actually get in?  Very doubtful.  The media has never fairly told the story of Cam Newton.   And there is no argument for him getting in without it acknowledged. 

Unicorn does not qualify anyone for a HOF - that is a career-based honor for the best players of their generations.  A guy with only 3 Pro Bowls in 10 years, a losing post season record, no Super Bowl wins, 1 MVP & AP.  

I would also argue he isn't a unicorn - Michael Vick, RG3, Lamar Jackson?  Rare but not the only one...and it is clear that Lamar is >> Cam - and if he ended his career today he isn't a lock for the HOF....much more likely but not a lock

[CRA]

12 minutes ago, Stingray3030 said:

Unicorn does not qualify anyone for a HOF - that is a career-based honor for the best players of their generations.  A guy with only 3 Pro Bowls in 10 years, a losing post season record, no Super Bowl wins, 1 MVP & AP.  

I would also argue he isn't a unicorn - Michael Vick, RG3, Lamar Jackson?  Rare but not the only one...and it is clear that Lamar is >> Cam - and if he ended his career today he isn't a lock for the HOF....much more likely but not a lock

I mean, Cam is a unicorn as a runner in the NFL.   There has been no one else like him in modern history in terms of how he ran and the threat he presented to opposing defenses.

and in terms of impact, Cam IMO was the true start of the normalization of the college read option and the league moving to schemes that fit what college QBs do well.   

[Stingray3030]

1 minute ago, CRA said:

I mean, Cam is a unicorn as a runner in the NFL.   There has no one else like him in modern history in terms of how he ran and the threat he presented to opposing defenses.

and in terms of impact, Cam IMO was the true start of the normalization of the college read option and the league moving to schemes that fit what college QBs do well.   

I would completely disagree that Michael Vick and Lamar Jackson don't qualify as the same level of running threat as Cam.  But even if they were not there it still doesn't qualify for the HOF.  Who else exactly is running this read option offense with high success in the NFL that Cam supposedly kicked off?  From what I see they have tried to normalize it without much success - the best example again is Lamar but you said he isn't like Cam (even though he is clearly better).

[KillaCamNewton]

If Devin Hester is a HOFer Cam better be first ballot. Annoying that Eli will get in even though he was probably never even a top 10 QB during his career. But his defense held the greatest offense of all time to 14 points and he played in New York so im sure theyll put him in

[top dawg]

27 minutes ago, KillaCamNewton said:

If Devin Hester is a HOFer Cam better be first ballot. Annoying that Eli will get in even though he was probably never even a top 10 QB during his career. But his defense held the greatest offense of all time to 14 points and he played in New York so im sure theyll put him in

Hester was the best to ever do it at his position. Cam? Come on, man. 

[BrianS]

Here's how PFR (not PFF) sees it:

 

One of the top 5 ILB of all time . . . you gotta put him in 1st ballot.  Surely.

[CRA]

2 hours ago, Stingray3030 said:

I would completely disagree that Michael Vick and Lamar Jackson don't qualify as the same level of running threat as Cam.  But even if they were not there it still doesn't qualify for the HOF.  Who else exactly is running this read option offense with high success in the NFL that Cam supposedly kicked off?  From what I see they have tried to normalize it without much success - the best example again is Lamar but you said he isn't like Cam (even though he is clearly better).

Vick and Cam Newton present 2 completely different threats to an opposing defense.    They aren't comparable players.  They are very different problems to solve for a D.  Cam is a unicorn in terms of how he ran, how he was used, and what it took to stop it.   

it's not just the read option.  It's the RPO and the complete normalization of the college football schemes and play into the NFL.  NFL teams finally embracing building around the college player vs trying to recreate them into dudes that fit existing pro systems.  Cam was really the lead in that regard IMO.   And the media, almost from the jump wanted to start crediting everyone that followed him for swaying the NFL in that direction. 

[Aussie Tank]

The only thing that would keep him out is he was a career Carolina Panther. 

[BIGH2001]

I don’t think Cam is a HOFer. He had one really amazing year but had a relatively short career for a franchise QB due to injuries. Not winning  super bowl also hurts his chances. 

[electro's horse]

Good lord yes Luke is a first ballot hof’er. Only reason he wasn’t all pro his first year is he didn’t start at MLB immediately. 

Cam, sadly, is not. He needed that Super Bowl win. Yeah he revolutionized the position but that’s a narrative argument and the same voters that acknowledge that will remember him more for not jumping on the fumble. Not saying I agree with that  

None of us would say Russell Wilson is a hall of famer even though he (was on a team that) won a Super Bowl and has arguably better stats than cam.  

TD, Greg - Hall of Very Good. Greg just didn’t have a long enough run.

I think Smith gets in eventually  

All this is making me think of my second favorite panthers what if: beason realizes how good Luke is and accepts a move to WLB. 

Edited February 16 by electro's horse

[KillerKat]

He has the same number of All-pro selections as Jack Lambert at 7. He has more than Willis, who has 6. He has the stats to back it up too. He most certainly is a first ballot HOFer.